cattle dog and kelpie x ?

[Uim 0]

I don't think the majority of the lurcher boys today would be interested in anything like Jake chalkie. Not enough bull,lol.

Anyway i posted a few pictures of a dog sired by Okara Max earlier on in this thread at the time i was using the name Sheamus.

Some good news the dogs still with us just about come close to strangling the big eared fecker a few times though..

He`s just over 14 month old and physically a solid powerful dog. Agility wise you wont get better and he`s as responsive as a well trained woman,lol.

But mentally he`s tapped and i would liken him to a troublesome earth dog that need to see some action if you know what i mean

Here`s the little bustard backing sheep a month or so ago.

Would i consider him the start of my dynasty ??

Maybe??

 

 

Edited December 10, 2009 by Uim

[Endgame 68]

THANKS FIREMAN & I HOPE U GET WHAT U WANT.THERE ARE FAR 2 MANY SLIP LEAD DOGS & NOT ENOUGH PEOPLE CAPABLE OF TRAINING A TRADITIONAL WORKING LURCHER THESE DAYS. THE ACD WAS RECOGNISED AS A BREED IN AUSTRALIA IN 1903,THE BREED STANDARD WAS DRAWN UP BY ROBERT KALESKI IN 1897. KALESKI WROTE THE BOOK, BARKERS & BITERS, IN WHICH HE STATED ON ACD,s "THEY DO NOT WANT TO GO HUNTING AT ALL.". JOHN & MARY HOLMES IN THEIR BOOK/ THE COMPLETE AUSTRALIAN CATTLE / STATED THAT HAD THEY NOT OWNED ACD,s THEY WOULD NOT HAVE BELIEVED THIS & STATE THEY "HAVE NEVER OWNED(an ACD)THAT WAS A TRUE HUNTER. FINDING THAT FM EXPERIENCE & FM OTHERS THAT ACD,s HAD A NATURAL TENDENCY 2 STAY WITH THEIR OWNER INSTEAD. THIS I CERTAINLY FOUND THE CASE IN MY EXPERIENCE. HOWEVER FIREMAN IT MAY BE THE ADDITION OF SIGHTHOUND BLOOD IGNITES THE HUNTING INSTINCT?? THERE ARE ALWAYS EXCEPTIONS 2 ANY RULE. ANYWAY FIREMAN, AFTER TALKING ABOUT MY LOVE OF A TRADITIONAL LURCHER,IAM AWAY 2 GO SLIPLEAD HUNTING WIF MY LAMP(HYPOCRITE OR [bANNED TEXT]?) GOOD LUCK IN UR SEARCH FIREMAN.

 

Engame I find this to be a very interesting coment and one that may have been made by someone that was use to hounds. As the opersite has been my experance in both a working and hunting capacities, as a young man i spent many a day on horse back retrieving semi wild cattle from the bulahdela mounting ranges. Without the natural hunting ability of the cattle dogs many bullocks and steers would have been missed as they hid in the lantana and tea tree chocked gullies and valleys of these mountain ranges. It was common to be able to sit at the bottom of the places and cast the dogs with the command "go way back" The dogs would make their way to the head of the gully then hunt the cattle back to us using that famous cattle dog bit to move even the most stubborn of bullocks.

 

Later on in life I renewed a friendship from years earlier my mate Brett kept australian cattle dogs and used them to hunt hare , fox and rabbit weather hunting with a shot gun over his dogs or running them with my dogs we acounted for many many hares ,fox and rabbit as well as the odd wallaby or two. Bretts dogs due to the work he gave them or the type he kept were never the stout type but were up on their legs and fit as a fiddle. He did not work them on cattle but the pups he breed were well sort after by men who still run cattle on the rangers.

 

Unfortunately those days are gone and brett has past on, but I have my memories of all those great days in the feild.

 

Stevemac

STEVEMAC U OBVIOUSLY HAVE FAR MORE EXPERIENCE THAN I OFF THE ACD IN A WORKING ENVIROMENT. I CAN ONLY STATE WHAT MY OWN RESEARCH SHOWED FROM KALESKI & THE HOLMES & FM OWNERS OF ACD,s IN THIS COUNTRY MATE.OWNING & TRAINING AN ACD ONLY SHOWED 2 ME THAT THEY WERE NOT FOR ME & AS CHALKWARREN SAYS THEY APPEALED 2 A SMALL MINORITY & 2 ME THIS SPEAKS FOR ITSELF. SOME PEOPLE FOUND THEY SUITED THEM,SOME DID NOT. THEY NEVER DID BECOME POPULAR,YET AS FAR AS TRADITIONAL LURCHERS GO ONE ONLY HAS 2 LOOK AT THE AMOUNT OF ADVERTS 4 COLLIE OR BEDLINGTON CROSSES THAT ARE OFFERED AS OPPOSED 2 OTHER BREEDS. WILDROVER, SIMON DIXON DID NOT STRIKE ME AS A MAN WHO WOULD HAVE ALLOWED HIS PUPS 2 GO 2 JUST ANYONE & I,D VENTURE 2 SAY THEY ONLY WENT 2 DECENT WORKING DOGMEN. THIS GOES A LONG WAY 2 ENSURING SUBSEQUENT SUCCESS OF ANY LITTER WILDROVER. PEOPLE WHO BREED ACD CROSSES ARE RARE. THAT AS WE KNOW IS FACT & FOR MY PART THAT SPEAKS 4 ITSELF.IT TAKES A CERTAIN & TRUE DOGMAN 2 GET THE BEST FM THIS BREEDING*(HOWEVER THERE ALWAYS EXCEPTIONS 2 HOW HARD HANDLING ANY DOG IS)& IM GENUINELY GLAD THERE ARE STILL LADS OUT THERE WORKING & ENJOYING THIS CROSS.HOWEVER 2 ANYONE WHO HAS EXPERIENCE OF AN ACD CROSS & THEIR LOYALTY ETC THAT THEY SHOW 4 ME PERSONALLY IM DELIGHTED THEY NEVER BECAME POPULAR 2 BE SWOPPED & TRADED LIKE SO MANY LURCHERS. AN ACD OR ACD LURCHER IS 4 LIFE NOT JUST 4 CHRISTMAS.GOOD LUCK & HUNTING 2 U ALL IN 2010,yours in sport.ENDGAME.

[MagyarAgar 88]

 

 

What a good looking dog that is.

 

Magyar Agar

[whin 463]

saw jake work at feild trails years ago and owner a nice dog and very simliar in work ethic to m chapmns bob he was a serous dog , god dog to breed into lurchers ,he was sharp to , but aloyal type of dog if my memory is [bANNED TEXT]

[MIKE 18]

You can see Jake working in that DVD that's out Chalkwarren, I think it's called Rabbiting Day's it's done by the same fella that did the Foxing one by day with the collie cross lurchers.

Mike

[stevemac 434]

[

STEVEMAC U OBVIOUSLY HAVE FAR MORE EXPERIENCE THAN I OFF THE ACD IN A WORKING ENVIROMENT. I CAN ONLY STATE WHAT MY OWN RESEARCH SHOWED FROM KALESKI & THE HOLMES & FM OWNERS OF ACD,s IN THIS COUNTRY MATE.OWNING & TRAINING AN ACD ONLY SHOWED 2 ME THAT THEY WERE NOT FOR ME & AS CHALKWARREN SAYS THEY APPEALED 2 A SMALL MINORITY & 2 ME THIS SPEAKS FOR ITSELF. SOME PEOPLE FOUND THEY SUITED THEM,SOME DID NOT. THEY NEVER DID BECOME POPULAR,YET AS FAR AS TRADITIONAL LURCHERS GO ONE ONLY HAS 2 LOOK AT THE AMOUNT OF ADVERTS 4 COLLIE OR BEDLINGTON CROSSES THAT ARE OFFERED AS OPPOSED 2 OTHER BREEDS. WILDROVER, SIMON DIXON DID NOT STRIKE ME AS A MAN WHO WOULD HAVE ALLOWED HIS PUPS 2 GO 2 JUST ANYONE & I,D VENTURE 2 SAY THEY ONLY WENT 2 DECENT WORKING DOGMEN. THIS GOES A LONG WAY 2 ENSURING SUBSEQUENT SUCCESS OF ANY LITTER WILDROVER. PEOPLE WHO BREED ACD CROSSES ARE RARE. THAT AS WE KNOW IS FACT & FOR MY PART THAT SPEAKS 4 ITSELF.IT TAKES A CERTAIN & TRUE DOGMAN 2 GET THE BEST FM THIS BREEDING*(HOWEVER THERE ALWAYS EXCEPTIONS 2 HOW HARD HANDLING ANY DOG IS)& IM GENUINELY GLAD THERE ARE STILL LADS OUT THERE WORKING & ENJOYING THIS CROSS.HOWEVER 2 ANYONE WHO HAS EXPERIENCE OF AN ACD CROSS & THEIR LOYALTY ETC THAT THEY SHOW 4 ME PERSONALLY IM DELIGHTED THEY NEVER BECAME POPULAR 2 BE SWOPPED & TRADED LIKE SO MANY LURCHERS. AN ACD OR ACD LURCHER IS 4 LIFE NOT JUST 4 CHRISTMAS.GOOD LUCK & HUNTING 2 U ALL IN 2010,yours in sport.ENDGAME.

 

No offence ment mate just trying to show what the cattle dog is like in its native country. Now days the softer working kelpie or boarder collie are favoured by cattle men as they run very domesticated stock and dont have the need of a hard bitting dog though some kelpies bred for cattle work can put on a decent bite.

 

when I was a young lad cattle dogs kelpies and boarder collies and crosses there of were a dime a dozen every where when ever I got to gether ther would always be a couple of the above following us around and some times keeping us out of trouble especially where snakes were concerned.

Edited December 10, 2009 by stevemac

[Neal 1,869]

Have recently heard from the girlfriend of a guy in Holland who uses patterdales among other things for hunting boar, fox and badger. She herself has a kelpie sired by Okara Max (ie same sire as your dog Vim) which accompanies them on hunting days as well as following various other disciplines. I'll be emailing him this weekend and will try to find out more.

 

Vim, Your kelpie sounds very similar in temperament to my two year old, Scout. Whereas Amber is more collie-like (for want of a much more appropriate phrase) Scout is very full on. She reminds me more of what I'd expect from a terrier x whippet. She can be a bloody nightmare hunting through thick woodland, which there's a lot of here in The Forest of Bere. She'll try to go to ground then trench on and I have to listen out for the sound of digging, or grunting and snarling if she's found a tree root in the way, in order to locate her. To sum her up I'd say she's like the girl in the old nursery rhyme: when she was good she was very very good but when she was bad she was horrid. I'd be the first to admit that my experience of terriers is very limited but I'd say that the difference is that at least when I've finally found her all I have to do is say, "Good lass, that'll do," a couple of times rather than physically dragging her away.

 

To be fair to her I'm well aware that most of her faults are possibly my fault as due to her being the youngest member of the pack and so tiny I tend to still think of her as the pup and let her get away with things. I also tend to give the kelpies more free rein than I did with previous dogs as I've found that works best with them; something I learnt from my last lurcher who was 1/4 kelpie.

 

A question for Vim, Mike and D.C.: what height are your kelpies? The reason I ask is because mine are generally on the short side for UK kelpies (Rust is about 19", Amber's a shade taller and Scout's just over 17") but I'm finding that their working potential is in direct contrast to their height ie the smaller the better. That's probably just because most of my hunting is in either very small fields or the hedges and dense woods which link them. As I've said before, they rarely catch in the open but I get more cover catches than I ever did with any of my lurchers.

[comanche 3,025]

All this talk of ACd ,heelers or whatever made me dig out a few photos .

They go back a few years .

The cattle dog cross came from a guy in South Godstone Surrey and I always wondered what happened to the rest of the litter as I did'nt see any around and people had a tendency to come up to me at shows and seemed surprised that I still had my bitch ,let alone seemed quite attached to her , as if they knew something I did'nt about the bloodline .

I have to say she was the most intelligent ,versatile ,obedient and affectionate dog I've ever owned . She thrived on work and obedience training ..but a few of her off-duty antics made me suspect that some of her ancestors might have spent time herding cattle in the Botany Bay area!

 

As some one once said to me, "F*** me "Comanche" . Only a weirdo like you could live with a dog like that for so long and still love it !".

 

cattledog pup.bmpcattle dog molly.bmpcattle dog jumping on shed.bmpcattle dog fen molly kelly.bmp

 

[b]So while there are people on here with a bit more knowledge about the breed in this country does anyone remember or did they have a pup from a litter from S Godstone Surrey area ..maybe 15+ years ago? Notes could be compared !.

 

I bred OZZIE,..the Sire of your pup,....and Comanche,..he was a right fecking handful,.in fact,.everything about him was fecking EMOTIONAL....

 

Honest old Jukel though...

 

All the best,.CW...

Thanks for the reply CW. I think Ozzie must have past-on some of his more interesting characteristics to Ezzie (that's weird because I did'nt know the name of her sire until now !).Took a while for her to realise that rabbits were for retrieving not swallowing whole on the spot like a bl**din python. . For the first year or so of ownership she'd nail one of my chickens about once a month . Usually when I was in the loo or on the phone . Never more than one and only when she knew I was otherwise engaged .Then there were the numerous freezer ,bread bin and similar incidents .Everything from two pound frozen trout to multiple loaves of bread complete with plastic bags . Child locks on the freezer remained a challenge for all of ten seconds . I ended up with a chain round the door.

The disappearance of the Sunday roast was a spectacular bit of thievery-especially as it was still in the oven cooking at the time ! Cast iron stomach. She'd chew-up plates -even clean ones on the draining board and bend knives and forks like Uri Geller just because she could .These are but a few of her more repeatable escapades!. She knew it it was naughty, just could'nt help herself and always came up to me with a grin on her face and a tail like a windmill. Little cow that she was all her life she was technically the best working dog I've owned but her funny little ways when off-duty meant that she never made it as my dog of a lifetime ..

It really was as if she had a devil on one shoulder and an angel on the other .Or should that be a dingo on one shoulder and an angel on the other ?

Would I have the cross again ? In a survival situation yes but in rural Sussex I think I'd like one from a quieter strain or a bit of collie blood in the mix .

Thanks for the info CW

Edited December 11, 2009 by comanche

[Endgame 68]

No offence ment mate just trying to show what the cattle dog is like in its native country. Now days the softer working kelpie or boarder collie are favoured by cattle men as they run very domesticated stock and dont have the need of a hard bitting dog though some kelpies bred for cattle work can put on a decent bite.

 

when I was a young lad cattle dogs kelpies and boarder collies and crosses there of were a dime a dozen every where when ever I got to gether ther would always be a couple of the above following us around and some times keeping us out of trouble especially where snakes were concerned.

NO OFFENCE TAKEN MATE/ U HAVE UR VIEWS & I HAVE MINE.LIFE WOULD BE DULL IF WE ALL THOUGHT ALIKE. THIS THREAD MUST HOLD A RECORD ON THIS WEBSITE/ 17 PAGES & NEARLY 11,000 VIEWINGS, YET WEVE MANAGED 2 KEEP IT MAINLY CONSTRUCTIVE & KEPT OUR DEBATE CIVIL TOWARDS EACH OTHER. PROVES THERES ROOM 4 US ALL IN THIS GAME. CHALKWARREN I MAY BE MISTAKEN BUT IS JAKE NOT BRED FROM YOUR ACD X GREYHOUND BITCH. YOUR BITCH BEING ONE OF THE MOST PHOTOGRAPHED LURCHERS AROUND IN HER DAY?

Edited December 11, 2009 by CHALKWARREN

[breeze 1,308]

Commanche ..... Great write up of your bitch mate Don't ya just love um

 

Besides that good thread to read this one fella's .... Certainly make's a refreshing change, Well done lad's

[fireman 10,917]

Made me chuckle that write up Comanche,the acd dam of the pups i reared was a bit the same.She lived out and had the run of my garden being around my chooks and ferret court with no problem until the pups arrived,then she'd bite at the ferret court wire let them out and then find great plessure in joining in with them on a raid into my chook run .When the pups were up and about and put into a run she'd take it as her daily project to chew holes in the shed wall and let the pups out,not her she'd sit there like butter wouldn't melt almost saying "puppies eh ",She had a sly streak with anything she did wrong to pass the blame onto the pups and if you caught her out of the window you'd see her looking to see if anyone was watching then cause kaos and almost push the pups out of the box to take the blame for it.A better mum i've never seen though and she'd not eat until the pups had,mind she'd leave nothing for later sort of thing.CW recon valium sales would go up if more were to own this type of dog and thats why they never will be for everyone but once you've made it through with one they do hold that little something over you,testers of your sanity at times but never dull days thats for sure.Again well done folks for a belter of a thread .

[colliejohn 840]

I must say what a cracking thread this is, welldone to all of those who have shared their experiences on these crosses, welldone lads. regards collie john.

[MagyarAgar 88]

I´m curious on reading those good posts about those experiences

 

Magyar Agar

[wild rover 548]

Chalkwarren from your posts do I detect there may be a book on the way !!! Hope so.

[ASME IX 1]

chalkwarren is the dog on the left out the same litter as speckle?

 

asme9