Buzzards!!!

[steviebhoy 0]

I wouldn't agree with a cull of buzzards up here theyve only began to get a small foothold after years of persecution, reducing numbers for the sake of a few fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves couple of times a year is wrong thats why a number of our native birds of prey are in decline. Maybe if the farmers and their cohorts stopped poisoning and inflicting disease on the rabbit population there would be enough food to go round. Theres probably more game birds killed on roads than took by raptors. No doubt I will get my balls rattled for this so I'm assuming the position as I type.

Thats because you know your talking shite.

 

 

Hey you asked , if you wanted only folk who would agree with you you shouldn't have asked for an opinion....In think malt called it right about you mate.

Cant speak for Maltenby mate but i thought that our discussion went well and both of us got our points over pretty evenly. You obviously have a problem with commercial pheasant shooting as you discribe as "fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves"? Just annoys me when some on here thinks they can put down another persons sport just because its not for them. I dont run dogs but by your picture i suppose you do and hope you enjoy it?

No matter what food source you say for the Buzzard there is none stupider than the 7/8 week old pheasant and no buzzard is going to hunt a rabbit when they are so easy to catch.

I agree there are a large number of birds killed on the roads today[this again highlights there stupidity] but no where near the numbers that birds of prey could do if they were left to there own devices.

You are correct i did put this topic up for peoples opinions and am glad i am getting them and it looks as if the hunting people cant agree on an issue such as this then we are doomed for any kind of culling law.

[zig zag wanderer 0]

I'm sure gamekeepers are often under a lot of pressure to deliver but I don't believe that any raptors have a significant impact on pheasant numbers. I work in pest control and also have to abide by the laws. Many species of mammal and bird are protected, others are legitimate pests. Often the rules change and a species receives protection and other times the protection is relaxed and we are allowed to control. The only change I would personally make is to relax the protection on Badgers because I believe the evidence of their spread of BTB is undeniable (in my opinion - and several vets that I have spoken to).

 

Historically rapators have been "controlled" by gamekeepers for centuries and the results for the Red Kite, Sea Eagle, Golden Eagle, Osprey, Goshawk etc is clear for all to see (or not to see).

 

My views on the matter are, that the countyside as we know it exists today, due to the way man has manipulated it for hundreds of years.

 

It is not a natural environment, it exists as it is today, because of the way that man has looked after it, be it for shooting, farming, whatever. The population of predators, is therefore linked to man's use of the land.

These numbers need to be kept in check, because they are in an environment that they haven't evolved to live in.

 

There's a fine line between persecution & control, and a fine balance should be maintained, to ensure that the population remains at a constant.

 

I agree with a lot of that. Man is at the top of the evolutionary tree and the food chain and has a right to control all species below him (subject to the law - which he also controls)

 

It is a natural environment and we are part of that environment. There are many predators but not many that predate on man's food. Foxes and corvids are probably worse than the raptors. The Buzzards are generally regarded as lazy predators and although they are very numerous I would argue they are of limited impact. Thankfully their diets are mainly invertebates, amphibians and carion. If they mainly fed on game birds then it might be different.

[undisputed 1,664]

I wouldn't agree with a cull of buzzards up here theyve only began to get a small foothold after years of persecution, reducing numbers for the sake of a few fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves couple of times a year is wrong thats why a number of our native birds of prey are in decline. Maybe if the farmers and their cohorts stopped poisoning and inflicting disease on the rabbit population there would be enough food to go round. Theres probably more game birds killed on roads than took by raptors. No doubt I will get my balls rattled for this so I'm assuming the position as I type.

Thats because you know your talking shite.

 

 

Hey you asked , if you wanted only folk who would agree with you you shouldn't have asked for an opinion....In think malt called it right about you mate.

Cant speak for Maltenby mate but i thought that our discussion went well and both of us got our points over pretty evenly. You obviously have a problem with commercial pheasant shooting as you discribe as "fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves"? Just annoys me when some on here thinks they can put down another persons sport just because its not for them. I dont run dogs but by your picture i suppose you do and hope you enjoy it?

No matter what food source you say for the Buzzard there is none stupider than the 7/8 week old pheasant and no buzzard is going to hunt a rabbit when they are so easy to catch.

I agree there are a large number of birds killed on the roads today[this again highlights there stupidity] but no where near the numbers that birds of prey could do if they were left to there own devices.

You are correct i did put this topic up for peoples opinions and am glad i am getting them and it looks as if the hunting people cant agree on an issue such as this then we are doomed for any kind of culling law.

 

 

 

I dont have a problem with anyone enjoying their sport and I know some keepers jobs depend on maintaining their live stock. What I do have an issue with is culling a species to the point of near extinction for the sake of a pass time. there needs to be a balance struck and not one thats done for purely commercial reasons. There must be more sensible options that can be explored.

[steviebhoy 0]

I wouldn't agree with a cull of buzzards up here theyve only began to get a small foothold after years of persecution, reducing numbers for the sake of a few fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves couple of times a year is wrong thats why a number of our native birds of prey are in decline. Maybe if the farmers and their cohorts stopped poisoning and inflicting disease on the rabbit population there would be enough food to go round. Theres probably more game birds killed on roads than took by raptors. No doubt I will get my balls rattled for this so I'm assuming the position as I type.

Thats because you know your talking shite.

 

 

Hey you asked , if you wanted only folk who would agree with you you shouldn't have asked for an opinion....In think malt called it right about you mate.

Cant speak for Maltenby mate but i thought that our discussion went well and both of us got our points over pretty evenly. You obviously have a problem with commercial pheasant shooting as you discribe as "fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves"? Just annoys me when some on here thinks they can put down another persons sport just because its not for them. I dont run dogs but by your picture i suppose you do and hope you enjoy it?

No matter what food source you say for the Buzzard there is none stupider than the 7/8 week old pheasant and no buzzard is going to hunt a rabbit when they are so easy to catch.

I agree there are a large number of birds killed on the roads today[this again highlights there stupidity] but no where near the numbers that birds of prey could do if they were left to there own devices.

You are correct i did put this topic up for peoples opinions and am glad i am getting them and it looks as if the hunting people cant agree on an issue such as this then we are doomed for any kind of culling law.

 

 

 

I dont have a problem with anyone enjoying their sport and I know some keepers jobs depend on maintaining their live stock. What I do have an issue with is culling a species to the point of near extinction for the sake of a pass time. there needs to be a balance struck and not one thats done for purely commercial reasons. There must be more sensible options that can be explored.

I would say that it is much more than just a pass time and more off a multi-million pound industry thats helps produce thousands of jobs up and down the country and in my eyes should do so well into our future. As i have stated already eradication is not the answer and yes there is a fine line between that and control but hopefully 1 that can be sorted in favour for both.

[steviebhoy 0]

I'm sure gamekeepers are often under a lot of pressure to deliver but I don't believe that any raptors have a significant impact on pheasant numbers. I work in pest control and also have to abide by the laws. Many species of mammal and bird are protected, others are legitimate pests. Often the rules change and a species receives protection and other times the protection is relaxed and we are allowed to control. The only change I would personally make is to relax the protection on Badgers because I believe the evidence of their spread of BTB is undeniable (in my opinion - and several vets that I have spoken to).

 

Historically rapators have been "controlled" by gamekeepers for centuries and the results for the Red Kite, Sea Eagle, Golden Eagle, Osprey, Goshawk etc is clear for all to see (or not to see).

 

My views on the matter are, that the countyside as we know it exists today, due to the way man has manipulated it for hundreds of years.

 

It is not a natural environment, it exists as it is today, because of the way that man has looked after it, be it for shooting, farming, whatever. The population of predators, is therefore linked to man's use of the land.

These numbers need to be kept in check, because they are in an environment that they haven't evolved to live in.

 

There's a fine line between persecution & control, and a fine balance should be maintained, to ensure that the population remains at a constant.

 

I agree with a lot of that. Man is at the top of the evolutionary tree and the food chain and has a right to control all species below him (subject to the law - which he also controls)

 

It is a natural environment and we are part of that environment. There are many predators but not many that predate on man's food. Foxes and corvids are probably worse than the raptors. The Buzzards are generally regarded as lazy predators and although they are very numerous I would argue they are of limited impact. Thankfully their diets are mainly invertebates, amphibians and carion. If they mainly fed on game birds then it might be different.

Maybe you wil never fully know the damage 1 of these birds can do unless you walk in the shoes of a keeper............who knows? It seems to me that you will always underestimate the carnage that they can cause and will believe that the keepers stories of mass bird loses are something of a fairytale.

To be honest i never expect there to be a cull because so many people love to see this bird flying high in the sky and not have it have any impact on them or there lifestyle. For me then i hope the buzzard grows to be twice as big and twice as strong so local cats and small dogs are on the menu.......we would soon see a change then!

[undisputed 1,664]

I wouldn't agree with a cull of buzzards up here theyve only began to get a small foothold after years of persecution, reducing numbers for the sake of a few fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves couple of times a year is wrong thats why a number of our native birds of prey are in decline. Maybe if the farmers and their cohorts stopped poisoning and inflicting disease on the rabbit population there would be enough food to go round. Theres probably more game birds killed on roads than took by raptors. No doubt I will get my balls rattled for this so I'm assuming the position as I type.

Thats because you know your talking shite.

 

 

Hey you asked , if you wanted only folk who would agree with you you shouldn't have asked for an opinion....In think malt called it right about you mate.

Cant speak for Maltenby mate but i thought that our discussion went well and both of us got our points over pretty evenly. You obviously have a problem with commercial pheasant shooting as you discribe as "fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves"? Just annoys me when some on here thinks they can put down another persons sport just because its not for them. I dont run dogs but by your picture i suppose you do and hope you enjoy it?

No matter what food source you say for the Buzzard there is none stupider than the 7/8 week old pheasant and no buzzard is going to hunt a rabbit when they are so easy to catch.

I agree there are a large number of birds killed on the roads today[this again highlights there stupidity] but no where near the numbers that birds of prey could do if they were left to there own devices.

You are correct i did put this topic up for peoples opinions and am glad i am getting them and it looks as if the hunting people cant agree on an issue such as this then we are doomed for any kind of culling law.

 

 

 

I dont have a problem with anyone enjoying their sport and I know some keepers jobs depend on maintaining their live stock. What I do have an issue with is culling a species to the point of near extinction for the sake of a pass time. there needs to be a balance struck and not one thats done for purely commercial reasons. There must be more sensible options that can be explored.

I would say that it is much more than just a pass time and more off a multi-million pound industry thats helps produce thousands of jobs up and down the country and in my eyes should do so well into our future. As i have stated already eradication is not the answer and yes there is a fine line between that and control but hopefully 1 that can be sorted in favour for both.

 

 

When I said pass time I was referring to the shooters not the workers. Thats my point when a commercial interest competes against a native species you get unscrupulous owners who will go to any length to protect their interests. Inevitably something has to give.

[zig zag wanderer 0]

So Steviebhoy, if you could have your way and NE agreed with you and put the Buzzard on Schedule 2 of the W&CA, how would this cull work and who would carry it out using what methods?

[steviebhoy 0]

I wouldn't agree with a cull of buzzards up here theyve only began to get a small foothold after years of persecution, reducing numbers for the sake of a few fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves couple of times a year is wrong thats why a number of our native birds of prey are in decline. Maybe if the farmers and their cohorts stopped poisoning and inflicting disease on the rabbit population there would be enough food to go round. Theres probably more game birds killed on roads than took by raptors. No doubt I will get my balls rattled for this so I'm assuming the position as I type.

Thats because you know your talking shite.

 

 

Hey you asked , if you wanted only folk who would agree with you you shouldn't have asked for an opinion....In think malt called it right about you mate.

Cant speak for Maltenby mate but i thought that our discussion went well and both of us got our points over pretty evenly. You obviously have a problem with commercial pheasant shooting as you discribe as "fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves"? Just annoys me when some on here thinks they can put down another persons sport just because its not for them. I dont run dogs but by your picture i suppose you do and hope you enjoy it?

No matter what food source you say for the Buzzard there is none stupider than the 7/8 week old pheasant and no buzzard is going to hunt a rabbit when they are so easy to catch.

I agree there are a large number of birds killed on the roads today[this again highlights there stupidity] but no where near the numbers that birds of prey could do if they were left to there own devices.

You are correct i did put this topic up for peoples opinions and am glad i am getting them and it looks as if the hunting people cant agree on an issue such as this then we are doomed for any kind of culling law.

 

 

 

I dont have a problem with anyone enjoying their sport and I know some keepers jobs depend on maintaining their live stock. What I do have an issue with is culling a species to the point of near extinction for the sake of a pass time. there needs to be a balance struck and not one thats done for purely commercial reasons. There must be more sensible options that can be explored.

I would say that it is much more than just a pass time and more off a multi-million pound industry thats helps produce thousands of jobs up and down the country and in my eyes should do so well into our future. As i have stated already eradication is not the answer and yes there is a fine line between that and control but hopefully 1 that can be sorted in favour for both.

 

 

When I said pass time I was referring to the shooters not the workers. Thats my point when a commercial interest competes against a native species you get unscrupulous owners who will go to any length to protect their interests. Inevitably something has to give.

Well i think that should be the buzzards and you think it should be the "fat men with tweeds"

Good debate though cheers

[undisputed 1,664]

I wouldn't agree with a cull of buzzards up here theyve only began to get a small foothold after years of persecution, reducing numbers for the sake of a few fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves couple of times a year is wrong thats why a number of our native birds of prey are in decline. Maybe if the farmers and their cohorts stopped poisoning and inflicting disease on the rabbit population there would be enough food to go round. Theres probably more game birds killed on roads than took by raptors. No doubt I will get my balls rattled for this so I'm assuming the position as I type.

Thats because you know your talking shite.

 

 

Hey you asked , if you wanted only folk who would agree with you you shouldn't have asked for an opinion....In think malt called it right about you mate.

Cant speak for Maltenby mate but i thought that our discussion went well and both of us got our points over pretty evenly. You obviously have a problem with commercial pheasant shooting as you discribe as "fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves"? Just annoys me when some on here thinks they can put down another persons sport just because its not for them. I dont run dogs but by your picture i suppose you do and hope you enjoy it?

No matter what food source you say for the Buzzard there is none stupider than the 7/8 week old pheasant and no buzzard is going to hunt a rabbit when they are so easy to catch.

I agree there are a large number of birds killed on the roads today[this again highlights there stupidity] but no where near the numbers that birds of prey could do if they were left to there own devices.

You are correct i did put this topic up for peoples opinions and am glad i am getting them and it looks as if the hunting people cant agree on an issue such as this then we are doomed for any kind of culling law.

 

 

 

I dont have a problem with anyone enjoying their sport and I know some keepers jobs depend on maintaining their live stock. What I do have an issue with is culling a species to the point of near extinction for the sake of a pass time. there needs to be a balance struck and not one thats done for purely commercial reasons. There must be more sensible options that can be explored.

I would say that it is much more than just a pass time and more off a multi-million pound industry thats helps produce thousands of jobs up and down the country and in my eyes should do so well into our future. As i have stated already eradication is not the answer and yes there is a fine line between that and control but hopefully 1 that can be sorted in favour for both.

 

 

When I said pass time I was referring to the shooters not the workers. Thats my point when a commercial interest competes against a native species you get unscrupulous owners who will go to any length to protect their interests. Inevitably something has to give.

Well i think that should be the buzzards and you think it should be the "fat men with tweeds"

Good debate though cheers

 

 

Maybe we could meet in the middle it could be quite lucrative hunting fat guys in tweeds :D

[steviebhoy 0]

So Steviebhoy, if you could have your way and NE agreed with you and put the Buzzard on Schedule 2 of the W&CA, how would this cull work and who would carry it out using what methods?

Well thats a tough 1 and am sure whatever i say will have a negative effect in some way but it would have to go along the lines of 2 maybe 3months of possibly shooting any buzzards that are causing poult deaths. I think the keeper of the estate or whoever runs the shoot should be able to cull any numbers of destructive birds that he sees killing poults.

Once the pheasants get a chance to settle in and know there surroundings they are more equiped to look after themselves and this is why a 2/3 month period should be fine. Then if anybody caught killing any birds of prey outside this time a hard sentence can be applied and they can only have themselves to blame.

Am sure you can see what i mean by this but its a massive subject that needs to be addressed

[steviebhoy 0]

I wouldn't agree with a cull of buzzards up here theyve only began to get a small foothold after years of persecution, reducing numbers for the sake of a few fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves couple of times a year is wrong thats why a number of our native birds of prey are in decline. Maybe if the farmers and their cohorts stopped poisoning and inflicting disease on the rabbit population there would be enough food to go round. Theres probably more game birds killed on roads than took by raptors. No doubt I will get my balls rattled for this so I'm assuming the position as I type.

Thats because you know your talking shite.

 

 

Hey you asked , if you wanted only folk who would agree with you you shouldn't have asked for an opinion....In think malt called it right about you mate.

Cant speak for Maltenby mate but i thought that our discussion went well and both of us got our points over pretty evenly. You obviously have a problem with commercial pheasant shooting as you discribe as "fat guys in tweeds blasting anything that moves"? Just annoys me when some on here thinks they can put down another persons sport just because its not for them. I dont run dogs but by your picture i suppose you do and hope you enjoy it?

No matter what food source you say for the Buzzard there is none stupider than the 7/8 week old pheasant and no buzzard is going to hunt a rabbit when they are so easy to catch.

I agree there are a large number of birds killed on the roads today[this again highlights there stupidity] but no where near the numbers that birds of prey could do if they were left to there own devices.

You are correct i did put this topic up for peoples opinions and am glad i am getting them and it looks as if the hunting people cant agree on an issue such as this then we are doomed for any kind of culling law.

 

 

 

I dont have a problem with anyone enjoying their sport and I know some keepers jobs depend on maintaining their live stock. What I do have an issue with is culling a species to the point of near extinction for the sake of a pass time. there needs to be a balance struck and not one thats done for purely commercial reasons. There must be more sensible options that can be explored.

I would say that it is much more than just a pass time and more off a multi-million pound industry thats helps produce thousands of jobs up and down the country and in my eyes should do so well into our future. As i have stated already eradication is not the answer and yes there is a fine line between that and control but hopefully 1 that can be sorted in favour for both.

 

 

When I said pass time I was referring to the shooters not the workers. Thats my point when a commercial interest competes against a native species you get unscrupulous owners who will go to any length to protect their interests. Inevitably something has to give.

Well i think that should be the buzzards and you think it should be the "fat men with tweeds"

Good debate though cheers

 

 

Maybe we could meet in the middle it could be quite lucrative hunting fat guys in tweeds :D

And stealing there big fat wallets and range rovers............... I'm in