skycat 6,173 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 I have this morning been talking to a woman who runs a horse freeze marking business in Cumbria. She tells me that there is absolutely no legislation within the UK which prohibits the freeze marking of any animals. Follow this link to see that even bats have been freeze marked for identification purposes! http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=13634851 If the powers that be do not think it is cruel or painful to freezemark a bat, then there should be no problem with dogs! Apparently althought the procedure is a bit uncomfortable, the woman I spoke to reckons it is a lot less painful than being ear tattoed for a dog. I really think that an obvious identifying mark in white on a dog would be the best visual deterrent there is to dog thieves. Of course if someone wants to steal a dog then keep it in a shed to breed from, for example, then nothing will deter such a person. BUT, for those opportunistic thieves, drug addicts who want a quick sale for their next fix, or lowlifes who will sell the dog on or work it themselves: then surely this has to be of help in putting them off nicking the dog in the first place. Northern Brand, (the company I have been speaking to this morning) have a special mark that is nationally recognised within large animal circles (an inverted omega sign) which indicates that the animal is also microchipped as well as freeze marked: this, along with the owner's freeze mark, tells the authorities at shelters, police stations etc that the animal is traceable via its microchip. As there is no national data base purely for freeze marked animals it would be vital that the animal has both means of identification. MY QUESTION IS: would you consider freeze marking your dog in order to deter thieves and aid recovery if the animal is stolen/strays etc? I want to look into this very seriously: Britain is known abroad as having a "dog stealing culture", and as a so called nation of animal lovers this is a shameful label to have! It's about time we did something to really stop these lowlifes who make money from other people's misery, not to mention the trauma to the stolen dogs. I'd really appreciate your thoughts on this: I don't know how to do a poll on this: maybe if someone is interested enough who knows how to do it they could put one up? Simple question: would you freeze mark your dogs? Yes or no. The whole thing could be set up very easily, and would probably only cost about £20 per dog: the same as chipping or tattooing. FAQ. Q. Can you freeze mark white animals? A. Yes, but you have to leave the branding iron in place longer in order to kill the hair follicles completely: the mark then remains permantly hairless. Q. Can you mark long/rough coated animals? A. Yes, but it is advisable to keep the fur trimmed short in that area for the mark to be most visible. Q. Where can you mark dogs? A. Outer ear flaps or haunches or ribs or shoulders. Q. What size is the mark? A. Any size you like! It was suggested to me that letters or numbers of less than 1" in height would be sufficient. I'm not so sure: the bigger the better (within reason) IMO. I'm sure there are loads more questions which I'l try and answer: I've just come off the phone where I've been discussing this possibility with the owner of Northern Brand, and she has been very helpful. She lives in an area where it is common for dogs to be dumped: most often they are working type terriers and lurchers. She is as sick as I am about the high incidence of dog thefts, and will give me all the help I need. Let's do something about this NOW! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Strong Stuff 2,171 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 Sounds good to me! Just wondering where it would be best to have my Strongstuff logo branded onto my dog ....... Seriously though, what better deterrent? Sounds like an excellent idea and thank you to you for spending the time finding out more about it, rather than just dismissing the idea as many have. You got your first customer! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
skycat 6,173 Posted October 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 A combination of numbers and letters is usual: though if you wanted to go the extra mile you could have a branding iron made up as any symbol you wanted! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kay 3,709 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 I think its a brilliant idea and it would be a real deterent , sort of a visable microchip Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tuzo 251 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 I'd be very interested, keep is informed SC........... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Scallywag 78 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 I'd rather ear tattoo - it's linked to a national data base like the microchip but is more reliable. I don't trust microchips, which I know can travel round the body, malfunction etc and we've all heard the stories of pounds trying to check for microchips with a reader that doesn't even have batteries in. A tattoo is there, readable with the naked eye and hard to remove. The freeze mark still ultimately relies on the microchip. It may well be a better deterrant, of course, because it's so visible but my gut reaction - not rational at all - is that I'd be reluctant to disfigure my dogs in this way. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Meerihunter 7 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 I think I'd rather stick with tattooing, in kazakhstan their dog had large tattoo on the inside of the back legs and was easier to read than some ear tattoo's I've seen. No one would be able to steal or pick up my Saluki's if lost some where anyway without being seriously hurt trying. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
skycat 6,173 Posted October 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 Ears can be cut off if tattooed: this has been known to happen: and not many people would be willing to go the hassle of tattooing the inner thigh, which either requires a local anaesthetic (very painful) or heavy sedation. The more modern chips are coated in a substance which promotes bonding of tissue to the chip thereby preventing migration to other parts of the body. (This was previously a concern of mine, but I have been told that with this new bonding coating is working well in 99% of dogs chipped.) Keep your views coming folks please. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Missie 1 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 Does anyone remember the Wye beagles that were stolen a few years back? The whole pack was tattooed and only 1 was ever recovered and his ear had been sewn up in such a way that the tattoo was no longer visible. If people want to steal an animal then NOTHING will deter them but I think freeze marking may well put most people off. Is there a recognised register as with tattooing? Its definately something I would consider in future, mine are all chipped and the tattoo's on the greys are linked to their chips now but I think its a good idea. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Meerihunter 7 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 Thats interesting regarding the tattooing of thigh as I would doubt that the Tazi or Central Asian Ovcharka I saw would have had the tattooing done through any sort veterinary service. I've seen photo's of hounds in france with large freeze markings. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
woz 260 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 is it illegal to freeze brand dog thieve's??? just a thought Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flynn 314 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 Yes i would consider!!! Had the Horses done with Nps there at all. Linked to the data base Grey/ white always showed the dark skin if kept Clipped out One question Sky Cat would You think the Lurcher/ Dog/ Hound would need a local anaesthetic, seeing as their Skin is Much Finer? One of My Lurchers Yelled Like a Banshee when she had her Ear Tattooed Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest SJM Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 I had 4 horses freezebranded and they barely moved while they were having it done, a couple were twitched just to make sure (twitching is where the nose is pulled round in a circle, it doesnt hurt the horse but it takes his mind off what is about to happen next, a bit like scruffing a dog by the neck when it gets an injection ) so I would definately be in favour of it I tattoo and chip all my own dogs, and also anyone who asks me to do theirs. I wouldnt have a problem freezebranding my own dogs or having someone else do it for me, anything that makes life harder for the scum bag dog theiving scum is in my book. Good on you Skycat, you have my full support in what your trying to do Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest markbrick1 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 PUT MY DOGS DOWN TO BE THE GUINEA PIGS.I AGREE WITH IT 100%ANYTHING TO STOP PEOPLE THIVING YOUR ANIMALS,MARK Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hollands hope 1,024 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 (edited) intressting read this freezebranding http://www.lhbrandingirons.com/Freeze/Instructions.html i was under the impression that the hair follicle was killed but this seems not to be the case Edited October 9, 2008 by hollands hope Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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