Litter Mates Going For Each other

[freddybamboo 0]

My two first cross Deerhound/Grey brothers go for each other when they see a fox.

 

Walking them at night on the street we come across a heap of foxes. I have never been one for working fox pre ban or otherwise. So i have no intention of slipping them. Plus the tarmac etc would tear their feet apart.

 

Anyway as soon as one of them makes a lunge or barks the other one jumps on top of him and tries to rip the sh1t out of his back. They are 32" and around 38kg, and about 16 months old.

 

One of them is more alert, eyesight sense of smell much better than the other, so he usually makes the first move.

 

Any advise or thoughts on wy they do this, and how to stop it?

 

Ta

[Terrier man 38]

Just two males .... why not just let them off and see what happend... you can never be sure they will catch it (1 .... or kill it (2 so no need to fear the law...

[freddybamboo 0]

its all residential area, just roads and pavement.

 

The big one that spots them first has popped his collar before and crunched one, bashed through a neighbours hedge and slat fence to get it at it. Ripped his front legs up and lost a couple of claws on the tarmac.

[marky r 25]

id be getting on a few fields and giving a few squeks if it was my dog lol!

[Guest ferretlad]

I think your 2 dog's are telling you that they need some work? They are only trying to do what they have been bred for, and its in their blood to hunt.

[skycat 6,173]

I'd rehome the one that really wants foxes to someone who would make full use of its potential!

[Guest smashygadge]

I'd rehome the one that really wants foxes to someone who would make full use of its potential!

 

 

keep the dogs if you can live with it too many just passed on and get him worked for yourself

[skycat 6,173]

The problem is that if a dog is fixated on a certain quarry and obviously has loads of want in its head, you're always going to have a problem when it sees that quarry. The other thing is that there is bound to be a certain amount of sibling rivalry, especially between two males: all that testosterone bubbling away can cause fights!

 

I was being slightly facetious when I suggested you rehome the dog with someone who wants to use it for what the dog wants to do!

 

However, if you do want to keep both then I'd suggest that you give them more exercise: as much free running as you can. Young dogs need to run and burn off excess energy and unspent energy leads to problems as you are finding out.

 

If you don't want to take certain quarry with the dogs then you need to 'break' them to that quarry, teaching them that it is not on the cards at all to even show an interest in them. However, speaking from experience, once a certain type of dog, one with a serious kill instinct, has actually killed the quarry, then it can be well and truly wed to it and nothing will stop it trying again and again to catch it.

 

If you have these two big young dogs and are only giving them lead work on roads, then they are bound to be getting frustrated and bored: I repeat: they need to run, and run a lot: its what they were bred for: keeping them in low gear is a bit like trying to make a F1 car chug along like a tractor LOL Only these tractors have feelings and instinct and really need to do more.

 

They are also at the age where their prey drive is seriously kicking in and they are no longer pups who just want to mess about. The whole thing about the one jumping on the other when it makes a lunge is just excitement and possibly that rivalry thing where any excuse is enough for a bust up: to see who is eventually going to be boss.

 

If they were mine I'd be putting some serious obedience training into them: down stays, recalls, retrieving: all sorts of things to get them thinking and obeying me. Do this one to one and leave the other at home when you train or you'll get nowhere fast.

 

Unless you have loads of time it is usually not a good idea to rear 2 littermates as any dog needs one to one training if its not to become a crazy liability.

 

Hope this helps.

[Guest smashygadge]

The problem is that if a dog is fixated on a certain quarry and obviously has loads of want in its head, you're always going to have a problem when it sees that quarry. The other thing is that there is bound to be a certain amount of sibling rivalry, especially between two males: all that testosterone bubbling away can cause fights!

 

I was being slightly facetious when I suggested you rehome the dog with someone who wants to use it for what the dog wants to do!

 

However, if you do want to keep both then I'd suggest that you give them more exercise: as much free running as you can. Young dogs need to run and burn off excess energy and unspent energy leads to problems as you are finding out.

 

If you don't want to take certain quarry with the dogs then you need to 'break' them to that quarry, teaching them that it is not on the cards at all to even show an interest in them. However, speaking from experience, once a certain type of dog, one with a serious kill instinct, has actually killed the quarry, then it can be well and truly wed to it and nothing will stop it trying again and again to catch it.

 

If you have these two big young dogs and are only giving them lead work on roads, then they are bound to be getting frustrated and bored: I repeat: they need to run, and run a lot: its what they were bred for: keeping them in low gear is a bit like trying to make a F1 car chug along like a tractor LOL Only these tractors have feelings and instinct and really need to do more.

 

They are also at the age where their prey drive is seriously kicking in and they are no longer pups who just want to mess about. The whole thing about the one jumping on the other when it makes a lunge is just excitement and possibly that rivalry thing where any excuse is enough for a bust up: to see who is eventually going to be boss.

 

If they were mine I'd be putting some serious obedience training into them: down stays, recalls, retrieving: all sorts of things to get them thinking and obeying me. Do this one to one and leave the other at home when you train or you'll get nowhere fast.

 

Unless you have loads of time it is usually not a good idea to rear 2 littermates as any dog needs one to one training if its not to become a crazy liability.

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

thats what i call side tracking why not just stick with your comment of pass the dog on why not give help in the first place .theirs 2 sides to everyone ah

[skycat 6,173]

It was supposed to be tongue in cheek: OK, I should have put the smiley shouldn't I.

[freddybamboo 0]

Skycat, the comment about the lack of excercise makes sense. The two of them have pretty bad injuries at the moment, both having different operations two weeks ago. No running for at least 2 more weeks.

 

Even when I am running them daily they tend to go a bit Raj for Red, but I can defo see the pent up energy in them.

 

I definitely wont be rehoming them as I dont agree with the old Lurcher carousel. I also dont want to work them on Red myself for a number of reasons, one being I dont like the tast

 

I think its a good shout to split them up for the obedience training. I usually have them out daily doing work on down stays etc but usually the other one will be leashed up watching. Probably getting pissed off. When they are fit they get about 1 to 1 and a half hours running on top of their walks.

 

I wanted them for rabbits and some other stuff on permissions I get to now and again. But where I run them daily is teaming with foxes, so its maybe only a matter of time before they burst another one.

 

Cheers for info

 

Should I be giving the snapper a belt when he lunges on his brother?

[skycat 6,173]

If you don't tell a dog off or correct it when it does the wrong thing then how is it to know that it is doing wrong. I knock any sign of aggression between my dogs on the head straight away. I'm not talking about when they are play fighting, but any serious sign of a snap gets grabbed by the scruff and shaken with a growl from me! I'm the boss and I won't tolerate bad behaviour.

 

Your two both being males and young are probably vying for top position in their pack. Which one do you think is the top dog? Below you of course! Watch how they behave with eachother and you should see which one is the calmer, more superior. The underdog of the two may try lots of wind up behaviour, mouthing at the other one's jaws, generally being irritating. Top dog may also mount under dog to let him know his place.

 

Do they cock their legs yet? If so, which one does it first, and does the other one then have to pee where the first one went? Top dog will always try and pee over the under dog's pee.

 

Do you treat them both the same? It's best to call top dog to you first, stroke him first, then the underdog. That way top dog will be secure in his position of top dog and under dog will just accept things: if he really is under dog, that is. If they both think they want to be top dog then you really do have problems!

 

If on the other hand you rule both with a rod of iron it won't matter too much which one thinks he's getting the upper hand as neither will dare put a foot out of line for fear of you: the real boss. Without actually seeing the dogs together it is difficult to explain all the subtleties of pack behaviour, but hopefully this might help you in assessing the situation.

[tonza 0]

I'd rehome the one that really wants foxes to someone who would make full use of its potential!

 

 

keep the dogs if you can live with it too many just passed on and get him worked for yourself

 

nice words of wisdom

[Simoman 110]

Walk them seperately?

[freddybamboo 0]

Cheers Again

 

The one that does the biting is more nervous and takes a fair bit of coaxing to get him out by himself. The other one is fine on his own and with other dogs, more calm and higher prey drive. He wasnt the first to cock his leg but he does usually cover up the other ones scent. He seems more confident but is the first to shit himself when my voice or my hand gets raised.

 

For his size he does well on rabbits. And has been invited out onto permissions for bigger stuff. I think its pointing more to him being the top of both. Will use your tips below to help make it a bit more distinct and defined.

 

Regards working them, should I be taking them out seperatly for bunnies or togther? AT the moment its together.

 

Cheers