polecats

[Crow 1]

No, both parents have to carry ONE albino gene to throw albinos (note, they can both be polecat marked!).

 

Read this for an explaination as to why . . .

 

Crow

[droid 11]

True.

But what throws some people is that the albino gene can be carried by ferrets of any colour. It's recessive, so if there's a dominant gene alongside it, then that dominant gene will determine the colour of the ferret.

[droid 11]

i crossed albino with polecat markings and got this :

 

 

What you had there was a Poley wit 1 dominant 'poley' version of the 'colour' gene and one recessive 'albino' version of the colour gene. And an albino with 2 recessive 'albino' versions of the colour gene.

 

Mathematically (and if my computer skills were better I'd show you how to work it out) you had a 1 in 4 chance of getting an albino.

You haven't, whiich suggests that the 'albino' version in ferrets is becoming (or has become) dominant. This does happen in genes. Ferrets have been domesticated for about 2000 years so that's plenty of time for it to happen. Especially if albinos were selected for in breeding for most of that time.

[stubby 175]

to get your brain working even more, last year my kitts were bred using an albino hob, producing silvers and polecats, two of the polecat jills were mated this year, to a sandie hob,

one jill has had 4 polecat jills, and 1 albino hob

 

the other has 12 kitts, and it looks like we have at least 3 albino in there,

 

so we know the mum jills, must be carrying albino from their father, and the sandie(unknown parentage) must also have albino in his making somewhere

 

 

also a last years polecat jill (silver/albino parents) was mated with another last years silver hob, and has thrown, 5 silvers and 7 polecats (silver/albino parents) so although we would estimate that both are split for albino, yet no albino produced in this litter, you would normally work out the percentages over a 100 kitts

[The one 8,513]

Looking at a book and working out gentics is fine if your ferrets are true bred but nobody knowns if there albinos had poley genes from way back unless there breeding there own line and keeping it pure and true. Colours are fine but i still reckon working ability must come first

[droid 11]

Unless your 'line' started when the Romans invaded you ain't got a 'pure and true' line anyway.

 

All you can do is improve the chances of a given colour.

 

I'll keep my council regarding breeding for hunting ability....

[Crow 1]

What you had there was a Poley wit 1 dominant 'poley' version of the 'colour' gene and one recessive 'albino' version of the colour gene. And an albino with 2 recessive 'albino' versions of the colour gene.

Mathematically (and if my computer skills were better I'd show you how to work it out) you had a 1 in 4 chance of getting an albino.

You haven't, whiich suggests that the 'albino' version in ferrets is becoming (or has become) dominant. This does happen in genes. Ferrets have been domesticated for about 2000 years so that's plenty of time for it to happen. Especially if albinos were selected for in breeding for most of that time.

 

Droid, I'm afraid you have that wrong.

 

It is only mathematically possible to have a 1 in 4 chance of an albino if you start with two polecats each carrying the albino gene; if we show them as Pa, then mated together you will get (mathematically) 25%PP, 50% Pa, 25%aa.

 

In Bigredbusa's case he started with a Pa and mated it to an aa, this will give him 50% albinos (aa) and 50% polecats (which are carrying the albino gene - Pa). Look at the Punnet square below:

 

 

Also, to suggest that a certain gene is becoming dominant based on the outcome of one litter is, quite frankly, absurd! It is only after a controlled study of thousands of litters could you even begin to start making theories. Genetic outcome is based on mathematical probability that is measured over an infinite number of outcomes, not one or two or even 100!

 

Stubby, you said: a last years polecat jill (silver/albino parents) was mated . . . .

 

Are you 100% that the polecat came from the silver/albino pairing? If so did that silver/albino pairing throw any silvers? I'm just curious from a study point of view

 

The thing we MUST be sure of when considering genetics is that we have the correct starting information, and that can only be guaranteed by accurate record keeping and controlled breeding.

 

The One: it is irrespective of what an albino had in it's lineage, an albino is always 'pure' (as in colour of coat), it has to be as it has two absolute recessive genes.

 

Crow

Edited May 29, 2008 by Crow

[Malt 379]

Fascinating stuff! Brings back memories of GCSE Science, we'll be on to Gregor Mendel and his peas next!

 

Keep it up!

[stubby 175]

my orginal 2 ferrets were both silvers (from magwitch) who normal pairs silver to polecat, these 2 jills were both paired to the same albino hob, they between them, threw 15 kitts, a mixture of polecat and silvers, from these I kept back, a hob and jill silver, and 2 jill, 1 hob polecat

 

I then had 2 planned matings this year, using both the jill polecats, both mated to the same sandie hob (parentage unknown)

and as stated, have a few albino's in the litters, along with polecate

 

the totall un planned mating, was with the silver jill (bred last year) to either a polecat or a silver, which because it was a mixed litter from 2 jill sisters the year before, I cant be sure wether its a brother to sister, or a cousin to cousin mating, if you read the post I put up a few weeks back (hobs eating kitts myth's) that was the reason for leaving the kitts in a court with 3 jills, 3 hobs, as the mating was not to my choice ie, silver/silver, or too closely related, therefore if the hobs had killed/eaten the kitts I wouldent have been too dissapointed, but to my amazement, they did'nt, and got on great,

this has produced 12 kitts, 5 hobs,7 jills, which are 5 silvers and 7 poleys

 

depending how these kitts turn out, health wise, (although they have just opened eyes, and can find rabbit as quick as others) It may change my mind on the silver to silver mating

[droid 11]

Droid, I'm afraid you have that wrong.

 

It is only mathematically possible to have a 1 in 4 chance of an albino if you start with two polecats each carrying the albino gene; if we show them as Pa, then mated together you will get (mathematically) 25%PP, 50% Pa, 25%aa.

 

Crow

 

Quite correct, total bollocks, and a lesson to me not to post within half an hour of getting up.

 

With regard to drawing conclusions from a specific event, I agree, but it was a hypothesis, definitely not a theory!. Not sure how you're going to manage an 'infinite' number of crosses, but you make the point well.

 

Glad someone else brought up Punnet Squares. And Mendelian nomenclature. Next off: genotype/phenotype/homozygous/heterozygous

Edited May 29, 2008 by droid

[Crow 1]

Don't you come back with threats of geno, pheno, hetero and homo or I'll have to start on autosomal dominance and recessive patterns of inheritance

 

Crow

[Guest jojoamojo]

fr!gg me! is this still a working forum.........

 

dont understand a word of it, but sounds very interesting :stupid:

[droid 11]

Don't you come back with threats of geno, pheno, hetero and homo or I'll have to start on autosomal dominance and recessive patterns of inheritance

 

Crow

 

Thud :sick:

 

 

 

[Bigbob 0]

Its going to be a long summer if were into gentic's already

[droid 11]

Tthing is, notwithstanding my balls up yesterday, the stuff Crow explained is pretty simple.

I could explain most of it in 15 minutes sat in a pub. Including the long words like 'heterozygous' As long as I was fully awake....

 

Relating it to ferrets is rather more speculative though, save the obvious bits like DEW/Silver 'lethal' genes and Waardenburgs. At the risk of provoking Crow again, I don't think the situation with albinos in ferrets is quite as simple as in most other species.