A.P.B.T....

[gnasher16 30,217]

11 hours ago, mC HULL said:

i understand what your saying mate but a hare dog is worked every week right threw  is low body fat needs to be hydrated they need to be in amazing condition but on the right side you have to peak and try keeping them there it’s easy to take to much out off them and you will catch nothing it’s a fine line 

id always soak kibble before i give it mate and watery broths hydrate aswell 

when i’ve fed raw they just don’t seem to be in the same condition look right on it i find a varied diet with kibble eggs some mornings porridge and the other feed meaty broth cold dead a winter wet threw takes it out of them mate i’ll get fatty trims but i’ll add dripping it’s always good to have on hand 

i’m enjoying reading about the ways you do it mate i find it interesting   

 

They will be in amazing condition for the task set mate yes and every respect to lads such as yourself in getting them there......but its just not realistic to compare that to a peaked out bulldog who even if he came out of his match relatively unscathed will be lucky to be able to break out into a trot for a few days the expenditure of everything you built up over the last 2/3 months is gone.....a running dog is " kept " at a high level of fitness....a bulldog cannot be " kept " for anymore than a few hours at the level of fitness he is matched at,on weight alone.....a dog weighed in at 40 lb will lose a lb maybe more during a match so you want to have had your dog in keep at 38/39 lb at certain times as you dont want the first time he has ever had to really exert himself at that lower weight to be in the match itself...but he will then lose more weight after while his body recovers so he's now weak as piss.....you're not taking him anywhere to do the same next day or next week 

Regards nutrition....again,you are describing a dogs every day feed bowl and im not....its like the whole protein thing people think too much protein is bad for the kidneys but its not anything lower than about 25% and the dogs body will cannibalize itself during a hard keep to get what it needs which is obviously not a good state and hydration and the way the body pulls away from water is massive in that respect ...you just couldnt hold a running dog at the low hydration of a peaked bulldog for long enough it would be like a boxer weighing in and then going off to fight straight away without re hydrating its not only going to effect performance its dangerous.....real food enables you to control things you cant control with kibble from muscle soreness to burning fat to controlling insulin,aid recovery and on and on.

Workouts themselves are timed to when the dog is being shown so you are mimicking the procedure,the 30 minute window post workout is for re - fuelling where the empty dog will burn,use and recover whatever it is given so optimal re - fuelling is the first step to optimal conditioning,the old saying with bulldogs is more fat to perform,more protein to recover,and less carbs for production which again im not sure how it translates to running dogs who are working at or close to maximum stress much more frequently.....to really understand maximum stress recovery is to understand glycogen v fat usability and how to manipulate biomechanical processes.

I mean dont get me wrong i fully appreciate that feeding a working dog and feeding a sporting dog is very different but the same general principles are what they are and i mean no offence when i say there is absolutely no way any canine athlete can have the same physical capabilities on " dog food " as it can on real food.....but yes interesting topic,sorry for boring the pants off anyone 

By the way i dont know if any of you running dog lads have ever seen it but there used to be a sled dog magazine years ago called Mushing it was either Yank/Canadian i forget now...i have no idea if it still runs or whether you can get back issues or whatever but a lot of bulldog conditioners used to write articles for it and it was a very good source of learning.

Edited September 17, 2022 by gnasher16

[mC HULL 12,947]

5 minutes ago, gnasher16 said:

They will be in amazing condition for the task set mate yes and every respect to lads such as yourself in getting them there......but its just not realistic to compare that to a peaked out bulldog who even if he came out of his match relatively unscathed will be lucky to be able to break out into a trot for a few days the expenditure of everything you built up over the last 2/3 months is gone.....a running dog is " kept " at a high level of fitness....a bulldog cannot be " kept " for anymore than a few hours at the level of fitness he is matched at,on weight alone.....a dog weighed in at 40 lb will lose a lb maybe more during a match so you want to have had your dog in keep at 38/39 lb at certain times as you dont want the first time he has ever had to really exert himself at that lower weight to be in the match itself...but he will then lose more weight after while his body recovers so he's now weak as piss.....you're not taking him anywhere to do the same next day or next week 

Regards nutrition....again,you are describing a dogs every day feed bowl and im not....its like the whole protein thing people think too much protein is bad for the kidneys but its not anything lower than about 25% and the dogs body will cannibalize itself during a hard keep to get what it needs which is obviously not a good state and hydration and the way the body pulls away from water is massive in that respect ...you just couldnt hold a running dog at the low hydration of a peaked bulldog for long enough it would be like a boxer weighing in and then going off to fight straight away without re hydrating its not only going to effect performance its dangerous.....real food enables you to control things you cant control with kibble from muscle soreness to burning fat to controlling insulin,aid recovery and on and on.

Workouts themselves are timed to when the dog is being shown so you are mimicking the procedure,the 30 minute window post workout is for re - fuelling where the empty dog will burn,use and recover whatever it is given so optimal re - fuelling is the first step to optimal conditioning,the old saying with bulldogs is more fat to perform,more protein to recover,and less carbs for production which again im not sure how it translates to running dogs who are working at or close to maximum stress much more frequently.....to really understand maximum stress recovery is to understand glycogen v fat usability and how to manipulate biomechanical processes.

I mean dont get me wrong i fully appreciate that feeding a working dog and feeding a sporting dog is very different but the same general principles are what they are and i mean no offence when i say there is no way any canine athlete can have the same physical capabilities on " dog food " as it can on real food.....but yes interesting topic,sorry for boring the pants off anyone 

By the way i dont know if any of you running dog lads have ever seen it but there used to be a sled dog magazine years ago called Mushing i have no idea if it still runs or whether you can get back issues or whatever but a lot of bulldog conditioners used to write articles for it and it was a very good source of learning.

i understand bits your saying mate 

the bulldog is peaked it’s a fine line between it giving everything and not having anything to give 

if a hound ran 5 dead a winter a few long runs it will not be doing a lot for a few days mate just laid up resting this is when it can be hard to keep em right they can look rough after a hard day 

i understand fat is used when running and glycogen is glucose ? better for replenishing after a stressful excercise? i maybe way out   i’m more what has worked for me then the scientific approach 

but it’s maybe why me dog does better and keeps condition better  with warm  porridge honey after a hard day also things like rice potatoe in kibble will give it aswell as will veg rather then just raw fed ?

 

how does drying the dog out help the bulldog gnash ? 

[mC HULL 12,947]

i recon gnash with all his knowledge could get me into shape keep it coming gnash it’s been a belting thread 

[gnasher16 30,217]

25 minutes ago, mC HULL said:

i understand bits your saying mate 

the bulldog is peaked it’s a fine line between it giving everything and not having anything to give 

if a hound ran 5 dead a winter a few long runs it will not be doing a lot for a few days mate just laid up resting this is when it can be hard to keep em right they can look rough after a hard day 

i understand fat is used when running and glycogen is glucose ? better for replenishing after a stressful excercise? i maybe way out   i’m more what has worked for me then the scientific approach 

but it’s maybe why me dog does better and keeps condition better  with warm  porridge honey after a hard day also things like rice potatoe in kibble will give it aswell as will veg rather then just raw fed ?

 

how does drying the dog out help the bulldog gnash ? 

Like i said mate if it works for you then stick with it 

Drying out is considered a thing of the past it was done to raise the red blood cell count/haemoglobin....when the body pulls away from water and starts to dehydrate,the blood concentrates meaning more haemoglobin go's through to the lungs to cool off and back through the body to cool it down and stop the dog overheating.....in todays times with more knowledge etc its about water " management "....so during the tapering down at the end of a keep the dog will drink less and less some days he doesnt drink at all thats how you know he's in shape....obviously we know today any kind of dehydration will have a negative effect they say for every 1% loss of water theres a 5% loss of power but of course they are fighting dogs so need to make weight so " drying out " in todays terms simply refers to the subcutaneous water below the skin.

[low plains drifter 10,635]

1 hour ago, mC HULL said:

i recon gnash with all his knowledge could get me into shape keep it coming gnash it’s been a belting thread 

Get your creatine ordered Chunky Monkey

[mC HULL 12,947]

3 minutes ago, low plains drifter said:

Get your creatine ordered Chunky Monkey

f***ing creatine i might go on a liquid diet like you  

[low plains drifter 10,635]

6 minutes ago, mC HULL said:

f***ing creatine i might go on a liquid diet like you  

Get on this for your pre workout loading 

 

[low plains drifter 10,635]

1 minute ago, low plains drifter said:

Get on this for your pre workout loading 

 

Use it to wash down your 6 brewers yeast tablets

[mC HULL 12,947]

9 minutes ago, low plains drifter said:

Get on this for your pre workout loading 

 

that’s me on the right a few year ago  in fitter times a 16 stone specimen  

but i’d bet i can be stood there fatter with 4 fingers up you next to me doing the zero with a square feathered plodder in one hand and a timothy taylor in the other    

 

[low plains drifter 10,635]

33 minutes ago, mC HULL said:

that’s me on the right a few year ago  in fitter times a 16 stone specimen  

but i’d bet i can be stood there fatter with 4 fingers up you next to me doing the zero with a square feathered plodder in one hand and a timothy taylor in the other    

 

You daft shite in a bucket

[low plains drifter 10,635]

53 minutes ago, mC HULL said:

that’s me on the right a few year ago  in fitter times a 16 stone specimen  

but i’d bet i can be stood there fatter with 4 fingers up you next to me doing the zero with a square feathered plodder in one hand and a timothy taylor in the other    

 

 

[YOKEL 2,277]

9 hours ago, Blackmag said:

Nash how would you train a manny  dog or handle it as certain lines threw them up regular how could you trust or  train something that could turn at any time 

I had a bitch here from a line with a reputation for man biters, in fact, the first thing she done when I got her out the crate from picking her up was jump up and nail me in the arm! Gave her a stern word and put her in the kennel. Over the next week or so, it went the same way, plenty of time spent with the bitch, every time she got waspy, back in the kennel. Til she just came right. Always gave her a good long rub down after her walks, stretched her out etc, basically spending loads of one to one time and getting her used to me, and me used to her and her signs. I always found when training them up and working them, that Manny side calms down abit... she was what she was, you'd have never trusted in a house with other people, but once you knew her signs, she was a cracking bitch to own and work....

Yokel

[C.green 3,231]

I have a bitch that was quite bad for redirecting if she got too frustrated thats the worst type of biter i think. I know people say game stuff shouldnt ever be man aggressive but im not sure i fully buy that. Some are bad dogs especially with that bit of meaning behind what there doing.

Edited September 18, 2022 by C.green

[keepdiggin 9,561]

Chinaman was a man  biter 

[YOKEL 2,277]

56 minutes ago, keepdiggin said:

Chinaman was a man  biter 

A lot were. Homer, zebo, alligator, Chinaman etc etc. Pretty certain gnasher will also tell you that a good few of the alligator dogs that came over and were bred here were the same. It's a bit of a myth this "zero tolerance" of man biters by dog men. We're talking highly strung, well bred sporting dogs, if they Excel at their chosen sport, well, you'll forgive them for their lack of manners so to speak. The real problems start when these dogs find themselves in non working/,pet homes.