Ruiz vs Joshua 2

[shaaark 10,915]

54 minutes ago, NEWKID said:

That's how I see this one as well mate, AJ round 6 or 7.... 

Might be wrong here, but I said at the time, EVERYTHING about joshua was wrong before the first round even started, and if, as was suspected/rumoured/covered up, he did suffer a ko in training camp only about 8 days before the fight, it would explain his performance, or lack of

Edited December 4, 2019 by shaaark

[TheShootingTog 2,256]

I've never really rated AJ as a true world class boxer, I reckon Ruiz should win, but as with all sports, you cant discount for corruption.

[NEWKID 27,425]

2 minutes ago, shaaark said:

Might be wrong here, but I said at the time, EVERYTHING about joshua was wrong before the first round even started, and if, as was suspected/rumoured/covered up, he did suffer a ko in traing camp only about 8 days before the fight, it would explain his performance, or lack of

I wouldnt take away from the Ruiz performance, who had a game plan to beat AJ and it worked... but I tend to agree, he was either far too relaxed/confident or had some sort of problem... he just never got going, even after knocking Ruiz down...it was very lacklustre... I just cant see him being that poor again, although Ruiz has proven hes no mug so it's a tough call....

 

[shaaark 10,915]

43 minutes ago, W. Katchum said:

When is it?

8.45 this saturday night, as far as I can tell katch

[Waz 4,274]

AJ is beat before he enters the ring. May it be a good payday for them & they leave the ring healthier and richer.

[gnasher16 30,441]

On 03/12/2019 at 18:06, jukel123 said:

Do you think AJ was keen to fight on or did he want out of the fight? I've watched it a few times and I'm not sure.

Its a conversation ive had with a lot of people mate and no i dont think he quit....did he look like he wanted to fight on,not really..... so he quit right ?......this is my take on it.

As a fighter who has served your time in the amateurs as a boy,all through the schoolboy champs and then turn pro you develop certain instincts that stay with you through your career....things that become second nature....one of those things that all fighters have experienced is the desire to convince a referee you are ok to continue.....Joshua doesnt have those instincts,he was fast tracked through his career.....when i watched the way that fight ended i thought Joshua almost looked like a spoilt kid.....as if he was saying to the referee " hang on a minute this is the AJ show you cant stop me "....he just didnt have that instinct to look the referee squarely in the eye bouncing on his feet showing he was ok to carry on like you are taught as a kid......and for me its all part and parcel of the whole way boxing is at the moment....i hate the way a lot of fighters get their first real gut check in a competitive fight instead of in the gym.....Joshua for example has never been beaten up in the gym,well why not ?.....part of getting beaten up in the gym is about conditioning your mind for what it feels like and not panicking you cant spend every hour in a ring doing technical sparring you have to suffer and know what it feels like to relax through hard moments or you end up blowing a gasket through being too tense or doing silly things like Joshua did turning your back walking away from the referee and looking like you dont want to continue.

Sorry for such a long winded reply to a simple question but in my opinion its not a simple answer.....i speak to a lot of fighters and ex fighters and ive not heard one say Joshua quit in that fight....some will say he looked confused,too relaxed,too big for his boots etc....but my theory is that he just doesnt instinctively have a fighters mindset.....which in fairness to the lad,why would he...he was a rough street kid doing his thing and got lofted to great heights in boxing without experiencing all the stuff that comes before it.....just my opinion like.

Edited December 5, 2019 by gnasher16

[socks 32,253]

24 minutes ago, gnasher16 said:

Its a conversation ive had with a lot of people mate and no i dont think he quit....did he look like he wanted to fight on,not really..... so he quit right ?......this is my take on it.

As a fighter who has served your time in the amateurs as a boy,all through the schoolboy champs and then turn pro you develop certain instincts that stay with you through your career....things that become second nature....one of those things that all fighters have experienced is the desire to convince a referee you are ok to continue.....Joshua doesnt have those instincts,he was fast tracked through his career.....when i watched the way that fight ended i thought Joshua almost looked like a spoilt kid.....as if he was saying to the referee " hang on a minute this is the AJ show you cant stop me "....he just didnt have that instinct to look the referee squarely in the eye bouncing on his feet showing he was ok to carry on like you are taught as a kid......and for me its all part and parcel of the whole way boxing is at the moment....i hate the way a lot of fighters get their first real gut check in a competitive fight instead of in the gym.....Joshua for example has never been beaten up in the gym,well why not ?.....part of getting beaten up in the gym is about conditioning your mind for what it feels like and not panicking you cant spend every hour in a ring doing technical sparring you have to suffer and know what it feels like to relax through hard moments or you end up blowing a gasket through being too tense or doing silly things like Joshua did turning your back walking away from the referee and looking like you dont want to continue.

Sorry for such a long winded reply to a simple question but in my opinion its not a simple answer.....i speak to a lot of fighters and ex fighters and ive not heard one say Joshua quit in that fight....some will say he looked confused,too relaxed,too big for his boots etc....but my theory is that he just doesnt instinctively have a fighters mindset.....which in fairness to the lad,why would he...he was a rough street kid doing his thing and got lofted to great heights in boxing without experiencing all the stuff that comes before it.....just my opinion like.

What would a good coach be doing or saying to AJ to get him ready for the return fight gnash ??? 

[gnasher16 30,441]

On 03/12/2019 at 18:55, Stoney100 said:

You honestly don’t think he quit in the first fight then mate? 

Like you say, whatever happens he will go on to live a life most people could only dream of, big, strong and young fit lad with his head screwed on and millions in the bank......while I’m never jealous of money I can’t spend.....I must admit to be in his position by 30 is something I could never have done and full to credit to him.

But when he talks all his inspirational quotes about never quitting etc it makes me cringe tbh.....Especially when, in my armchair based opinion having never stepped in a boxing ring, he quit on his feet, spit the bit and refused to come up to scratch. If that was a dog that was just their for one purpose I’m sure there would be a spare kennel after that night lol

don’t take this next part as stalking lol......I’m genuinely interested in betting and different peoples strategies (if its 10p or 10k makes no difference to me) and believe I remember reading you saying you backed ruiz during the ring walks to cover your original stake (whatever is was) on Joshua as you could see he wasn’t up for it?

Theres a method of betting called dutching......if you already know of it excuse me, but if not or for any who doesn’t its basically where you bet on at least three different outcomes (either fighter wins or a draw in boxing) and make a profit either way. You wouldn’t be able to do it on this fight now as the odds have come in to much but if you get chance to look it up I’d definitely recommend if your betting on boxing.......I had £100 on fury to beat wilder.....could of cashed out in the 12th but then he got knocked down and the cash out option was gone untill he got up and then it was an even higher cash out, I can’t remember exactly now but say I was due £200 returns it was offering £190 but I let it run.....Bell went.....buzzing, thought I’d doubled my money......when they announced a draw my f***ing heart sank lol......especially when the draw was 33/1 and I had completely ignored it! 

I vowed there and then never to make that mistake again so looked more into dutching and it’s as safe a betting system on something with three possible outcomes as you can find imo, providing you get the right odds.

quick example........

ruiz is 2/1

joshua is evens (1/1)

draw is 33/1

 

£100 split between them in the way the online dutching calculator tells you will give you a guaranteed £15.91......

doesn’t seem a lot but you are definitely going to make that no matter what way the fight ends and multiplying your stake will multiply your winnings so £1000 will make a profit of £159.10......£10,000 will make a profit of £1590.91 and so on.......do it in 200 fights over the year and you can make a good bit of tax free cash towards your yearly wage.

It’s all about finding the right odds and trust me you won’t last long placing all three bets with the same bookies as I found out lol......it’s a trick they hate and it’s because they will lose to that customer no matter what so you best to place them in three different brands and most towns have a paddy power, betfred and William hills about or of course there’s online companies. 

Doesn’t beat a good old tenner with someone tho so fancy Joshua and I’ll have ruiz for a tenner to spice it up a little?? All in good jest

Oh i didnt see this....think ive already answered the " did he/didnt he " thing.

As regards all the inspirational quotes what you have to remember mate is Joshua is under constant pressure to be the media darling and nations sweetheart.....drug dealing black street kid to fit healthy world champion....." you too can be like me ".....half of what comes out of his gish has been written down for him by nice helpful image consultants and pc luvvies !......get the lad on his own away from a camera and he,ll talk as rough and ready as the next street kid.

As regards the betting i dont have " strategies " mate i just bet because i like to i dont take it too serious the Joshua/Ruiz thing was just common sense to me i sensed he wasnt right and panicked thats all .....years ago i fancied myself as a bit of a De Niro in Casino thinking that because i got the odd whisper from being around gyms etc that i could clean up.....but truth be told im probably about even over the years....when we was younger yes we all tried different things dutching is just another version of matched betting i suppose....probably works better on the gee gees as you,d literally have to scour through every bookies in the land to find prices that would give a profit for footie or boxing......by the way did you know that the term " Dutching " came from Dutch Schultz who was Al Capones old accountant !.....plenty of people do ok with that type of betting if you have the time or inclination to find the prices.

Anyway i hope im not speaking out of line and im certainly not patronising you im just a kind caring citizen ....but aint you the lad thats just beaten the booze.....not looking to replace one addiction with another mate are you.

[dogmad riley 1,347]

14 minutes ago, socks said:

What would a good coach be doing or saying to AJ to get him ready for the return fight gnash ??? 

Hit the one in the middle

[gnasher16 30,441]

15 minutes ago, socks said:

What would a good coach be doing or saying to AJ to get him ready for the return fight gnash ??? 

I would think a coach like McCracken will probably be drilling him on technical stuff,finding chinks in an opponent you have already fought to exploit and trying to build his confidence after a pride hurting loss.

My opinion and my advice would be f**k all that......get back to doing what got you here.....kill or be killed,all eggs in one basket....go out and try to take his head off inside 3 rounds......its too late in the lads career for technical learning when the foundation instincts are not there.

But then im an all or nothing person and maybe thats why im not a boxing trainer 

[JDHUNTING 1,817]

On 03/12/2019 at 17:58, jukel123 said:

Personally I'd like to see the little fat fella put AJ on his arse again. It was the size of the fight in the dog and not the size of the dog which gave us the last result. AJ has to prove this time that he's not another Mike Tyson, good at handing out punishment but not so mentally strong when the game plan backfires.

Anyway, Ruiz seems a cracking family bloke who comes to fight and give his all. Bit of a throwback to the old fashioned heavyweights. Go on my son!

Mike Tyson was tough as teak no quit in that man at all.

[NEWKID 27,425]

20 minutes ago, JDHUNTING said:

Mike Tyson was tough as teak no quit in that man at all.

I'd say biting holyfield was as good as quitting imo...

I was a massive Tyson fan and in his early days there was no one like him, but his addictions and personality eventually  f****d him up...

Holyfield, now theres a heavy that was tough as teak and never quit!!

[Stoney100 1,179]

1 hour ago, gnasher16 said:

Oh i didnt see this....think ive already answered the " did he/didnt he " thing.

As regards all the inspirational quotes what you have to remember mate is Joshua is under constant pressure to be the media darling and nations sweetheart.....drug dealing black street kid to fit healthy world champion....." you too can be like me ".....half of what comes out of his gish has been written down for him by nice helpful image consultants and pc luvvies !......get the lad on his own away from a camera and he,ll talk as rough and ready as the next street kid.

As regards the betting i dont have " strategies " mate i just bet because i like to i dont take it too serious the Joshua/Ruiz thing was just common sense to me i sensed he wasnt right and panicked thats all .....years ago i fancied myself as a bit of a De Niro in Casino thinking that because i got the odd whisper from being around gyms etc that i could clean up.....but truth be told im probably about even over the years....when we was younger yes we all tried different things dutching is just another version of matched betting i suppose....probably works better on the gee gees as you,d literally have to scour through every bookies in the land to find prices that would give a profit for footie or boxing......by the way did you know that the term " Dutching " came from Dutch Schultz who was Al Capones old accountant !.....plenty of people do ok with that type of betting if you have the time or inclination to find the prices.

Anyway i hope im not speaking out of line and im certainly not patronising you im just a kind caring citizen ....but aint you the lad thats just beaten the booze.....not looking to replace one addiction with another mate are you.

Lol no mate, I’ve bet for years now and it’s far from a problem.....never really bet more than £50 on anything, all with money I can afford to lose and I genuinely find it interesting to try and find ways to make a few quid out of sport......never played roulette/slots/virtual racing etc as that’s all in the bookies favour so stay well away from it! 

And fair points on everything else mate, and no i didn’t know that about al Capone accountant lol like you say it’s all about time and inclination and not rushing to get a bet on simply to have a bet!

Should be a good fight

[JDHUNTING 1,817]

41 minutes ago, NEWKID said:

I'd say biting holyfield was as good as quitting imo...

I was a massive Tyson fan and in his early days there was no one like him, but his addictions and personality eventually  f****d him up...

Holyfield, now theres a heavy that was tough as teak and never quit!!

It weren't quitting as in he,d took to much punishment and quit imo more frustration at wanting to hurt holyfield and not being able to legally.

[jukel123 8,626]

1 hour ago, JDHUNTING said:

Mike Tyson was tough as teak no quit in that man at all.

From 8.10 onwards JD.