General election - who to vote for ?

[Nicepix 5,650]

That is right. It is one of those subjects that nobody will tackle.

One of the problems with the NHS and this is shared by the police too, is that when local councils cut services to save money it creates a burden on other agencies like the police and NHS.

Example: Social worker numbers are cut so today's fragile generation aren't getting the support they need and some resort to self harm or addictions. These people then clog up police cells and hospital beds causing more expenditure by police and NHS workers than has been saved by cutting the number of social workers. It is shifting money around to save their own budgets without concerns about the bigger picture.

Nowhere else in the world is there a free health system. And nowhere else in the world are health tourists travelling in to exploit the system. Nowhere else has people continually calling to get an ambulance because the ambulance staff are the only people who take them seriously.

It has to change.

[jukel123 8,658]

Of course the NHS isn't free. I paid National Insurance contributions and tax for 47 years. We do need to have a national, adult conversation about the future of the NHS .But I do not trust the tories to chair that conversation.

NP can you show me some reliable stats that demonstrate that the French pension is lower than the British? I  receive circa 6 grand in state pension after a nearly half a century of work. Stats I have seen show the French pension to be twice that????. Not being arsy just curious.

[jukel123 8,658]

10 minutes ago, Nicepix said:

That is right. It is one of those subjects that nobody will tackle.

One of the problems with the NHS and this is shared by the police too, is that when local councils cut services to save money it creates a burden on other agencies like the police and NHS.

Example: Social worker numbers are cut so today's fragile generation aren't getting the support they need and some resort to self harm or addictions. These people then clog up police cells and hospital beds causing more expenditure by police and NHS workers than has been saved by cutting the number of social workers. It is shifting money around to save their own budgets without concerns about the bigger picture.

Nowhere else in the world is there a free health system. And nowhere else in the world are health tourists travelling in to exploit the system. Nowhere else has people continually calling to get an ambulance because the ambulance staff are the only people who take them seriously.

It has to change.

Agree with much of this post.

[dogmandont 9,916]

I can never remember so many Tory voters being on here, but now it seems if you’re not a Tory or brexit party voter your a c**t, how have the torys became the voice of the man on the street?? one thing this whole brexit fcukup has hammered home is that every politician and party piss in the same pot and don’t give a toss about ordinary working class people. 

[Nicepix 5,650]

4 minutes ago, jukel123 said:

Of course the NHS isn't free. I paid National Insurance contributions and tax for 47 years. We do need to have a national, adult conversation about the future of the NHS .But I do not trust the tories to chair that conversation.

NP can you show me some reliable stats that demonstrate that the French pension is lower than the British? I  receive circa 6 grand in state pension after a nearly half a century of work. Stats I have seen show the French pension to be twice that????. Not being arsy just curious.

https://www.expatica.com/fr/finance/retirement/french-pension-guide-the-french-pension-system-for-expats-830117/#frenchpension

In short;

"retirees have to work for at least 42 years before being entitled to a full French state pension (or 40 if born before 1952). This will rise to 43 years by 2035 for those born from 1973 onwards. Otherwise, a pro-rata French pension can be claimed after working at least 10 years in France.

The state French pension scheme then entitles retirees to draw a maximum of 50% of their annual average earnings up to a limit of €39,732 per year. For those born since 1953, a minimum pension rate is secured at 37.5%."

This relies on the retiree having been in employment for at least 42 years and receiving sufficient wages that their pension contributions meet the quarterly criteria. Many agricultural workers would not meet all four quarters due to fluctuating wages dependent on the season. Similarly those paid on sales or results might not meet their quarterly targets. In theory, if you were fully employed in a well paid job you would get a good pension. For many though the pension rate is reduced considerably.

[Accip74 7,112]

56 minutes ago, Nicepix said:

No, I'll hopefully get the UK pension I have contributed towards for almost 40 years. I might also get a very small French pension based on the few years I've been self employed over here though.

French pensions are less than UK ones and the French have to contribute to their health service. It isn't free like the NHS. I don't know of any other country that has free health care so perhaps it isn't a good idea.  It is certainly being abused by free loaders and it must be said, by NHS staff creating long waiting lists to boost their private work. Basically the NHS is now unfit for purpose and needs overhauling. 

You will find homeless people in the Nordic countries you so admire. And a much higher rate of suicide. You cannot lay all the blame on people sleeping rough and using food banks on the government. There are many other issues such as personal debt caused by personal bad decisions. Addictions of all kinds also cause many of these problems as does mental health issues caused by those addictions.

It isn't just as simple as the Tories cause all our problems. A lot of the current problems were caused by Labour and the unions on the 1970's.

 

 

Apparently Belgium, France & Ireland have the highest suicide rates in Western Europe. I doubt Nordic suicide rates have much to do with general prosperity?

[Nicepix 5,650]

1 minute ago, Accip74 said:

Apparently Belgium, France & Ireland have the highest suicide rates in Western Europe. I doubt Nordic suicide rates have much to do with general prosperity?

Boredom? 

Seriously, when  I last looked at this it was Finland, Iceland and some of the Russian countries were top of the European lists. When I was in Sweden I got talking to a couple of school teachers who were guiding my mate and myself on a motorbike tour of the Baltic coast. They put the high suicide rates of Scandinavian countries down to the long winter evenings and too much home made spirits. Plus having nothing to do. Some of the former Russian states now have no employment and no social services or health care that they enjoyed under communism and that is thought to have the same effect too.

But, to return to the thread; prosperity does not always bring happiness. Some of the highest earners have the most worries.

[Accip74 7,112]

28 minutes ago, Nicepix said:

Boredom? 

Seriously, when  I last looked at this it was Finland, Iceland and some of the Russian countries were top of the European lists. When I was in Sweden I got talking to a couple of school teachers who were guiding my mate and myself on a motorbike tour of the Baltic coast. They put the high suicide rates of Scandinavian countries down to the long winter evenings and too much home made spirits. Plus having nothing to do. Some of the former Russian states now have no employment and no social services or health care that they enjoyed under communism and that is thought to have the same effect too.

But, to return to the thread; prosperity does not always bring happiness. Some of the highest earners have the most worries.

That’s why I made the point. Suicide rates are a very complicated issue. I live in Flanders & here it’s all about having a couple of 50k motors on the drive or one of the numerous Tesla’s & a 700k house is the norm, but it looks like suicide rates are some of the highest in Europe! Though schooling is excellent & health care is really good..etc

That said, maybe an abundance of a ‘show of wealth’ could be a contributing factor? (Though it doesn’t surprise me with the Belgians)

Edited November 20, 2019 by Accip74

[sandymere 8,263]

[WILF 47,624]

40 minutes ago, Accip74 said:

That’s why I made the point. Suicide rates are a very complicated issue. I live in Flanders & here it’s all about having a couple of 50k motors on the drive or one of the numerous Tesla’s & a 700k house is the norm, but it looks like suicide rates are some of the highest in Europe! Though schooling is excellent & health care is really good..etc

That said, maybe an abundance of a ‘show of wealth’ could be a contributing factor? (Though it doesn’t surprise me with the Belgians)

Talking of useless expensive items, I saw a Belgium warship tied up on the Liffey ! Lol 

[Nicepix 5,650]

9 hours ago, WILF said:

Talking of useless expensive items, I saw a Belgium warship tied up on the Liffey ! Lol 

They need something to contribute to the EU Armed Forces.

Talking of wealth; out here in rural France the most common vehicle outside people's houses are Berlingo / Partner vans and there is a higher desire to own an Iveco 3.5t tipper than a Teslar. In fact, most of my neighbours wouldn't know what a Teslar was. Wealth is not apparent here. That however brings its own pressures on life. On my travels I regularly see octogenarians hauling wood into their houses many of which won't have any hot water. Some of the houses that have been put on the freeads after the old inhabitant has died are like 19th century museum displays and yet thousands of old people are still living like that. I would imagine that some of these old folk end up taking their own lives and contribute to the suicide rate.

[jukel123 8,658]

https://www.50connect.co.uk/blogs/how-does-the-uk-pension-measure-up-against-the-res

I think these figures are out of date. The french now have to work until they are 62 before they get full pension. We have to work until 67.

The french don't take any shit. We do..... continually . Time we started demanding decent schools hospitals housing and hospitals. It's not a lot to ask. You don't have to be a raging commie to aspire to the same living conditions as the rest of the developed world.

Edited November 21, 2019 by jukel123

[WILF 47,624]

2 hours ago, Nicepix said:

They need something to contribute to the EU Armed Forces.

Talking of wealth; out here in rural France the most common vehicle outside people's houses are Berlingo / Partner vans and there is a higher desire to own an Iveco 3.5t tipper than a Teslar. In fact, most of my neighbours wouldn't know what a Teslar was. Wealth is not apparent here. That however brings its own pressures on life. On my travels I regularly see octogenarians hauling wood into their houses many of which won't have any hot water. Some of the houses that have been put on the freeads after the old inhabitant has died are like 19th century museum displays and yet thousands of old people are still living like that. I would imagine that some of these old folk end up taking their own lives and contribute to the suicide rate.

Give me a shout next time one or two pop their clogs, I’ll be over with the van......I’m getting quiet into the antiques these days ! Lol 

[WILF 47,624]

1 hour ago, jukel123 said:

https://www.50connect.co.uk/blogs/how-does-the-uk-pension-measure-up-against-the-res

I think these figures are out of date. The french now have to work until they are 62 before they get full pension. We have to work until 67.

The french don't take any shit. We do..... continually . Time we started demanding decent schools hospitals housing and hospitals. It's not a lot to ask. You don't have to be a raging commie to aspire to the same living conditions as the rest of the developed world.

I think the problem is that our politicians take everything to the most stupid degree.....they can’t bring themselves to just have a bit of sense about things.

See, relying on the state should be a contract, they take just enough of what they need in order to provide a decent free at point of delivery service.......don’t sound that hard does it?

However, our mob want to use it as an excuse to rinse everyone for as much as humanly possible and just provide something shabby to say “you are getting something”

So, the question is “what do you do”?

Do you carry on being used as a living cash machine, kid yourself it’s for the greater good when really it’s just getting wasted right, left and centre.

or

Do you smash it down and say, f**k this....it’s not working.

Its a very hard call mate......

[sandymere 8,263]

Lots still going on about how bad the NHS is but, we spend less than many EU countries with similar systems and much less than the USA, which in spite of the cost has a massive amount of people who do not have health insurance so are pretty much in the shite. 

https://www.pgpf.org/blog/2019/07/how-does-the-us-healthcare-system-compare-to-other-countries

We should put more in to bring us in line with our better performing neighbours to get a better performing system. 

 

 

Edited November 21, 2019 by sandymere