Elusive Charlie

[Underdog 2,337]

5 minutes ago, ianm said:

The intelligence gathered from trail cams is absolutely the best. It is a recording of what has actually happened with a date and time stamp. A fresh turd or whatever will tell you if a fox has been in the area but not when, a trail cam will. If you have several cams out and the fox is captured on more than one, as will be the case if you have sited them correctly they will also tell you which direction they have come from aswell. I like to kill them before we get to the pheasants wings laying about stage. 

Yes absolutely..... As long as you or whomever puts the tail cameras in the right places!

How many cameras is enough?

That could be like answering how long is a piece of string?

By the time the ground is covered completely by cameras you won't have time to process all the data??

[Underdog 2,337]

23 minutes ago, ianm said:

The intelligence gathered from trail cams is absolutely the best. It is a recording of what has actually happened with a date and time stamp. A fresh turd or whatever will tell you if a fox has been in the area but not when, a trail cam will. If you have several cams out and the fox is captured on more than one, as will be the case if you have sited them correctly they will also tell you which direction they have come from aswell. I like to kill them before we get to the pheasants wings laying about stage. 

Does not the op use high tech gear? Did he not post a picture of wings 

[shovel leaner 7,650]

1 hour ago, Underdog said:

Ok, good points but the intelligence has to be very good or all the latest kit will still miss something!

I use my daytime walks and knowledge of the land to look for sign and listen to the pheasants. They will tell you if a fox is about. Wrens too will tell you if a predator is in thick cover.

A fresh turd, a pheasants wing or two.

Put a brick or stone on favorite runs, they love to mark them etc.

So when I go for a "wonder" with a lamp I have a good idea where to hang around.

I do fancy a trail camera though!

 

U.

I agree with a lot of what you say . I read an interesting article recently by an old timer who like us was not convinced of the value of Thermal / night vision . What he said rang true These new innovations can help someone get on terms with foxes , but should not replace field craft and knowledge of your quarry. Like with  a sat nav , you should still be able to read a map . Put it together with listening out for a jay or a magpie or a cock pheasant, knowledge of wind direction, likely routes taken by Charlie . Technology should never replace skill , only enhance it . 

[ianm 2,594]

1 hour ago, Underdog said:

Yes absolutely..... As long as you or whomever puts the tail cameras in the right places!

How many cameras is enough?

That could be like answering how long is a piece of string?

By the time the ground is covered completely by cameras you won't have time to process all the data??

The siting of trail cams is down to knowing your ground. On any given piece of ground foxes will invariably use the same routes, fox after fox, year after year.

It takes me half an hour every other day to read the cameras and replace bait if required.

Technology  doesn't replace field craft it enhances it. On the other hand if you are a dimmock ( not speaking about ud ) no amount of high tech gear will help you, you will merely be a dimmock with good gear.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Underdog said:

Does not the op use high tech gear? Did he not post a picture of wings 

He does but i don't believe he uses trail cams, hence the wings, probably. 

[Underdog 2,337]

He does but i don't believe he uses trail cams, hence the wings, probably. 

 

Fair play  

[shovel leaner 7,650]

13 hours ago, ianm said:

The siting of trail cams is down to knowing your ground. On any given piece of ground foxes will invariably use the same routes, fox after fox, year after year.

It takes me half an hour every other day to read the cameras and replace bait if required.

Technology  doesn't replace field craft it enhances it. On the other hand if you are a dimmock ( not speaking about ud ) no amount of high tech gear will help you, you will merely be a dimmock with good gear.

 

 

 

He does but i don't believe he uses trail cams, hence the wings, probably. 

The wings were pigeon wings . But there are pheasant wings on the shoot . The foxes are clearing up a lot of the walking wounded which is probably a help . I expect most keepers are seeing them now shooting has started. I don’t use trail cams yet . But I don’t say never . This place has lots of deer and badgers , so I’ve always thought that they would feature heavily on any footage . Making a tedious job of looking through the captured images. 

Edited November 8, 2018 by shovel leaner

[shovel leaner 7,650]

20 hours ago, ianm said:

Oh i know only to well how many there would be if i didn't hammer them relentlesly. The lad that runs our shoot and one of his mates used to walk round with a lamp every now and then, or try to react to seeing pheasants, partridge or ducks that had been eaten. When i joined the syndicate he asked me to have a go at them because he knew i used different methods and to be frank i have more time than him. As you know using a thermal spotter and a decent n/v scope, plus the intelligence you gather from trail cams is a far more productive method than wandering about with a lamp. 

I used to love the terrier work when i was younger but i am a bit too old to be digging 8,10,12 foot holes now. No i rely on the rifle these days, as the keeper says you can shoot ten while you're digging one and he see's every dead fox as a good thing.  

With regards to terrier work , I love it and can still put a shift in on the shovel when I have to .?unless I’m out with the hounds I always approach down wind and quietly net up . I much prefer to bolt them and use my shovel to lean on , hence the name I use on here .

[Born Hunter 17,763]

20 minutes ago, shovel leaner said:

With regards to terrier work , I love it and can still put a shift in on the shovel when I have to .?unless I’m out with the hounds I always approach down wind and quietly net up . I much prefer to bolt them and use my shovel to lean on , hence the name I use on here .

Personally I find shooting foxes with a rifle boring as f**k.  Nothing like bolting them from drains or earths or even bushing them out of the rough stuff. Never worked bails much but it's something I want to do more of.

Rifles will usually kill the most foxes but there has to be an element of enjoyment. I'm quite happy to delegate lamping duties to my brother. 

[Underdog 2,337]

1 hour ago, shovel leaner said:

With regards to terrier work , I love it and can still put a shift in on the shovel when I have to .?unless I’m out with the hounds I always approach down wind and quietly net up . I much prefer to bolt them and use my shovel to lean on , hence the name I use on here .

I did wonder.....

[Underdog 2,337]

1 hour ago, Born Hunter said:

Personally I find shooting foxes with a rifle boring as f**k.  Nothing like bolting them from drains or earths or even bushing them out of the rough stuff. Never worked bails much but it's something I want to do more of.

Rifles will usually kill the most foxes but there has to be an element of enjoyment. I'm quite happy to delegate lamping duties to my brother. 

That's why I do it with low powered rifles and black powder or conventional shotgun. I have to stalk in close.

It more me and them, one on one sort of thing.

I know professional folk view it differently and have been there myself.

 

U.

[shovel leaner 7,650]

1 hour ago, Born Hunter said:

Personally I find shooting foxes with a rifle boring as f**k.  Nothing like bolting them from drains or earths or even bushing them out of the rough stuff. Never worked bails much but it's something I want to do more of.

Rifles will usually kill the most foxes but there has to be an element of enjoyment. I'm quite happy to delegate lamping duties to my brother. 

I find the fox a challenge. I pursue him in every possible way . The most effective is shooting with a rifle . Snaring is also a valuable tool , and accounts for a great many foxes . But for me the most enjoyable and purest form of control is hunting and in particular the foot packs in the Lake District. I get up there after the shooting season is over and follow the hounds .

[Born Hunter 17,763]

Just now, shovel leaner said:

I find the fox a challenge. I pursue him in every possible way . The most effective is shooting with a rifle . Snaring is also a valuable tool , and accounts for a great many foxes . But for me the most enjoyable and purest form of control is hunting and in particular the foot packs in the Lake District. I get up there after the shooting season is over and follow the hounds .

Had the pleasure of staying with a few huntsmen for a week of hunting a few times through a hunting mate. Following fell hounds is unforgettable. Hounds being held back, terrier in the rocks, on a near vertical face with wind howling. Awesome stuff. The border packs are good for that too.

[ianm 2,594]

4 hours ago, shovel leaner said:

The wings were pigeon wings . But there are pheasant wings on the shoot . The foxes are clearing up a lot of the walking wounded which is probably a help . I expect most keepers are seeing them now shooting has started. I don’t use trail cams yet . But I don’t say never . This place has lots of deer and badgers , so I’ve always thought that they would feature heavily on any footage . Making a tedious job of looking through the captured images. 

I know what you mean but sheep and cattle are the worst for it. However it doesn't take long to scroll through the captured images.

1 hour ago, shovel leaner said:

With regards to terrier work , I love it and can still put a shift in on the shovel when I have to .?unless I’m out with the hounds I always approach down wind and quietly net up . I much prefer to bolt them and use my shovel to lean on , hence the name I use on here .

It's such a long time since i went out with terriers. You have just reminded me how much i used to enjoy the anticipation of whether a fox would bolt into a net or not. Great times they were.

24 minutes ago, Underdog said:

That's why I do it with low powered rifles and black powder or conventional shotgun. I have to stalk in close.

It more me and them, one on one sort of thing.

I know professional folk view it differently and have been there myself.

 

U.

Which is fine if you aren't accountable for looking after large numbers of gamebirds.

I can just picture the scene if i turned up with a lamp and muzzle loading rifle to control foxes. I don't think it would take the keeper long to say "foxtrot oscar and come back with something proper".

[Underdog 2,337]

I don't lamp with a frontstuffer.

 

There are no more good keepers around me anymore, just jumped up demi gods that like their bums felt.

I got out and can enjoy just caring for my wild birds and birds walking off their shoots.

The last keeper that had an ungrateful attitude to me paid dearly!