Another school shooting in America

[WILF 46,646]

I suppose it’s like anything else, we all like to think we would fix bayonets and charge blindly into the fray........but until you are on the ground and in the reality who knows.

6 minutes is barely enough time to access the situation and decide on a course of action.......this officer would have been just as useless dead I suppose.

By the time he had made a plan of action it’s all over.

This smells a little bit like the media trying to rubbish the armed person / first responder in a school idea.......and they will happily make this poor dude a pariah to suit their politics. 

Jmho

[Deadeye18 164]

Radio 2 talking about it now.Yardley is on talking carp as usual.

[PMul 145]

The Police are not there to rescue you.

They are there to contain the situation, until SWAT / specialty teams turn up.

Most Officers will and do go beyond the call of duty and engage the perpetrator but that is not what their trained to do.

A lot of my friends are LEO, they hate it when I point this out, but they can't argue it.

 

As for the Officer that didn't go in............he's already died a thousand deaths, each day can only get worse. 

[Born Hunter 17,751]

36 minutes ago, PMul said:

The Police are not there to rescue you.

They are there to contain the situation, until SWAT / specialty teams turn up.

Most Officers will and do go beyond the call of duty and engage the perpetrator but that is not what their trained to do.

A lot of my friends are LEO, they hate it when I point this out, but they can't argue it.

 

As for the Officer that didn't go in............he's already died a thousand deaths, each day can only get worse. 

Apparently regular LEOs are supposed to engage, NOT wait for specialist units.

I agree on the final part. The SRO will feel like shit now. But that has to be addressed for the future.

[socks 32,253]

5 hours ago, WILF said:

I suppose it’s like anything else, we all like to think we would fix bayonets and charge blindly into the fray........but until you are on the ground and in the reality who knows.

6 minutes is barely enough time to access the situation and decide on a course of action.......this officer would have been just as useless dead I suppose.

By the time he had made a plan of action it’s all over.

This smells a little bit like the media trying to rubbish the armed person / first responder in a school idea.......and they will happily make this poor dude a pariah to suit their politics. 

Jmho

The difference is wilf he is trained to do this job ... he will have had firearms training he will have done hostage training armed attack scenarios put in situations where he has to think quickly and asses the situation formulate a plan and act on it .... he didn't do any of that he fell apart and froze whilst he listened to kids getting killed ... he will rightly carry that shame and guilt with him like a ball and chain for the rest of his life ......

[THE STIFFMEISTER 15,734]

8 hours ago, Rusty_terrier said:

I'm judging him. Apparently the rule is in an active school shooting enter immediately not to wait for back up.  This coward done nothing. 

A lot of very brave lads here charging valiantly into the fray , 

have any of you any idea of the man power required to “roll one , bump two “ ? 

Floor and room clearances are a long chaotic activity , certainly nothing like what some of the John McLean’s think . 

Could that lad have have saved lives if he’d entered? 

Probably 

should he have entered on his own? 

Probably 

would he have sustained injuries? 

Probably highly likely 

was he right to wait on support? 

Easy to say no , but don’t forget , that shooter had a semi automatic rifle , considerably more firepower than the 9mm or the shotgun the deputy had 

 

 

 

[PMul 145]

1 hour ago, Born Hunter said:

Apparently regular LEOs are supposed to engage, NOT wait for specialist units.

I agree on the final part. The SRO will feel like shit now. But that has to be addressed for the future.

That’s what they want you to think

 

so you get that safe, warm looked after feeling. 

Their not. 

First and foremost they are there to contain and let the specialty teams deal with it  

 

 

[Born Hunter 17,751]

1 minute ago, PMul said:

That’s what they want you to think

 

so you get that safe, warm looked after feeling. 

Their not. 

First and foremost they are there to contain and let the specialty teams deal with it  

 

 

It don't give me any feeling mate. I'm just stating what I'm led to believe is a fact. Regular cops are told to engage an active shooter and not wait for SWAT. SWAT are useless when most attacks are over inside of their response time, hence the change in protocol.

[THE STIFFMEISTER 15,734]

That officer could have walked in there and had his head blown clean off from 200m away 

one guy with a 9mm can’t even open a door effectively . 

[Born Hunter 17,751]

Just now, THE STIFFMEISTER said:

That officer could have walked in there and had his head blown clean off from 200m away 

one guy with a 9mm can’t even open a door effectively . 

I'm not saying it's the right call by the US agencies and depts but it is what they tell their officers to do. Like i have said f**k loads of times, whatever went wrong needs evaluating and correcting. I'm not judging this SRO.

If they need better training, selecting, deploying in pairs, with more appropriate weaponry, whatever.

[THE STIFFMEISTER 15,734]

If that shooter had been in the gym nasium with a bushmaster , that deputy may as well have had a stick . 

I’m not saying he was right to wait , but he almost certainly wouldn’t have been tucking his own kids goodnight again . 

 

[Born Hunter 17,751]

I think to say he did nothing is unfair. He got to the scene and I believe liaised with other LEOs to help give a better equiped force the info they need on the situation. Whether he bottled it or just made a monumental mistake I don't know but I don't think it's fair to imply he was hiding or anything.

[THE STIFFMEISTER 15,734]

So what ? 

So he should have just valiantly ran in like Mel Gibson ? 

You don’t get it because you don’t know , I live in a theee bed house , it would take at least five armed officers to clear my house safely 

5 in a house 

1 ina school just doesn’t go 

[Born Hunter 17,751]

Just now, Rusty_terrier said:

I think I read he was there well before others and was seen on cctv hiding behind a concrete pillar 

I'd call that taking cover but yeah he was there. What I mean is it's possible he did what he thought was his duty. He wasn't just hiding in a cupboard waiting for the banging to stop.

[Born Hunter 17,751]

1 minute ago, Rusty_terrier said:

It was protocol for his job thats what they paid his wages for thsts whst he signed up to do what don't you get about that? 

 

Yes he should have followed protocol and ran in and tried to make a difference like he agreed when he took the job. 

 

 

I can't argue with that. That is how they're told to respond. While the shooter is occupied with killing folks, get in a kill him. I don't write the rules but that is the fact of it.