Brightmoor Bred Dog

[Rabbit Hunter 6,613]

But from what we read, Buck and Breay are the only ones mentioned. That must count for something?

[rob284 1,682]

16 minutes ago, Rabbit Hunter said:

But from what we read, Buck and Breay are the only ones mentioned. That must count for something?

Your only known if you let yourself be known. Plenty of lads across the north would have been doing the same but wouldnt be portraying themselves to be big breeders like breay or nuttall. These small time breeders in numerous backyards in small circles of local people will vastly outweigh the volume of dogs that buck and breay could have ever produce.

[rob284 1,682]

2 minutes ago, W. Katchum said:

It may not have been as easy as today but folk deffo stole travelled for pups an linings back in them days, and as for diff types who’s to say that’s not just because they all added summat a bit diff to the dogs if buck an breay or-vice versa

I agree what your saying but do you really think buck and breay where the only people to infuse bull in the fifties and produce black dogs? Naive to think so. Jmo

[Rabbit Hunter 6,613]

Yeah I see what you mean. But I still think the black dogs all come from the same small gene pool. What's the chances that different groups of men were producing blacks in different parts of the country at near enough exactly the same time?

 

[black stuff 129]

Most of Mr Brays terriers were red in colour in the seventies Bingo etc.

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

Glad I'm not the only sceptic Rob .

[chesney 5,451]

They continued lines of fell terriers that they had access to at that time plenty lads doing the same today jmo on it it anyway. 

[Tratante 92]

Found these old photos of Bill, Doug and Stan when we were at Bill's place, he is holding a dog that he gave me. The photos of the terriers are non-descript northern working terriers photos taken around 1979, the black small lurcher is one of the best lamping dogs I ever had and tough as old boots.

[chesney 5,451]

Nice pics tratante thanks for sharing them might get this terrier section going again.

[neil cooney 10,416]

On 11/18/2017 at 16:50, rob284 said:

I agree what your saying but do you really think buck and breay where the only people to infuse bull in the fifties and produce black dogs? Naive to think so. Jmo

Genuine question here Rob, but is there genuine evidence that Buck or Breay put bull into their family of terriers ?

Real evidence I mean, I never listen to the old "you only have to look at them to see it" ? 

[donnyc 1,203]

35 minutes ago, Tratante said:

Found these old photos of Bill, Doug and Stan when we were at Bill's place, he is holding a dog that he gave me. The photos of the terriers are non-descript northern working terriers photos taken around 1979, the black small lurcher is one of the best lamping dogs I ever had and tough as old boots.

Nice to see they had the borders

 

[rob284 1,682]

8 minutes ago, neil cooney said:

Genuine question here Rob, but is there genuine evidence that Buck or Breay put bull into their family of terriers ?

Real evidence I mean, I never listen to the old "you only have to look at them to see it" ? 

No, could have been black lab for all anyone knows. You dont have to listen to it but id say bull is a very educated assumption.

[donnyc 1,203]

On 18/11/2017 at 17:33, black stuff said:

Most of Mr Brays terriers were red in colour in the seventies Bingo etc.

Agree I had one gifted in the 70s a red dog no brains though lot of bull in it head like a bucket but no brain in it LOL

[neil cooney 10,416]

1 minute ago, rob284 said:

No, could have been black lab for all anyone knows. You dont have to listen to it but id say bull is a very educated assumption.

Everyone's entitled to their own opinions and at the end of the day it's the last 5 or 6 generations that are more important than terriers that were alive 40 plus years ago.

But, having read just about everything that's ever been wrote about those 2 gentlemen and having seen or in my possession plenty of pedigrees of their terriers I would be surprised in Cyril Breay ever used a bull terrier or a terrier he knew had bull in it. Frank Buck on the other hand seemed to be a bit more of a maverick and might have, but again, I've never seen any evidence that he did. But I could be wrong ?

People see a strong head, smooth coat and straight away shout "bull". How did the Staff itself get a strong head and jaw as well as a smooth coat ? From breeding for performance, that's how. So why wouldn't there be lines of strong headed smooth terriers who's breeders have bred the best to the best for a job and have no bull blood in them ???? They are out there.

 

[donnyc 1,203]

33 minutes ago, neil cooney said:

Everyone's entitled to their own opinions and at the end of the day it's the last 5 or 6 generations that are more important than terriers that were alive 40 plus years ago.

But, having read just about everything that's ever been wrote about those 2 gentlemen and having seen or in my possession plenty of pedigrees of their terriers I would be surprised in Cyril Breay ever used a bull terrier or a terrier he knew had bull in it. Frank Buck on the other hand seemed to be a bit more of a maverick and might have, but again, I've never seen any evidence that he did. But I could be wrong ?

People see a strong head, smooth coat and straight away shout "bull". How did the Staff itself get a strong head and jaw as well as a smooth coat ? From breeding for performance, that's how. So why wouldn't there be lines of strong headed smooth terriers who's breeders have bred the best to the best for a job and have no bull blood in them ???? They are out there.

 

Whatever but when the man himself said theres a touch of bull who do I believe Breay or your opinion..As the saying goes paper never refuses the ink