Labour Leadership Election

[green lurchers 16,589]

 

ukip is the 2nd place party local to me

Round our way it's the go to party for ordinary working blokes mate, we have seen the area invaded by Africans given a big chunk towards their mortgage while ordinary people are treated like shit by Thurrock council.

Schools ruined by people who have no intention of trying to fit in or become part of the community.

Eastern Europeans coming out your f***ing ears, lads are getting up at 4:30 every morning and driving through massive traffic jams just to be given an £ parking ticket and a congestion charge of £12 before they have even earned a penny.

It's all happened under Labour and Tory government and shows no sign of slowing up.........if everyone lived the life of a Thurrock resident, they would all be voting UKIP too

 

chaffrica theyl do a documentary one day on the place, not only do they get help with a mortgage they got enough to buy a car better than one I can afford , I work all my life and they don't do a tap , bit of a headscratch to the locals eh, ukip is the working mans party nowdays

Edited July 27, 2016 by green lurchers

[J Darcy 5,871]

 

 

 

 

Honestly all the talk of electability with the GE 4 years away is just a distraction from one the main points of Corbyn's leadership, reforming the internal party structures and giving more power to the members. Something that absolutely terrifies the out of touch careerists and the establishment as a whole.

 

It looks like Labour are headed for a long stint in opposition regardless of who's leading the party so might aswell make good use of the time and get rid of the neoliberal Blairite cancer while we've got the chance. Doing the whole country a service IMO

You certainly are loyal to Corbyn ha ha . But, do you not think the real leftist side of politics is now out of fashion and dated. The world has moved on and now we are faced with important issues such as people coming over here and trying to kill us, the massive benefit cost and uncontrolled immigration. The working man has been shafted by labour and can we really say that Corbyn is for the real grass-roots working man?

I'm honestly not that loyal to Corbyn, there's others I'd rather see leading the party but he's our best shot at getting the badly needed reforms made so he's got my backing for now.

 

I'd say the 300,000 people joining the party and the huge support he gets when he's travelling the country shows there's at least some appetite for his policies. I can't think of another politician who currently enjoys the level of grassroots support that Corbyn does, only Farage would come close but I don't see hundreds of thousands of people joining UKIP. I mean who else in politics these days could raise £4 million in 48 hours or mobilise thousands of supporters onto the street at a moments notice like we saw during the first days of coup attempt?

OK...let's take this a bit further, what policies does Corbyn have that is for the working man in the UK?..... as in, how do you think his leadership of the Labour party and his views is PRO the working man?

Their infrastructure investment schemes, commitments to protecting and strengthening workers rights, introducing a real living wage, actually building some fecking houses so folk can get out of the private rental sector (and feck me over ), protecting what remains of our heavy industry I mean I could go on but you get the idea, if you're really interested in going in depth on their economic policy I can give you some resources but fecked if I'm going into the complexities of it all on THL at 10.30 in the morning

 

 

 

You see, that's what I don't get, you say strengthening UK workers rights, but how is allowing uncontrolled immigration of cheap labour helping any worker in the UK? Immigration of low paid workers is the worst thing that can happen to the working man. More and more large companies are employing foreign labour as they are cheap and one less job for the UK working man. This is a fact mate!

How is building houses helping the working man....if he cannot afford to get a mortgage ?

How is Corbyn 'protecting' heavy industry?

[WILF 46,636]

 

 

ukip is the 2nd place party local to me

 

Round our way it's the go to party for ordinary working blokes mate, we have seen the area invaded by Africans given a big chunk towards their mortgage while ordinary people are treated like shit by Thurrock council.

Schools ruined by people who have no intention of trying to fit in or become part of the community.

Eastern Europeans coming out your f***ing ears, lads are getting up at 4:30 every morning and driving through massive traffic jams just to be given an £ parking ticket and a congestion charge of £12 before they have even earned a penny.

It's all happened under Labour and Tory government and shows no sign of slowing up.........if everyone lived the life of a Thurrock resident, they would all be voting UKIP too

chaffrica theyl do a documentary one day on the place, not only do they get help with a mortgage they got enough to buy a car better than one I can afford , I work all my life and they don't do a tap , bit of a headscratch to the locals eh, ukip is the working mans party nowdays

Mate I'm back fairly regular and as much as I like seeing friends and familiar places, a few days and I can't wait wait to get on the plane and f**k off back to the middle of nowhere.

It's fecking horrible.

The rows those wogs used to cause at school time was outrageous, they are f***ing animals.

And there's the council threatening to take sick people's goods and property because they was a few days late with the council tax.......do I miss all that?.....do I f**k!

[BGD 6,436]

 

 

 

 

 

Honestly all the talk of electability with the GE 4 years away is just a distraction from one the main points of Corbyn's leadership, reforming the internal party structures and giving more power to the members. Something that absolutely terrifies the out of touch careerists and the establishment as a whole.

 

It looks like Labour are headed for a long stint in opposition regardless of who's leading the party so might aswell make good use of the time and get rid of the neoliberal Blairite cancer while we've got the chance. Doing the whole country a service IMO

You certainly are loyal to Corbyn ha ha . But, do you not think the real leftist side of politics is now out of fashion and dated. The world has moved on and now we are faced with important issues such as people coming over here and trying to kill us, the massive benefit cost and uncontrolled immigration. The working man has been shafted by labour and can we really say that Corbyn is for the real grass-roots working man?

I'm honestly not that loyal to Corbyn, there's others I'd rather see leading the party but he's our best shot at getting the badly needed reforms made so he's got my backing for now.

 

I'd say the 300,000 people joining the party and the huge support he gets when he's travelling the country shows there's at least some appetite for his policies. I can't think of another politician who currently enjoys the level of grassroots support that Corbyn does, only Farage would come close but I don't see hundreds of thousands of people joining UKIP. I mean who else in politics these days could raise £4 million in 48 hours or mobilise thousands of supporters onto the street at a moments notice like we saw during the first days of coup attempt?

OK...let's take this a bit further, what policies does Corbyn have that is for the working man in the UK?..... as in, how do you think his leadership of the Labour party and his views is PRO the working man?

Their infrastructure investment schemes, commitments to protecting and strengthening workers rights, introducing a real living wage, actually building some fecking houses so folk can get out of the private rental sector (and feck me over ), protecting what remains of our heavy industry I mean I could go on but you get the idea, if you're really interested in going in depth on their economic policy I can give you some resources but fecked if I'm going into the complexities of it all on THL at 10.30 in the morning

 

 

 

You see, that's what I don't get, you say strengthening UK workers rights, but how is allowing uncontrolled immigration of cheap labour helping any worker in the UK? Immigration of low paid workers is the worst thing that can happen to the working man. More and more large companies are employing foreign labour as they are cheap and one less job for the UK working man. This is a fact mate!

How is building houses helping the working man....if he cannot afford to get a mortgage ?

How is Corbyn 'protecting' heavy industry?

 

 

Strengthening worker's right and introducing a living wage makes it harder for them to be undercut by immigrant workers and who say's we'd have uncontrolled immigration under Corbyn anyway Importing a load of unskilled workers to undercut the native workforce is a neoliberal policy, not socialist in any way.

 

Building more houses brings house prices down making a mortgage more affordable? Then there's social housing for those that still can't afford to buy.

 

He hasn't got the power to do anything about heavy industry now, he's in opposition. But you can look at the pressure he put on the government over Tata steel for an idea of how him and his team feel about protecting industry

[BGD 6,436]

The fact of the matter is, to your ordinary Joe Soap it don't really matter who wins.......what matters most IMHO is that both parties get enough MPs to be an effective foil to whoever has enough to form the government.

Then hopefully policy ends up in about the right place.

 

That's democracy in action.

 

We have seen the damage that politicians with massive majorities (Blair !!) or even not really elected at all (Europe) can do.......over 3000 new laws under Blair and countless rules and regulations under the EU, you need a polar opposite opposition to clip the wings of government.

It's no fecking good if they are all working to the same agenda, that's what has got us in this shit in the first place.

 

That's a man who get's it

 

Corbyn has been smashing the neoliberal consensus that got us into the situation we're in now where there's no real difference between the main parties so we've no real choice when it comes to elections. Both parties need clear and distinct principles and policy for our style of democracy to really work, IMO.

[BGD 6,436]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Further behind the Torys than when Foot was leader in 83, you was only 2 weeks ago how he was doing so well in the polls or do they only matter when your trying to bolster his position?

Polls are part of the picture no doubt but the numbers are no worse than I'd expect considering we're in the middle of probably the most bitter and public battle the party has ever seen and the Tories have just had a nice smooth hand over to a relatively popular new leader. The fact he was doing relatively well in the polls all things considered before all this shit shows the current drop is the fault of the plotters.

What's silly is using polls 4 years out from an election to try and predict the result

 

If the PLP would unite behind him Labour would have as a good a chance as they could hope for of winning the next GE the problem is they're not interested in winning on a true leftist platform and they're scared of the reforms he wants to bring in to make the party more democratic and the MPs more accountable.

The PLP won't support him as they're are career politicians that crave power, they know as long as Corbyn is leader they have 0 chance of attaining that power so they want shut.

See you're half right there but their fear isn't that they can't win elections under Corbyn it's the fact that he wants to reform the party making it harder for careerist MPs that don't serve their constituents to keep their jobs. They've said repeatedly they would rather lose under a Blairite platform than win under Corbyn.

 

This battle really isn't about "electability" on either side, what it comes down to is a power struggle for the future of the party with self-serving careerists on one side and principled democrats on the other.

Yes but, don't you think that many people realise that there is absolutely no way that Corbyn would ever win a GE. Ever. And that is the reason they want him removed?

No one in the PLP polls that much better than Corbyn. Labour's electability issues predate Corbyn by a long time and won't be improved by any other leadership contender that's been floated so far according to the polls.

In your own words "polls 4 years from a general election don't mean much".......cmon mate in one breath you're rubbishing polls then in the next using his strength in the polls as a point of your argument.

Would rather lose an election with than blairites than win without???

Don't people vote to try and get there party elected, sounds like he's more concerned with shafting the blairites than actually being elected. Why doesn't he start his own independent Labour Party if he doesn't want to work with them?

 

 

I said they don't mean much, I didn't say the mean nothing. You can't argue it's all about electability then back a candidate that polls worse or the same as Corbyn, that's just silly. Of course the coup has been one blunder after another so I guess "silly" is just SOP for the rebels in the PLP

 

Of course I'd rather lose an election and get rid of the Blairites and other self-serving careerists than win on a Blairite platform, they represent everything that is wrong with modern British politics and the corruption of the principles of the labour movement in favour of power at any cost and it'd be good for the country as a whole to get rid of them for good.

I think a real democratic socialist Labour party can do more good for the country in opposition offering a real alternative to Tory policy challenging the consensus and making the party more democratic than a Blairite Labour party in power continuing along the neoliberal path. Just look at how close some of May's economic proposals are to Miliband's, a man who was considered to far left to be electable just a year ago, that's a result of the neoliberal austerity narrative being challenged by the opposition and alternatives being provided to the public. The u-turns on various cuts too, none of that would have happened with an opposition copying Tory policy and agreeing with their narrative.

 

Corbyn's only been leader for 9 months and he's already helping to change the political landscape and getting more people than ever engaged in politics and involved at a grassroots level

[Kay 3,709]

Jeremy comes across as an approachable sort of bloke... he isn't polished like some of the political elite I quite like that ...

 

I am not liking that Owen smith very career driven smarmy twat

[BGD 6,436]

Jeremy comes across as an approachable sort of bloke... he isn't polished like some of the political elite I quite like that ...

 

I am not liking that Owen smith very career driven smarmy twat

 

Aye Smith has the same smarmy polished PR image as Blair and Cameron and all the rest of them, nothing genuine about the man.

[BGD 6,436]

 

 

Richard Burgon has been on top form recently, expect to see a lot more from him in the future.

[BGD 6,436]

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2016/jul/29/jeremy-corbyn-im-very-optimistic-video-interview

 

Good to see my pal looking so relaxed and feeling optimistic

[Paulnix 426]

Optimistic, deluded or just electioneering to keep his job ?

 

Although I've never voted labour so far I think as he was elected into the role it is his and those MP's trying to push him out are only after their own gains and would join any party to ride the gravy train.

[BGD 6,436]

Online and television media show a clear and consistent bias against Corbyn, this is after the study last week that found that the print media is heavily biased against him too.

 

 

Measuring how much airtime and online coverage was focused on the embattled leader’s allies and opponents, the research found “a marked and persistent imbalance in favour of sources critical of Jeremy Corbyn, the issues that they sought to highlight, and the arguments they advanced.”

 

As Corbyn faced mass resignations, the report’s authors accused the mainstream media of “imbalanced reporting” that could affect the democratic process, finding the BBC’s flagship 6pm evening TV bulletins gave double the amount of airtime to Corbyn’s political enemies than those still backing him.

In contrast, it found the ITV evening news bulletins, and the BBC’s online news were “relatively balanced” in their reporting.

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-corbyn-media-bias-bbc_uk_579a3cd7e4b06d7c426edff0

Edited July 29, 2016 by BGD

[tatsblisters 9,470]

Nothing will please me more than to see the destruction of the labour party seeing what they have done to the town i live.

[J Darcy 5,871]

Online and television media show a clear and consistent bias against Corbyn, this is after the study last week that found that the print media is heavily biased against him too.

 

 

Measuring how much airtime and online coverage was focused on the embattled leader’s allies and opponents, the research found “a marked and persistent imbalance in favour of sources critical of Jeremy Corbyn, the issues that they sought to highlight, and the arguments they advanced.”

 

As Corbyn faced mass resignations, the report’s authors accused the mainstream media of “imbalanced reporting” that could affect the democratic process, finding the BBC’s flagship 6pm evening TV bulletins gave double the amount of airtime to Corbyn’s political enemies than those still backing him.

In contrast, it found the ITV evening news bulletins, and the BBC’s online news were “relatively balanced” in their reporting.

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-corbyn-media-bias-bbc_uk_579a3cd7e4b06d7c426edff0

Now you know how UKIP feel!!!

[BGD 6,436]

 

Online and television media show a clear and consistent bias against Corbyn, this is after the study last week that found that the print media is heavily biased against him too.

 

 

Measuring how much airtime and online coverage was focused on the embattled leader’s allies and opponents, the research found “a marked and persistent imbalance in favour of sources critical of Jeremy Corbyn, the issues that they sought to highlight, and the arguments they advanced.”

 

As Corbyn faced mass resignations, the report’s authors accused the mainstream media of “imbalanced reporting” that could affect the democratic process, finding the BBC’s flagship 6pm evening TV bulletins gave double the amount of airtime to Corbyn’s political enemies than those still backing him.

In contrast, it found the ITV evening news bulletins, and the BBC’s online news were “relatively balanced” in their reporting.

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-corbyn-media-bias-bbc_uk_579a3cd7e4b06d7c426edff0

Now you know how UKIP feel!!!

 

 

I've never seen any studies showing there's clear bias against UKIP across the whole of the mainstream media? There's been two showing there is against Corbyn.

 

UKIP definitely get a battering by the liberal press but it is actually possible to find positive pieces on Farage and UKIP in the mainstream press and Farage and his supporters are generally brought on to defend their position without being totally misrepresented, a privilege the LSE found was rarely given to Corbyn and his backers. While UKIP is treated unfairly by some sections of the press some of the time Corbyn gets it from all sides all the time, UKIP even had two major papers endorse them at the last election.

 

Article by one of the people at LSE involved in the study

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/jeremy-corbyn-media-bias-labour-mainstream-press-lse-study-misrepresentation-we-cant-ignore-bias-a7144381.html

Edited July 30, 2016 by BGD