Labour Leadership Election

[BGD 6,436]

Neutral is currently beating Smith

Edited August 6, 2016 by BGD

[mackay 3,330]

I'm not a fan of Corbyn, but at least you can tell the difference between him and the government.

For a long time it was difficult to differentiate between the two main parties and individual politicians.

Oppositions are meant to be opposite and oppose each other and give people a wider more clear choice.

Don't matter if you yourself agree with them, it's a healthier democracy all round.

[scothunter 12,609]

He's one scruffy looking c**t,and he needs to tidy up his garden instead of attending pointless rallies

[tatsblisters 9,508]

Two intresting conversations this morning one with the Socialist party and the other with Momentum tbh BGD was right in what he was saying in reply to my posts looking back on hindsight it was like alighning UKIP to far right groups who were supporting UKIP.The chap I spoke to from Momentum a retired plasterer was just an ordinary working class bloke like myself and I have to admit I was impressed with his replys to some of my questions even on immigration.

[BGD 6,436]

Two intresting conversations this morning one with the Socialist party and the other with Momentum tbh BGD was right in what he was saying in reply to my posts looking back on hindsight it was like alighning UKIP to far right groups who were supporting UKIP.The chap I spoke to from Momentum a retired plasterer was just an ordinary working class bloke like myself and I have to admit I was impressed with his replys to some of my questions even on immigration.

 

Fair play to you for actually going out to engage with them and hear what they had to say to make up your own mind instead of just believing what you've read in the papers about them pal

 

 

I'm not a fan of Corbyn, but at least you can tell the difference between him and the government.

For a long time it was difficult to differentiate between the two main parties and individual politicians.

Oppositions are meant to be opposite and oppose each other and give people a wider more clear choice.

Don't matter if you yourself agree with them, it's a healthier democracy all round.

Good post pal Bit in bold is bang on

[tatsblisters 9,508]

The SWP had a table about 20yds from momentum and when I asked the chap from momentum are you any thing to do with the SWP he sternly said no their nothing to do with us.I did not engage in any convo with the SWP it was the Socialist Party who were in another part of town who I spoke to they fully support Corbyn but they told me their members have been asked not to do any thing to bring any negative's on Corbyn.

[BGD 6,436]

Good to hear they won't have anything to do with those scumbags

[tatsblisters 9,508]

One thing that struck me was some thing the chap from momentum said all those in the media and what not out to get Corbyn realise if Corbyn ever did get power he would get knowledge on were all the body's are buried in other words corrupt dealings former goverments have kept from Joe public.

[BGD 6,436]

One thing that struck me was some thing the chap from momentum said all those in the media and what not out to get Corbyn realise if Corbyn ever did get power he would get knowledge on were all the body's are buried in other words corrupt dealings former goverments have kept from Joe public.

 

Exactly pal, the establishment have every reason to try and keep Corbyn or any other anti-establishment politician out of power. The idea of any kind of change to the current system terrifies them

[BGD 6,436]

Corbyn answering some questions sent in by readers of The Mirror

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/jeremy-corbyn-answers-your-questions-8575417

And a good interview on Radio Cornwall ahead of the rally he held down there today

Edited August 6, 2016 by BGD

[BGD 6,436]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/08/06/you-dont-need-to-settle-for-the-future-the-tories-are-creating/

What kind of country do you want to live in? One where you don’t have to raid your savings to pay for your children’s university education? Or perhaps you’d like to live in a country where the care for your elderly parents was based on their needs. You might even be one of the thousands of Southern Rail passengers who only wants to get on a train, find a seat and arrive on time.

If you’re one of those people, or the countless others who have been let down in the last six years by the devastation of our public services, then let me tell you why the Labour Party is the party for you.

Over the last six years you’ve been deceived on a scale not seen since Bernie Madoff’s infamous Ponzi scheme. Time and again you’ve been told that to build a strong economy we had to tighten our belts and cut public funding. Today we have the utterly self-defeating reality of rapidly declining public services while our debt is going up.

Take the NHS: irrespective of where you live, it is likely that your local hospital is in debt – per cent of hospitals are. Just a few weeks ago the Government announced that hospital debt in England was a staggering £2.45 billion. Let’s put that into context, when the Conservatives came to power the NHS was breaking even. Knowing the cost of the Government’s cuts is only half the equation, the price you and me are paying is far higher.

Waiting times are up; critically cancer waiting times are up. In some parts of the country a GP appointment is as rare as hen’s teeth. We are spending over £2 billion a year on agency and contract staff. If you want to truly understand the almost Kafkaesque state of the NHS in Tory Britain today then look at King’s College Hospital in London. Hugely in debt, they are paying a freelance contractor the equivalent of £715,000 per year to be their “turnaround” director.

The fact is the NHS has not been given the resources it needs. That means you and me are getting a worse service. That’s why a couple of days ago I promised that the next Labour government would end the pointless and expensive internal market in the NHS that, according to independent health economists, costs over £3 billion per year. Let’s stop giving away money to £1,000 a day management consultants and put that back in to our NHS.

Some of you might not think I have much to be grateful for these days – but there’s one thing I thank my lucky stars for every morning: I don’t have to travel on Southern Rail. If there is one example of how the intransigent ideology of this Government outweighs the public interest it’s Southern Rail.

Long before Southern Rail cut over 300 services it is legally contracted to deliver, its passengers were facing a woefully inadequate service: delays, overcrowding, cancellations, late running trains were the norm. Yet instead of recognising the plight of millions of passengers and telling Southern Rail where to get off, the Government continues to support them with our money.

That’s why Labour’s pledge to return the railways into public ownership is the right one. It would deliver the two crucial elements a public service needs, investment and a good deal for those using it. And don’t doubt that Governments can’t run railways. In 2009, following the collapse of the National Express rail franchise for the East Coast Mainline, the Government took over operation of the service.

In five years of “public ownership”, the publicly run East Coast Trains had one of the highest rates of punctuality, offered the best price on tickets and made £1 billion – every penny of which went back to the Government. Under Labour, the Government would use the income from publicly-owned rail to invest, improve and expand our rail services in the UK, making your journey to work, or to visit family faster, cheaper and more reliable.

The overwhelming case for publicly run, publicly owned rail and NHS applies to so many parts of our public services. I don’t want a social care system where the elderly and disabled are nothing more than an entry on a balance sheet – amounting to some of our most vulnerable sold off in units of time.

And it makes no sense that we saddle future generations with billions of pounds worth of debt because they chose to go to university. These young people should be looked to as our future economic assets, not cash cows.

The fact is, the economic decisions this Government is making are out of choice not circumstances. The choice for you and millions like you is what type of country you want. A country investing in jobs, in services, in education – or a Government whose ideological drive is to reduce the public services millions of people use and need; a Government that knows the price of everything and the cost of nothing.

Even if you don’t think of Labour as your natural political home, if you value your NHS, care for the elderly, want an education system for all and a public transport system that works for its passengers, then it may be time to think again.

Jeremy Corbyn is the leader of the Labour Party and Her Majesty's Most Loyal Opposition

Corbyn reaching out to folk who wouldn't usually vote Labour in the Telegraph today

[WILF 46,661]

I would say to him "Jezza, it's been tried.......it's old hat......it didn't work before and there's no reason to think it will now.......you have all had a go at throwing other people's money at every problem like it going out of fashion and it has ALWAYS failed......time to put workers money in the hands of workers and let them make the best choice of how to use it"

 

[BGD 6,436]

I would say to him "Jezza, it's been tried.......it's old hat......it didn't work before and there's no reason to think it will now.......you have all had a go at throwing other people's money at every problem like it going out of fashion and it has ALWAYS failed......time to put workers money in the hands of workers and let them make the best choice of how to use it"

 

And he'd say "It's off to the gulag for you Comrade WILF"

 

Seriously though I think it's a real shame there's no party really putting forward a libertarian argument in the UK, even UKIP has been getting less and less libertarian as they try and chase ex-Labour voters. Goes back to what we've been saying all along about needing a wider range of views in parliament to have a really healthy functioning democracy

 

 

Out of interest how far would you take your libertarian ideas? Obviously some amount of taxation and public spending is needed to keep the country running but what would you consider to be the bare minimum?

Edited August 7, 2016 by BGD

[WILF 46,661]

I'd start at zero and work from there mate.......then I would look at the things government are ACTUALLY there to do which is defence, civil security and justice and infrastructure then tot up what that costs and spread evenly (which should make the rate of tax about 5%) then stop.

 

I would make sure every government official (both local and national) knew that they are ENTITLED to no mans private money and what they are given is a gift not a due.

 

But hey, that's in an ideal world and you have so many obligations that you would have to honour that it's fantasy......but that's where it should be IMHO

Edited August 7, 2016 by WILF

[BGD 6,436]

Fair play pal a reasonable position that you've obviously put thought into, even if I am in total disagreement Comes down to the role we believe government should play I suppose and safe to say neither of us will be converting the other any time soon

 

Much as I disagree with the libertarian position I'd like to see those views better represented in parliament, anything has to be better than the various shades of neoliberal we have now and folk like you deserve to a have a party that truly represents you

 

I think both of us realise our ideologies would only work in their purest form in an ideal world really, nothing wrong with aiming for that ideal world though