On The Topic Of Dogs Failing To Make The Grade

[Puzzled 8]

.heres one for you,what about a sire and a dam of a litter of pups,the sire is rock hard and has been dug to for well over 6 seasons,the dam is a right battle axe and mixes it with her quarry and has been dug to for almost as long as the sire ...and all the pups failed to make the grade..and this season both dog and bitch have been dug to again without fail on numerous occasions.How the hell does this happen,the dogs are line bred to a certain extent and up to this point have been bred by putting worker to worker,the failures culled and still this situation arises,whats your thoughts on this folks..

[rob284 1,682]

You will never have a 100% guarenteed line of machines but in that situation if you had a proven line out of proven producers you might question how they were entered.

[Puzzled 8]

thays not in question i must say,the men that took these dogs have good management skills where entering is concerned..they were all over 16 months before getting a look but they were out from 11 months watching the adult dogs do their thing,they were only allowed to rag the dead,and the pups from this litter were divided by 3 men and all failed...everyone is bewildered as to why this has happened but we just need to get on with it and try again but these 2 dogs will never be mated again,

[pirate pack 109]

Sometimes pups bred out of worker to worker that should produce digging dogs on paper, just produce rubbish its unlucky that none worked.If it was has easy has this their wouldn't be the amount of crap about. Welcome to the world of terriers its not full of world beaters has some will have you believe.

[Pick and bar 381]

Hmm are they related? Has the line showed problems before? 3 gens and then probs etc, any bad mouths, cleft palates, usual inbreeding clues. Sometimes it just don't jell !!!

I've been there my friend and it hurts!

Never getting any thing near the expectations, best to best don't always work.

And some yard dog gets over a terrier type, and the greatest digging dog in local history emerges!!!!!

Why does this wonderful life torment us, when we think we have it cracked!!!!!

[bobhow 57]

its not enough just the parents are good solid workers they have to come from a good line of solid workers all you need is a dodge on the dame side and a quitter on the sires side to come through and thats that a litter of crap .how did the parents brothers and sisters work were they as good or were they nothing to right home about that said some dogs just dont jell

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

No expert but just asking .How many ,on average would you cull from a litter in the past .Has this number declined as the line progresses ,stayed pretty much the same or have there been more culls in recent litters .Were the parents from the same line or brought together to create a new line as it were .Are you expecting more from this litter than its capable of producing ie Has the bitch produced anything decent before .Just because a bitch is an outstanding worker does not mean she can pass that on by a long way .Has the sire been put to any of her like ,sisters mother etc .If the line is established and this is a glitch ,write the fact down and steer clear of similar matings .If the dog has produced then i would revert to putting him over a daughter .Sometimes i would say a line can become too strung out with too many dogs alive at one time so as to either be at a loss with what to breed to what or breeding for the hell of it .

[taz2010 1,297]

even though you have a brilliant dog and brilliant bitch sometimes they can produce shite,seen this happen over the years try taking both down a different root as that combination obviously does not work takes time and effort to get a right breeding pair ive had great workers over the years that produced half decent pups and after altering breeding even changing a bitch can make a difference

[rippem 455]

Just because one is a worker doesn't mean there gonna produce workers..sometimes that all they are is just workers..there is workers then there is producers..it's always nice to bred worker to worker doesn't guarantee amything..sometimes that one nobody wants is the producer..in the pitbull, when your working your dog's and bred them we keep the whole litter and take a look at them for there working ability and then bred them.to find out Wich ones are producing and Wich ones are working and the ones in between get rid of...jmo

[Puzzled 8]

its not enough just the parents are good solid workers they have to come from a good line of solid workers all you need is a dodge on the dame side and a quitter on the sires side to come through and thats that a litter of crap .how did the parents brothers and sisters work were they as good or were they nothing to right home about that said some dogs just dont jell

these dogs were all bred from proven stock,all that were bred from were seen worthy of mating toigether..The man that bred them knows every dog going back a long way....all can say is the owner found them worthy of mating together and hes done a lot of digging over the years,hes had some very successful outcomesinprevious litters...

[Puzzled 8]

No expert but just asking .How many ,on average would you cull from a litter in the past .Has this number declined as the line progresses ,stayed pretty much the same or have there been more culls in recent litters .Were the parents from the same line or brought together to create a new line as it were .Are you expecting more from this litter than its capable of producing ie Has the bitch produced anything decent before .Just because a bitch is an outstanding worker does not mean she can pass that on by a long way .Has the sire been put to any of her like ,sisters mother etc .If the line is established and this is a glitch ,write the fact down and steer clear of similar matings .If the dog has produced then i would revert to putting him over a daughter .Sometimes i would say a line can become too strung out with too many dogs alive at one time so as to either be at a loss with what to breed to what or breeding for the hell of it .

this was the bitches first litter,the sire produced a few good workers from another related bitch 2 years ago,1 failed in that litter 3 made extremely good dogs and are still holding their own...

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

You have your answer then mate

[taz2010 1,297]

the problem then lies in the bitch dont breed from her again try her litter sister or another,no one is saying both dogs are not 100% when line breeding you can sometimes have a dog or bitch that does not produce good pups sometimes its the gene of the individual thats why i have spent 17 years to get what i have, had a dog around 9 years ago his father and mother were one of the best i owned bitch produced some great pups first time i mated her, lost the father that season put her to the dog second mating 3 failed and 2 were bayers,tried the dogs brother the following year and had 5 of the 6 made the grade it does happen but if the lad has kept the line with others he will need to change the mating without looseing the line

[TOPPER 1,809]

some dogs arnt good producers and if you put 2 super dooper workers together that arn t producers you end up with crap been there done it next box of cartridges please

[HPR 1,161]

I had a really good dog put him over three different bitches all line bred . All ended up shite . Put him to a scatter bred bitch as a favour for a friend produce a decent litter . Then he accidently shagged his sister and produce two world beaters . So who knows that's the highs and lows of the terrier world . It can make or brake you . It's a hard game but when it comes right it's the best game . Don't let your head drop . Just try again with different dog . All I will say is if you do try her again treat it like its her first litter and don't let the real first litter make you have rash decision .