No More Collie Greys

[Somewhereyournot 1,117]

 

 

A bull in its own right is an inteligent dog.

I think some people think they are just muscle bound thick dogs far from it.

Easily trainable.very eager to please you. High prey drive.very high pain threshold.

That mixed with collie and grey.

I don't think you can go far wrong.

if there that good what is the point in adding collie then king? Lol

I think you know the answer mate no need for me to tell you.

Brains.

i know why I like collie x mate. But you said their not thick, easy trainable, wanting to please etc with high prey drive.

So if they are all of the above, Duno why you would add collie blood that lacks drive, picks it's runs and basically crap. Just saying

[Somewhereyournot 1,117]

 

Without turning it into a Hancock slagging match , are you saying you wouldn't feed one because it's not out of working collie? And not actually on ability.

To me there's more to a lurcher than just killing a fox.

i can only go by what av seen work an the onea i have picked what they wanted run when they wanted half hearted an that was at rabbits years ago handcock used working dogs got a name for his self throw the dogs working the amount of handcock dogs bred now jusr so people can say i own a hancock dog its the same as bull pie an golly lines its deluted down from the orignal line

fair comment I suppose, but all the collies are from the same blood, more or less. if a greyhound or horse has good blood in it, but don't make the grade, why are they still bred off and sometime produce top dogs /horses?

You can't honestly say by breeding worker to worker guarantees you a 100% working dog

Edited February 6, 2016 by Somewhereyournot

[king 11,972]

 

 

 

A bull in its own right is an inteligent dog.

I think some people think they are just muscle bound thick dogs far from it.

Easily trainable.very eager to please you. High prey drive.very high pain threshold.

That mixed with collie and grey.

I don't think you can go far wrong.

if there that good what is the point in adding collie then king? Lol

I think you know the answer mate no need for me to tell you.

Brains.

i know why I like collie x mate. But you said their not thick, easy trainable, wanting to please etc with high prey drive.

So if they are all of the above, Duno why you would add collie blood that lacks drive, picks it's runs and basically crap. Just saying

Youve said your self In the past that you don't like bull X and that fair enough.

But do you think adding a dash of bull blood into the dog you've got now.

Would benefit the dog in any way.

[rough dog 333]

Did you sell all your pups Rough Dog?

Yes mate all gone thanks ..kept a bitch pup back.

[the trunk 2,859]

 

 

Without turning it into a Hancock slagging match , are you saying you wouldn't feed one because it's not out of working collie? And not actually on ability.

To me there's more to a lurcher than just killing a fox.

i can only go by what av seen work an the onea i have picked what they wanted run when they wanted half hearted an that was at rabbits years ago handcock used working dogs got a name for his self throw the dogs working the amount of handcock dogs bred now jusr so people can say i own a hancock dog its the same as bull pie an golly lines its deluted down from the orignal line

fair comment I suppose, but all the collies are from the same blood, more or less. if a greyhound or horse has good blood in it, but don't make the grade, why are they still bred off and sometime produce top dogs /horses?

You can't honestly say by breeding worker to worker guarantees you a 100% working dog

you can bred 2 tubes an get a working dog . Everyone looks to the name of breding if you have a hancock dog an a run of the mill bred collie grey bitch bred them an the pups turn out everyone will look at the name hancock but all the trades come from the bitch . Il always go for working anilty over breding if by luck it has a good bloodline happy days if not am still happy

[Somewhereyournot 1,117]

 

 

 

 

A bull in its own right is an inteligent dog.

I think some people think they are just muscle bound thick dogs far from it.

Easily trainable.very eager to please you. High prey drive.very high pain threshold.

That mixed with collie and grey.

I don't think you can go far wrong.

if there that good what is the point in adding collie then king? Lol

I think you know the answer mate no need for me to tell you.

Brains.

i know why I like collie x mate. But you said their not thick, easy trainable, wanting to please etc with high prey drive.

So if they are all of the above, Duno why you would add collie blood that lacks drive, picks it's runs and basically crap. Just saying

Youve said your self In the past that you don't like bull X and that fair enough.

But do you think adding a dash of bull blood into the dog you've got now.

Would benefit the dog in any way.

its not that I don't like bull xs, it's because everyone thinks you need bull in a lurcher and you don't.

If I added bull to my dog it would decrease his stamina, making him heavier potentially ruining his turning ability. Iv seen a good few bull xs just don't tickle my fancy. If I wanted an either pig dog then Ye, makes sense. Or like trunk he targets foxes mainly then a fighting dog x obviously will be a better choice. But Thera more to a lurcher than killing things you can't eat. There's some bull xs out there good on edible , but I dare say you gets higher percentage from collie greys that take all game , cleaner AND quicker.

Just my opinion at the end of the day. I know lads taking all sorts with Hancock lurchers so they can't be that bad. Do a damn slight more than most the people on here moaning about quarry numbers or weather that's for sure lol

[Somewhereyournot 1,117]

 

 

 

Without turning it into a Hancock slagging match , are you saying you wouldn't feed one because it's not out of working collie? And not actually on ability.

To me there's more to a lurcher than just killing a fox.

i can only go by what av seen work an the onea i have picked what they wanted run when they wanted half hearted an that was at rabbits years ago handcock used working dogs got a name for his self throw the dogs working the amount of handcock dogs bred now jusr so people can say i own a hancock dog its the same as bull pie an golly lines its deluted down from the orignal line

fair comment I suppose, but all the collies are from the same blood, more or less. if a greyhound or horse has good blood in it, but don't make the grade, why are they still bred off and sometime produce top dogs /horses?

You can't honestly say by breeding worker to worker guarantees you a 100% working dog

you can bred 2 tubes an get a working dog . Everyone looks to the name of breding if you have a hancock dog an a run of the mill bred collie grey bitch bred them an the pups turn out everyone will look at the name hancock but all the trades come from the bitch . Il always go for working anilty over breding if by luck it has a good bloodline happy days if not am still happy

your right, everyone always pick faults with hancocks, but it ain't out of habit the same guys go back and make a good dog from them. People need to forget the name Hancock and appreciate a particular dog for what it does not what it is.

[Ideation 8,216]

Somewhereyourenot - Don't take this the wrong way, but how old are you?

 

And second question. . . . .. how many good bull x's have you seen work? You've obviously seen some decent enough collie greys, but are your comments on bull x's based on any genuine experience?

 

I used to be a little breed blind in some ways, I do like a good collie blooded dog. . . . shit, I've got three fecking collies here! But I've got to say that the mix of bull and collie goes a log way to being ideal for me, in what I've seen.

 

Yer, there may be more to a lurcher for many, than killing a fox. . . .. but for some folk there really isn't! And thats not a bad thing, and to somehow imply that those dogs are one trick ponys or somehow inferior. . . . . is bollocks.

 

Ive seen some very very good collie x's, and I've seen some very very good bull x's. . . . . . . and id probably say that all round, the top end of the bull x's were more capable than the top end of the collie x's. At the end of the day, the pit bull isn't just a fighting dog, its the ultimate canine athlete. . . . . with more drive than any other breed id say.

 

Trainability. . . . . wouldn't say there was much between them. Only thing. . . . . some bull x lines are buggers to break to stock etc. . . . takes a while.

 

I feel that the right collie is massively important in breeding a good line of collie x's. . . . . same as the sighthound side. Its just one of many reasons I wouldn't go to hancock. . . . but more so, I don't like the idea of lining a puppy farmers pockets, even if some good dogs are born there, and he is all above board.

 

As to what a collie adds to a bull lurcher. . . . . i'd say better feet, coat, and wind. . . . . the bull blood adds tenacity, hard headedness, and the ability to pick itself up when things have gone proper pete tong. . . . and wade back in.

 

Ive seen collie x's absolutely eat a fox alive, and I've seen bull x's carry rabbits back live to hand. . . . its all out there and not so clear cut.

 

But you've got to respect the bull x. . .

 

Twice, I've seen a bull x take an incredible amount of punishment, that id be very sure most other dogs would have walked away from. . . . . . to the point where the bitch was vomiting, pissing blood, bleeding from holes in most parts of her body . . . . . . . .and yet she stood toe to toe with her opponent (who incidentally weight five times or more her bodyweight) until help arrived (in human form) and she was relieved of her duty. That was edible quarry by the way . . . .

 

I'm rambling now so i'll shut up

[Wales1234 5,512]

Iv got both a collie X and a bull X two totally different dogs my bullx is a old girl now and she's gone her duty to almost death and I will honestly cry my eyes out when that bitch goes I know that bitch will do her job 100% till the death and is commited to getting the job done if she was a few years younger I'd never leave the yard without her that's why iv bred from her !

My collie X is only young and can see she loves to work and hunt can see her being much of a out and out killer but she will pick rabbits up for fun and probably run dusk till dawn if I let her !

And iv got a bitch with collie and bull in her and well she hunts like feck all day and loves to kill bit collie is in there and she's a thinker and knows when she's beat just my expericence with both collie and bull blood

[Somewhereyournot 1,117]

Somewhereyourenot - Don't take this the wrong way, but how old are you?

 

And second question. . . . .. how many good bull x's have you seen work? You've obviously seen some decent enough collie greys, but are your comments on bull x's based on any genuine experience?

 

I used to be a little breed blind in some ways, I do like a good collie blooded dog. . . . shit, I've got three fecking collies here! But I've got to say that the mix of bull and collie goes a log way to being ideal for me, in what I've seen.

 

Yer, there may be more to a lurcher for many, than killing a fox. . . .. but for some folk there really isn't! And thats not a bad thing, and to somehow imply that those dogs are one trick ponys or somehow inferior. . . . . is bollocks.

 

Ive seen some very very good collie x's, and I've seen some very very good bull x's. . . . . . . and id probably say that all round, the top end of the bull x's were more capable than the top end of the collie x's. At the end of the day, the pit bull isn't just a fighting dog, its the ultimate canine athlete. . . . . with more drive than any other breed id say.

 

Trainability. . . . . wouldn't say there was much between them. Only thing. . . . . some bull x lines are buggers to break to stock etc. . . . takes a while.

 

I feel that the right collie is massively important in breeding a good line of collie x's. . . . . same as the sighthound side. Its just one of many reasons I wouldn't go to hancock. . . . but more so, I don't like the idea of lining a puppy farmers pockets, even if some good dogs are born there, and he is all above board.

 

As to what a collie adds to a bull lurcher. . . . . i'd say better feet, coat, and wind. . . . . the bull blood adds tenacity, hard headedness, and the ability to pick itself up when things have gone proper pete tong. . . . and wade back in.

 

Ive seen collie x's absolutely eat a fox alive, and I've seen bull x's carry rabbits back live to hand. . . . its all out there and not so clear cut.

 

But you've got to respect the bull x. . .

 

Twice, I've seen a bull x take an incredible amount of punishment, that id be very sure most other dogs would have walked away from. . . . . . to the point where the bitch was vomiting, pissing blood, bleeding from holes in most parts of her body . . . . . . . .and yet she stood toe to toe with her opponent (who incidentally weight five times or more her bodyweight) until help arrived (in human form) and she was relieved of her duty. That was edible quarry by the way . . . .

 

I'm rambling now so i'll shut up

most of what you've said or asked Iv said above in a reply. I'm going off all round lurchers and this isn't being a dig to bull x as I do respect what Iv seen them do myself.

The guy asked why isn't there more collie grey being bred and why bull greys , then I asked why tough dog thought bull benefit a collie grey, was a genuine question. For rabbit hare deer and foxes to the average person I would say a collie grey would tick the boxes better than a bull grey.

I'm not arguing collie bull greys aren't good, Iv only seen two. Both were shit, but that's only two dogs.

You seem to think that I'm the one who's been "picking" but when you see people say collie greys picks runs, sensitive, don't make the grade etc then why the hell would u add that to a bull grey that is suppose to be the bollocks? Surely adding Wheaton or deerhound would increase coat, wind, and better feet would it not? Seeing as bull xs are just as trainable as collie xs

[johnrthrfrd 223]

Got a collie grey with a bit whippet in might be owld fashioned but prefer them to out with bull in it.

[Ideation 8,216]

 

Somewhereyourenot - Don't take this the wrong way, but how old are you?

 

And second question. . . . .. how many good bull x's have you seen work? You've obviously seen some decent enough collie greys, but are your comments on bull x's based on any genuine experience?

 

I used to be a little breed blind in some ways, I do like a good collie blooded dog. . . . shit, I've got three fecking collies here! But I've got to say that the mix of bull and collie goes a log way to being ideal for me, in what I've seen.

 

Yer, there may be more to a lurcher for many, than killing a fox. . . .. but for some folk there really isn't! And thats not a bad thing, and to somehow imply that those dogs are one trick ponys or somehow inferior. . . . . is bollocks.

 

Ive seen some very very good collie x's, and I've seen some very very good bull x's. . . . . . . and id probably say that all round, the top end of the bull x's were more capable than the top end of the collie x's. At the end of the day, the pit bull isn't just a fighting dog, its the ultimate canine athlete. . . . . with more drive than any other breed id say.

 

Trainability. . . . . wouldn't say there was much between them. Only thing. . . . . some bull x lines are buggers to break to stock etc. . . . takes a while.

 

I feel that the right collie is massively important in breeding a good line of collie x's. . . . . same as the sighthound side. Its just one of many reasons I wouldn't go to hancock. . . . but more so, I don't like the idea of lining a puppy farmers pockets, even if some good dogs are born there, and he is all above board.

 

As to what a collie adds to a bull lurcher. . . . . i'd say better feet, coat, and wind. . . . . the bull blood adds tenacity, hard headedness, and the ability to pick itself up when things have gone proper pete tong. . . . and wade back in.

 

Ive seen collie x's absolutely eat a fox alive, and I've seen bull x's carry rabbits back live to hand. . . . its all out there and not so clear cut.

 

But you've got to respect the bull x. . .

 

Twice, I've seen a bull x take an incredible amount of punishment, that id be very sure most other dogs would have walked away from. . . . . . to the point where the bitch was vomiting, pissing blood, bleeding from holes in most parts of her body . . . . . . . .and yet she stood toe to toe with her opponent (who incidentally weight five times or more her bodyweight) until help arrived (in human form) and she was relieved of her duty. That was edible quarry by the way . . . .

 

I'm rambling now so i'll shut up

most of what you've said or asked Iv said above in a reply. I'm going off all round lurchers and this isn't being a dig to bull x as I do respect what Iv seen them do myself.

The guy asked why isn't there more collie grey being bred and why bull greys , then I asked why tough dog thought bull benefit a collie grey, was a genuine question. For rabbit hare deer and foxes to the average person I would say a collie grey would tick the boxes better than a bull grey.

I'm not arguing collie bull greys aren't good, Iv only seen two. Both were shit, but that's only two dogs.

You seem to think that I'm the one who's been "picking" but when you see people say collie greys picks runs, sensitive, don't make the grade etc then why the hell would u add that to a bull grey that is suppose to be the bollocks? Surely adding Wheaton or deerhound would increase coat, wind, and better feet would it not? Seeing as bull xs are just as trainable as collie xs

 

 

Well. . . . I think your question can be answered quite simply. For some folk, adding collie to a bull line works.

 

But you sure as hell wouldn't add a run picking, sensitive jacker would you? You'd use a good collie blooded lurcher.

 

Just like if adding bull to a collie line, you wouldn't use a dog fighting, person biting, windless lump, with feet like a duck.

 

I don't really get what you're asking, and don't take this the wrong way, but its just sounds a bit petulant, as the folk adding collie blood to bull lines, obviously don't think they are all useless, sensitive, run picking jackers. . . . do they.

 

P.S To the OP - I think you will probably find that collie crosses are just as 'cool' as bull x's. . . . there is a lot of hubris found amongst collie x owners. . . . who believe their dogs are the pinnacle of lurcher work, and somehow a dying breed they must save . . . . ironic when the biggest lurcher farmer in the country breeds collie x's. . . . .

[rough dog 333]

There are good and bad points in any breed of Lurcher and some of the best I've seen have been pedigree unknown. if you want to breed yourself a pup you look at the bitch and work out how to improve on her...in my case it was adding a little bull blood by means of a very handy dog of a mate on THL. the pups all turned out as expected ,intelligent ,obedient, good stamina and temperament but with more drive and commitment than the 1st cross.

We can't categorise every collie/ grey or bull cross ...we can only speak on experience of what we have owned or seen for ourselves.

My opinion on a 1st cross collie/grey is that it is a perfect starting point to help you breed the type of lurcher that you need or want for your own circumstances.

[frankel 2,123]

A bull in its own right is an inteligent dog.

I think some people think they are just muscle bound thick dogs far from it.

Easily trainable.very eager to please you. High prey drive.very high pain threshold.

That mixed with collie and grey.

I don't think you can go far wrong.

i agree

[frankel 2,123]

In my experience, collie X can do everything a bull X can but a lot more wind for big numbers rabbits etc and better all round dog. I've never seen any collie X pick n choose runs and bull X I've seen would rather collapse than Jack in...if your a terrier man, the bull X jaw power is needed I think. Make easier work of Charlie etc.

My eyes certainly got opened when I seen good bull x in action around holes