English Bull And Their Crosses Thread.

[peterhunter86 8,627]

 

Are you into the bull breeds francie

 

I like them myself but i wouldnt be clued up on them iv had one or two and when i was a kid i had a mongerel pup off a well known bull called starsky the 2nd

 

Yeah pete loved me bulls mate

 

Are you into the bull breeds francie

Yeah pete loved me bulls mate

[rob284 1,682]

 

 

To reinstate gameness is to admit youve cocked up but to maintain it is to preserve.Bull breeds have a place in this decision.

 

I hear ya FD, BUT in your opinion is there not more than a few lines of good working terriers out there that IF needed the same result could be got by using as an outcross ?

OR, are you like some other good breeders out there, who, when they needed an outcross were too proud to ask another terrierman so used a bull type as a shortcut whilst also not having to say they used such and such's dog ?

Genuine question , with no harm meant but I know of well known breeders who've done such.

Neil - Ive never used a straight staff but have used bull infused stuff from a lad i know well .I take the short cut if you like and im not embarrassed to say either .There is more than one strain over here that uses a bull to maintain size as well as the rest it brings .IMO there are many breeders about who would benefit from this cross and it is they who are too proud to admit it .

what sort of bull was in the stuff you have used fd? Staff, ebt or other? Id say the main benefit is size, especially when you have a game strain of terrier that will give its all but can get pushed about due to lack of physical substance.

[YOKEL 2,229]

at the end of the day, it's down to the individual to choose what he wants to cross into his own line of dogs, and if he's only breeding for himself alone, then he could add Pomeranian if his heart desired. but why dilute working blood with a breed that has never been bred to work? that non working blood is then in the mix to rear it's head in later generations. as mr cooney said, there are enough good hard working terriers out there, so why add a breed that's to big with no working heritage? each to his own i suppose...A.T.B.

Yokel

[neil cooney 10,416]

 

 

Lol at neil, there was a few good ebt, an ebt crosses used on old bill years back, there werent just show dogs imo

You're talking about the trials, right ?

There were EBTs that certified as sounders too and there was a lad who also qualified his beagles. I've seen breeds you wouldn't believe run a chute.

Yes a couple of EBT's did leave there mark but if in todays climate you said that you have EBTs that are the real deal and that you'll put your money where your mouth is I would say that your phone would be hopping with offers.

The dog in this vid neil, red hand of ulster, champion badger dog, he was a goodun, not manyperformed like him neil you reckon.

 

The Red Hand of Ulster was over 50 lbs. What do you reckon ????

There were 3 dogs in the history of the trials that went their whole career without ever being disqualified. He wasn't one of them.

So that's that question answered.

[neil cooney 10,416]

 

 

To reinstate gameness is to admit youve cocked up but to maintain it is to preserve.Bull breeds have a place in this decision.

I hear ya FD, BUT in your opinion is there not more than a few lines of good working terriers out there that IF needed the same result could be got by using as an outcross ?

OR, are you like some other good breeders out there, who, when they needed an outcross were too proud to ask another terrierman so used a bull type as a shortcut whilst also not having to say they used such and such's dog ?

Genuine question , with no harm meant but I know of well known breeders who've done such.

Neil - Ive never used a straight staff but have used bull infused stuff from a lad i know well .I take the short cut if you like and im not embarrassed to say either .There is more than one strain over here that uses a bull to maintain size as well as the rest it brings .IMO there are many breeders about who would benefit from this cross and it is they who are too proud to admit it .

 

I've no problem with anyone who's truthful about any blood they introduce into their terriers FD and let's face it you have to be honest with yourself first and foremost before being truthful with others.

If a man wants to make an outcross and does come across someone with a good 1/4 or 1/8 bull cross to use then IMO that's like a gift from the gods.

But this thread is about the English Bull Terrier, not proper working bull types.

The EBT is the product of James Hinks specific breeding project to produce a tough looking show dog. Simple as that.

The EBT is as a rule a cur and anyone who'd introduce it into a line of working terrier for anything other than looks IMO has no concept of what's required in a working terrier.

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

Rob-Its staff mate ,no greater than 1/4 or preferrably 1/8.Many will disagree but most black dogs will have staff not too far back in the makeup .

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

Understood Neil and as ive no experiencd of EBT whatsoever i will cloud the waters no more lol.

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

Just out of interest Neil, do you know what the modern ebt was created from as my own memory is of a pug faced ,bow legged bull going back years that was referred to as ebt

[Francie 6,368]

Just out of interest Neil, do you know what the modern ebt was created from as my own memory is of a pug faced ,bow legged bull going back years that was referred to as ebt

Old english white terrier?

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

They were white mate or off white maybe ,ugly feckers too.Were they the base for ebt though .

[BGD 6,436]

The EBT is made up of British Bulldog, Old English White Terrier and Dalmatian probably some old bull & terrier types added into the mix too, certainly later on in the breeding Staffords were used, that's where the coloured type comes from.

[Francie 6,368]

Yeah fd, old english terrier crossed with old english bulldog i think mate

[YOKEL 2,229]

Just out of interest Neil, do you know what the modern ebt was created from as my own memory is of a pug faced ,bow legged bull going back years that was referred to as ebt

off the top of my head, hinks took the "old bull and terrier" types, which where the fore runners of what would become known as staffordshire bull terriers. he crossed these with the white english terrier, then dalmation, whippet etc etc, to create a white bodied, refined bull terrier for the dandys to prance about with. the coloured version was created by crossing back into the old bull and terriers...there is a fella, who i believe is called kevin kane, he 's the man for the history on these dog's...

[neil cooney 10,416]

The lads above have more or less described the origin of Mr Hinks baby. One thing I do know about the breed is that when ear cropping became illegal those behind the breed were breeding dogs with pricked ears within 3 generations.

Does that sound like something that's done with a working breed ?

 

I've seen a few EBT crosses that done a bit but they tend to be flukes but IMO the greatest of all the EBT crosses and he must have been a fluke was "Frisco Sport".

Just my historical curiosity has me interested in such dogs, nothing more, nothing less.

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

Thanks lads ,never delved into that before .