For Everyone That Had An Intruder

[neems 2,406]

 

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZSs4xfBvaY

As you can see by that video even though the dog is doing damage a 40-50lb dog can be dragged about and manhandled to a degree whereas with a 80lb+ dog your going nowhere unless it's the dog doing the dragging about.

 

 

I haven't been bitten like that without a sleeve on so don't know,but do you not think if the dog wants to anchor down and keep you stationary most people would do so out of pain compliance?

[neil cooney 10,416]

 

To small for a Boerboel IMO and they usually docked, but not always.

I've a friend breeds them. They're direct SA imports.

to day talking to a mate who lives by me , is picking up a bitch boerboel pup next week from London . he said it from top import working lines, and its cost him £ 1600 quid , bloody hell my 2 dogs only cost £ 40 quid lol. he had it as guard dog, he works away a lot so his mrs is on her own fair bit. he got male dogs there all ready (hounds) he was advised to get a bitch , as a male boerboel can be very dominant, so bitch be easier to keep with the other dogs . I still think a bel/mal or good gsd be better and cheaper to buy ..!!

 

That price wouldn't surprise me as my mates dog was £2000 a stud five or six years ago and the stud price is usually the price of one pup.

They are very impressive dogs, not my cup of tea, and IMO a woman wouldn't have a chance of holding one if it wanted to go.

[unlacedgecko 1,467]

 

 

To small for a Boerboel IMO and they usually docked, but not always.

I've a friend breeds them. They're direct SA imports.

 

to day talking to a mate who lives by me , is picking up a bitch boerboel pup next week from London . he said it from top import working lines, and its cost him £ 1600 quid , bloody hell my 2 dogs only cost £ 40 quid lol. he had it as guard dog, he works away a lot so his mrs is on her own fair bit. he got male dogs there all ready (hounds) he was advised to get a bitch , as a male boerboel can be very dominant, so bitch be easier to keep with the other dogs . I still think a bel/mal or good gsd be better and cheaper to buy ..!!

That price wouldn't surprise me as my mates dog was £2000 a stud five or six years ago and the stud price is usually the price of one pup.

They are very impressive dogs, not my cup of tea, and IMO a woman wouldn't have a chance of holding one if it wanted to go.

I should think that most men would struggle to hold back a dog of that size if it really wanted to go.... There are videos on the Internet of 40lb bull breeds pulling 2000lb plus.

 

Surely, like everything, the secret is appropriate use of training aids (prong collar, e collar etc) and reward based training as a pup to produce a well behaved adult?

 

My sister breeds horses. Her stallion is over 1000kg. She is 55kg but manages him with ease.

[JDHUNTING 1,817]

 

 

 

To small for a Boerboel IMO and they usually docked, but not always.

I've a friend breeds them. They're direct SA imports.

 

to day talking to a mate who lives by me , is picking up a bitch boerboel pup next week from London . he said it from top import working lines, and its cost him £ 1600 quid , bloody hell my 2 dogs only cost £ 40 quid lol. he had it as guard dog, he works away a lot so his mrs is on her own fair bit. he got male dogs there all ready (hounds) he was advised to get a bitch , as a male boerboel can be very dominant, so bitch be easier to keep with the other dogs . I still think a bel/mal or good gsd be better and cheaper to buy ..!!

That price wouldn't surprise me as my mates dog was £2000 a stud five or six years ago and the stud price is usually the price of one pup.

They are very impressive dogs, not my cup of tea, and IMO a woman wouldn't have a chance of holding one if it wanted to go.

I should think that most men would struggle to hold back a dog of that size if it really wanted to go.... There are videos on the Internet of 40lb bull breeds pulling 2000lb plus.

 

Surely, like everything, the secret is appropriate use of training aids (prong collar, e collar etc) and reward based training as a pup to produce a well behaved adult?

 

My sister breeds horses. Her stallion is over 1000kg. She is 55kg but manages him with ease.

dont think pullind a weight on wheels proved much, I can push my van and thats bout 5000lb

[king 11,984]

 

 

Your right there gnash all dogs will perform better if kept in good condition but a purpose bred manstopper should be able to incapacitate the biggest of men long before their wind and stamina even starts to be tested.Seconds not minutes.

I,ll take your word for it mate like i said to you before thats way too much dog for me at this point in life

 

Purely out of interest,would that still apply to a man fighting back with i dont know a bat/bar tool of some kind.....is a proper manstopper expected to take punishment......if so surely condition has to come into it.

I've took a few bites off of a few big dogs that I wouldn't even class as top level pp dogs just big dogs that were learning their trade.Dogs that knew how to bite but hadn't been tested or moved up to the higher levels of environmental pressure or defensive stress and ok I'm not the biggest of fellas but they shook me about and left me bruised and sore through sleeves or bite suits for days afterwards.If a properly trained dog or even a dog that is committed to biting you properly that weighs over 80lb decides it's got bad intentions on you your not fighting back in fact your brain is not going to be even thinking.My mate owns a 120lb Neo and when my other pal aggitates her she has to be tied up with a heavy spring clipped between her lead and whatever she's tied to as she cannot be physically held back and my pals a strong fit lad.Now if a dog like that gets a real life bite the adrenaline and vibes your going to let off is going to send the dog into a completely different level of drive.So realistically if a properly trained dog gets hold of you all the theories and old wives tales of what people would do to stop it go out the window.Unless you happen to have a gun in tour hand or a knife that you know how how to use effectively your f**ked.

So your mate has got a 120lb neo that he can't handle and let's his mate wind it up.sound like a right pair of very knowledgeable lads.

[BGD 6,437]

 

 

 

Your right there gnash all dogs will perform better if kept in good condition but a purpose bred manstopper should be able to incapacitate the biggest of men long before their wind and stamina even starts to be tested.Seconds not minutes.

I,ll take your word for it mate like i said to you before thats way too much dog for me at this point in life

 

Purely out of interest,would that still apply to a man fighting back with i dont know a bat/bar tool of some kind.....is a proper manstopper expected to take punishment......if so surely condition has to come into it.

I've took a few bites off of a few big dogs that I wouldn't even class as top level pp dogs just big dogs that were learning their trade.Dogs that knew how to bite but hadn't been tested or moved up to the higher levels of environmental pressure or defensive stress and ok I'm not the biggest of fellas but they shook me about and left me bruised and sore through sleeves or bite suits for days afterwards.If a properly trained dog or even a dog that is committed to biting you properly that weighs over 80lb decides it's got bad intentions on you your not fighting back in fact your brain is not going to be even thinking.My mate owns a 120lb Neo and when my other pal aggitates her she has to be tied up with a heavy spring clipped between her lead and whatever she's tied to as she cannot be physically held back and my pals a strong fit lad.Now if a dog like that gets a real life bite the adrenaline and vibes your going to let off is going to send the dog into a completely different level of drive.So realistically if a properly trained dog gets hold of you all the theories and old wives tales of what people would do to stop it go out the window.Unless you happen to have a gun in tour hand or a knife that you know how how to use effectively your f**ked.

So your mate has got a 120lb neo that he can't handle and let's his mate wind it up.sound like a right pair of very knowledgeable lads.

I'm sure the agitation is done in a controlled environment as part of serious training. Downsouth and the lads he trains with come across as very knowledgeable and responsible lads that take training their dogs very seriously

 

Not sure why you felt the need to have a little dig to be honest.

[king 11,984]

 

 

 

 

Your right there gnash all dogs will perform better if kept in good condition but a purpose bred manstopper should be able to incapacitate the biggest of men long before their wind and stamina even starts to be tested.Seconds not minutes.

I,ll take your word for it mate like i said to you before thats way too much dog for me at this point in life

 

 

Purely out of interest,would that still apply to a man fighting back with i dont know a bat/bar tool of some kind.....is a proper manstopper expected to take punishment......if so surely condition has to come into it.

I've took a few bites off of a few big dogs that I wouldn't even class as top level pp dogs just big dogs that were learning their trade.Dogs that knew how to bite but hadn't been tested or moved up to the higher levels of environmental pressure or defensive stress and ok I'm not the biggest of fellas but they shook me about and left me bruised and sore through sleeves or bite suits for days afterwards.If a properly trained dog or even a dog that is committed to biting you properly that weighs over 80lb decides it's got bad intentions on you your not fighting back in fact your brain is not going to be even thinking.My mate owns a 120lb Neo and when my other pal aggitates her she has to be tied up with a heavy spring clipped between her lead and whatever she's tied to as she cannot be physically held back and my pals a strong fit lad.Now if a dog like that gets a real life bite the adrenaline and vibes your going to let off is going to send the dog into a completely different level of drive.So realistically if a properly trained dog gets hold of you all the theories and old wives tales of what people would do to stop it go out the window.Unless you happen to have a gun in tour hand or a knife that you know how how to use effectively your f**ked.

So your mate has got a 120lb neo that he can't handle and let's his mate wind it up.sound like a right pair of very knowledgeable lads.

I'm sure the agitation is done in a controlled environment as part of serious training. Downsouth and the lads he trains with come across as very knowledgeable and responsible lads that take training their dogs very seriously

Not sure why you felt the need to have a little dig to be honest.

I'm not knocking him at all mate and yes he does come across as very knowledgable.but if that neo wanted to have a serious go at someone his mate couldn't hold it back which seems a very sticky situation to be in.it doesent make sense to me having a dog that's being trained for protection work that the handler ant hold back.

[BGD 6,437]

That's where training comes in, no way could I physically hold back any of the mastiff types I've owned but all it took was an "easy" and they'd stop pulling me. Sure this guy has similar level of control over his dog, he just needs to be tied back when doing agitation work because you don't want to tell the dog "easy" when you're trying to get it to react.

 

Physical control shouldn't really come into it with protection dogs, you should be able to stop them with just a word. I'd be more worried by an out of control 120lb neo than one that had been trained to a decent level.

Edited December 23, 2015 by BGD

[king 11,984]

That's where training comes in, no way could I physically hold back any of the mastiff types I've owned but all it took was an "easy" and they'd stop pulling me. Sure this guy has similar level of control over his dog, he just needs to be tied back when doing agitation work because you don't want to tell the dog "easy" when you're trying to get it to react.

Physical control shouldn't really come into it with protection dogs, you should be able to stop them with just a word. I'd be more worried by an out of control 120lb neo than one that had been trained to a decent level.

I must of read it wrong BGD it sounded quite bizarre to be honest.

But now I understand the situation.

[dare 1,103]

Interesting what you said about the 60/65lb pitbulls gnasher. I have only seen 3 that sort of size but thought the same thing. One I saw very often and dog wasn't lazy but lacked the intensity when getting in doing stuff. Wouldn't ever really want one that size if I had a choice just because of that. Always thought it could just be the dogs I've seen but all 3 of them on the large size was the same.

 

I love them boerboels but some look like terrible useless fat fuckers. Going to try see some in the new year. Also like the presas some seem lovely where others look like short fat fuckers with bad legs. I just prefer to see a dog more fit than carrying a lot of unneeded weight.

 

I ain't got a clue about protection dogs but funny how some dogs seem to just want the sleeve as a game rather than stopping the bloke. Is there any sort of competition over here where you'd know if a dogs passed that it's a decent dog? Reason I ask that is I remember American bulldogs selling for around a grand, you'll now find them for 400quid with the words good guard. Most think their dogs are the best others think "why not well earn a couple of quid". Or do the competition type events tend to just show the dogs who want the sleeve as a game? Would love to wear a bite suit and just get a feel for what it's like one day.

[downsouth 7,806]

BGD just answered everything just about spot on.In everyday life the neo bitch is very very obedient and can be controlled with voice commands but like he said doing agitation you don't want to be telling a dog to stop your trying to build it up.In my opinion control is the most important thing with this type of dog.I have a young bitch her heavy neo breeding who's 24" 75lb @ 7 months I did I started off with loads of environmental training to make sure her nerves were solid then we did some light rag and pad work just to build her prey and show her how to bite equipment and for the last 2 months and probably until the spring all I do is obedience in as many different situations and places as possible and until I know I have full control even with distractions she won't get any bite work as I know she'll do all that stuff as it's in her blood it's all the other stuff which makes a complete pp dog.

[keepdiggin 9,567]

downsouth would it be possible to post a pic of the neo mate?

[DIDO.1 22,851]

Once again I'm amazed at the level of knowledge by the lads on thl.

 

These dogs terrify me but thanks for an interesting read.

[walshie 2,804]

To my untrained eye, there are 3 sorts of big dogs. The pet sort that would try its best to guard your property. My ridgeback's bark is enough to put off casual burglars for instance, and she'd have a go, but how effective she would be against a determined burglar, I wouldn't like to guess.

 

The second sort is the dog trained specifically for manwork and in the right hands is a useful tool.

 

The last sort is the "big tough" dog that mindless idiots get to make them look hard. Poorly trained, they are nothing but a liability.

[gnasher16 30,597]

until I know I have full control even with distractions she won't get any bite work as I know she'll do all that stuff as it's in her blood it's all the other stuff which makes a complete pp dog.

I like that it makes a lot of sense....same with anything you just have to have faith in the dogs breeding that its going to do what comes natural when put in that position you dont need to keep " trying it out " every 5 minutes just to put your mind at ease.....selection/breeding/schooling/showtime in that order regardless what breed or what task.