Is The Apbt The True Bulldog Or A Terrier Cross?

[South hams hunter 8,922]

Anyone got any opinions on breeding? Never had a real interest in it but another subject thats got so many different ideas and opinions. I know pedigrees dont make the dogs but people have their own ideas on what increases the chances of producing good dogs. Can say worker to worker but given the choice bet everyone would rather something bred tight than scatterbred. Maybe peoples opinions on breeding terriers can be crossed over for pits and vise versa.

was always told blood tells and I suppose if you look at roms and pors in apbts there must be aome truth in it

[gnasher16 30,121]

 

I think the dda was actually beneficial to the Apbt breed.....people who are into the true value of the breed dont give a monkeys for the dda they have more important things to worry about.....so that tends to raise the quality of dogs when they are not readily available.......the silly dogs walking around the streets today i dont think can really be called Apbt,s its like comparing a crappy little pet Labrador to a serious purpose bred working gundog yes they both carry the same breed name but they are a million miles apart to anyone with any knowledge on the breed........as a breed the Apbt has split between purpose bred performance dogs and fashion accesories.......its just the split isnt down the middle its probably 95/5......which again,for the people who continue to pursue excellence within this breed.....that isnt such a bad thing.

But whenever a Pit or Staff mix bites someone it is automatically labeled a Pitbull.... The working Pitbull has had lots of shoot off's. The AKC registered American Staffordshire Terrier and the UKC American Pitbull Terrier, later the American Bully which most certainly has Mastiff in the mix

 

My point is the people who pursue excellence within the breed dont care for laws or headlines.....they have a " great is what great does " attitude and dont even really care about trying to preserve the breeds good name.....and rightly so...............do armed robbers care about gun laws ?......no they commit wholeheartedly to what they are doing and nobody else matters........fair play i say.

[gnasher16 30,121]

 

http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=273896

 

This dog is a proper Bulldog throwback.

if you look further back its a very mixed dog but got some very old names in it. Perhaps the reason?

 

Depending what stories someone believes dictates the purity of any Tombstone dog....personally i think he was out of Baby and not Gina so that tightens up any Tombstone bred dog a bit for me.

Edited October 23, 2015 by gnasher16

[South hams hunter 8,922]

Yh thats true gnash, the thing I never get with dogs like this one is if you looked at nearly every dog on the 4th gen theyre tombstone blooded but the other half of each dog is a hotchpotch and no similarity to the next

[hollands hope 1,024]

 

 

We had a sort of Dutch equivalent to youre DDa , however it never reduced the biting incidents ,as per usual the bull breeds were to blame according to the kennelclub and the people in the " know "( how convenient). So these breeds were prohibted and restricted like euthanizing and spaying . However afther several years even the non believers had to accept that other breeds like labradors jack russels and all other popular breeds were far outweighing bullbreeds in biting icidents .In the end they scrapped the law .

Problem is when a bulldog attacks the dog will do massive damage to anyone.

Yes this argument go's on & on........but comparing pitbull attacks to jack russel attacks is like comparing 'scarred for life' to 'loss of life'..........which has sadly been the case in many cases......

 

Oh make no mistake about it ,am well aware that a pitbull who loses the plot is a deadly animal ,but that was not the point i was trying to make . The whole thing was they were looking voor a scapegoat to save theire own arses (kennelclub) so they could continue with theire money making business (breeding) .Unfortunely the pitbull and theire owners paid the price.

[AKA-BRINDLE 879]

I see someone mentioned the DDA . I don't know about Britain but in Ireland those who had the APBT truly to heart felt that all the bad publicity and the Irish DDA (he's not banned in the Republic) was the best thing to happen the breed because it got so many tossers away from the breed.

Those who held on to them were the real fanciers.

JMHO but the APBT deserves nothing but the best of owners.

 

If it got so many tossers away from the breed...why when i was over Belfast about 10 years back was it every other dog i saw on the street was a Pit Bull?...there was more in the hands of Tossers after the DDA and all the media hysteria than before...the same as it was in England...and thats not to mention the northern Irish dogmen that sold these dogs to just about any tosser with the money to buy em....and that includes asian peddlers that helped flood English cities with dogs that re-ignited a shit-storm that brought heat down on just about everyone...the thing you need to remember it wasnt just the chavs, plastic gangsters and misguided kids that fell foul of the DDA...genuine and serious dogmen got busted too...the UK's a small place with too many prying eyes and nosy neighbours...a law like the DDA will bring unwanted heat on even the best of owners...met and spoke to a lot of dog lads over the years...never heard anyone say that the DDA was the best thing ever to happen...seems to be a bit of an internet forum thing that

[gnasher16 30,121]

 

I see someone mentioned the DDA . I don't know about Britain but in Ireland those who had the APBT truly to heart felt that all the bad publicity and the Irish DDA (he's not banned in the Republic) was the best thing to happen the breed because it got so many tossers away from the breed.

Those who held on to them were the real fanciers.

JMHO but the APBT deserves nothing but the best of owners.

 

If it got so many tossers away from the breed...why when i was over Belfast about 10 years back was it every other dog i saw on the street was a Pit Bull?...there was more in the hands of Tossers after the DDA and all the media hysteria than before...the same as it was in England...and thats not to mention the northern Irish dogmen that sold these dogs to just about any tosser with the money to buy em....and that includes asian peddlers that helped flood English cities with dogs that re-ignited a shit-storm that brought heat down on just about everyone...the thing you need to remember it wasnt just the chavs, plastic gangsters and misguided kids that fell foul of the DDA...genuine and serious dogmen got busted too...the UK's a small place with too many prying eyes and nosy neighbours...a law like the DDA will bring unwanted heat on even the best of owners...met and spoke to a lot of dog lads over the years...never heard anyone say that the DDA was the best thing ever to happen...seems to be a bit of an internet forum thing that

 

In terms of quality of dogs the proof is in the pudding.....the less popular the breed has been over time the higher the quality has been i think thats what people mean in terms of the dda being a good thing................the Uk just isnt the place for serious dogmen everything is against producing top quality dogs....society,space,laws......the Uk was only ever going to be 3rd division when it came to bulldogs and even that was never going to have a long shelf life.

[Guest Navek]

 

I see someone mentioned the DDA . I don't know about Britain but in Ireland those who had the APBT truly to heart felt that all the bad publicity and the Irish DDA (he's not banned in the Republic) was the best thing to happen the breed because it got so many tossers away from the breed.

Those who held on to them were the real fanciers.

JMHO but the APBT deserves nothing but the best of owners.

 

If it got so many tossers away from the breed...why when i was over Belfast about 10 years back was it every other dog i saw on the street was a Pit Bull?...there was more in the hands of Tossers after the DDA and all the media hysteria than before...the same as it was in England...and thats not to mention the northern Irish dogmen that sold these dogs to just about any tosser with the money to buy em....and that includes asian peddlers that helped flood English cities with dogs that re-ignited a shit-storm that brought heat down on just about everyone...the thing you need to remember it wasnt just the chavs, plastic gangsters and misguided kids that fell foul of the DDA...genuine and serious dogmen got busted too...the UK's a small place with too many prying eyes and nosy neighbours...a law like the DDA will bring unwanted heat on even the best of owners...met and spoke to a lot of dog lads over the years...never heard anyone say that the DDA was the best thing ever to happen...seems to be a bit of an internet forum thing that

to be fair I think that tightening up the laws on the bull dog made most of the little cretins want them more ever weed and coke dealer wanted one as well as every tracksuit wearing plastic gang banger...soon as something is illegal ever wannabe wants it/wants to do it because it's illegal and when the people from the aisian population in Birmingham buying up pups from Ireland breeding the shit out of them them selling the pups on for a grand because they have a red nose soon ads up to half the little idiots in Birmingham London Liverpool Manchester owning and parading there cock extension around the street . Edited October 24, 2015 by Navek

[keepdiggin 9,561]

Makes you wonder why the tosa never took off

[gnasher16 30,121]

Yh thats true gnash, the thing I never get with dogs like this one is if you looked at nearly every dog on the 4th gen theyre tombstone blooded but the other half of each dog is a hotchpotch and no similarity to the next

The theory was that a tightly bred family dog crossed with a loosely bred dog with little shared ancestry would produce an explosion in the genes ( hybrid vigour )......however that type of breeding required a big yard that would need to go through a lot of dogs in order to get the real good ones...............hence more popular breeding methods tend to be rather more loose line breeding.

Edited October 24, 2015 by gnasher16

[South hams hunter 8,922]

Funny though aint it because something with abit if gaurding training/ instinct woukd make more sense navek. If I was doing risky things id want a malinois or doberman with enough bite training that he woukd help out in certain situations

[South hams hunter 8,922]

Would that really be hybrid vigour? I thought if you done a straight cross it was so?

 

Also would it not work better if you wanted a tombstone based dog that you out each one to something that was also tight? Each on that pedigree (4th gen ) barring one I think was a tombstone to a random dog/family, would it not improve your chances if they had been to a tight dog so it would perhaps read like tombstone/bolio, T/jeep, T/jocko etc. (As an example ) ?

[DogFox123 1,379]

 

Yh thats true gnash, the thing I never get with dogs like this one is if you looked at nearly every dog on the 4th gen theyre tombstone blooded but the other half of each dog is a hotchpotch and no similarity to the next

 

The theory was that a tightly bred family dog crossed with a loosely bred dog with little shared ancestry would produce an explosion in the genes ( hybrid vigour )......however that type of breeding required a big yard that would need to go through a lot of dogs in order to get the real good ones...............hence more popular breeding methods tend to be rather more loose line breeding.

Scatterbreeding can produce ace individual dogs but you won't get the consistency.... Edited October 24, 2015 by DogFox123

[neil cooney 10,416]

 

I see someone mentioned the DDA . I don't know about Britain but in Ireland those who had the APBT truly to heart felt that all the bad publicity and the Irish DDA (he's not banned in the Republic) was the best thing to happen the breed because it got so many tossers away from the breed.

Those who held on to them were the real fanciers.

JMHO but the APBT deserves nothing but the best of owners.

 

If it got so many tossers away from the breed...why when i was over Belfast about 10 years back was it every other dog i saw on the street was a Pit Bull?...there was more in the hands of Tossers after the DDA and all the media hysteria than before...the same as it was in England...and thats not to mention the northern Irish dogmen that sold these dogs to just about any tosser with the money to buy em....and that includes asian peddlers that helped flood English cities with dogs that re-ignited a shit-storm that brought heat down on just about everyone...the thing you need to remember it wasnt just the chavs, plastic gangsters and misguided kids that fell foul of the DDA...genuine and serious dogmen got busted too...the UK's a small place with too many prying eyes and nosy neighbours...a law like the DDA will bring unwanted heat on even the best of owners...met and spoke to a lot of dog lads over the years...never heard anyone say that the DDA was the best thing ever to happen...seems to be a bit of an internet forum thing that

 

I have to agree with you about the North. One thing you must remember about the North of Ireland is that strong dogs have always been a big tradition. Yes, there's been those who paraded around with them as part of the ego but there used to be a hell of a lot of fanciers who had them for the right reason.

I meant mostly the South in my post and yes, I do believe that the DDA got rid of a lot of the messers.

I'm not the only one who thinks this. Many fanciers were glad to see a lot less bulldogs running around the streets.

[dare 1,103]

I just cant see anyone who has no real love for the dogs anyway caring about the law when the worst that can happen is they loose their fashion accessory? Lifting the dda imo would some what be more help to pet owners. In the uk can you imagine anyone being able to have a yard of say 50 dogs and not having people in the area talk when they are seen walking em. Society i guess has been brainwashed by the media and the stories. If you even own a slatmill now youll be in trouble even though im sure its a legal requirement to exercise your dog. Get in trouble for wanting to keep your dog fit :/ madness.

 

Do you think european countries will soon follow suit and end up like here in years to come? Hopefully theyll be abit more sensible with who gets the dogs and the way things are run. Wish i was around before my time just to see how different things was compare to now. Have heard of sensible dog men being so unfearing about anything that they even filmed a tape giving a kennel tour lol.