AKA-BRINDLE 879 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 ive the opinion that terrier blood is certainly in the makeup of the APBT. black n tans show up in them and staffords. And where did the black and tan come from in some terrier breeds. So do you think Rottweilers and Kerry Beagles are terrier crosses ? do you think the apbt are rottweiler x ? Not for one second nor do I think there's terrier in them. we will never know, thats for sure. i find it hard to get my head round the apbt not having any terrier blood in there somewhere as the same fanciers that did the rat pits and bull baiting would have crossed their dogs at some time. its not like it is now were we can jump in a car and travel to breed to a selected dog. them days i suspect they used the best that was local to their areas. very interesting all the same. I think you have right of it there...people look at it like a deliberate breeding program...but they are nailing modern day principles to old fashioned standards... no doubt back then if a dog had fight in it they tested it in the pit....and if it won em money then they bred off it...but like you say...interesting...but we will never know for sure 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
oneredtrim 148 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Here's a few more of my mutterings on the subject... First off, i dont believe the terriers used nearly 200 years ago had temperements anything like the earthdogs of today and like i said before, how much terrier was used, i'd doubt much at all... A generation, two? Enough to bring size (bulk) down and and add speed. My line bred bull lurchers are 25 years from greyhound blood and apart from speed (and shitting!) they dont show any greyhoundy traits. Lovin the Nuttall romance of the northern mini pit dogs and grandfathers etc, because i've known Brian for over 30 years and to different 'audiences' he'll say the blood is or is absolutley not in the make up of his dogs. You gotta love the romance of it all though... But if it sells eh....! Not sure if that ^ is aimed at me Bos, perhaps i never articulated meself too well earlier but i never for a moment wrote his forefathers (or meant to imply) pit dog mob went into his own line...only that it travelled down to wigan to seek out a specific terrier type fancied by known wiganers....the offsprogs went on to be first registered in Staffordshire, otherwise they'd have been called Wigan bull terriers. Next time you see him ask him if this is bullshit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bosun11 537 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Here's a few more of my mutterings on the subject... First off, i dont believe the terriers used nearly 200 years ago had temperements anything like the earthdogs of today and like i said before, how much terrier was used, i'd doubt much at all... A generation, two? Enough to bring size (bulk) down and and add speed. My line bred bull lurchers are 25 years from greyhound blood and apart from speed (and shitting!) they dont show any greyhoundy traits. Lovin the Nuttall romance of the northern mini pit dogs and grandfathers etc, because i've known Brian for over 30 years and to different 'audiences' he'll say the blood is or is absolutley not in the make up of his dogs. You gotta love the romance of it all though... But if it sells eh....! Not sure if that ^ is aimed at me Bos, perhaps i never articulated meself too well earlier but i never for a moment wrote his forefathers (or meant to imply) pit dog mob went into his own line...only that it travelled down to wigan to seek out a specific terrier type fancied by known wiganers....the offsprogs went on to be first registered in Staffordshire, otherwise they'd have been called Wigan bull terriers. Next time you see him ask him if this is bullshit. No, not aimed at you mate. Just saying that I've heard both versions of the history, with one of the 'not's' at the old Wigan club meeting 30 years ago... If them Wigan butchers existed, i recon that would have been the opportunity to air it and get direct feedback and confirmation etc but it was totally the reverse... Funny eh! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
oneredtrim 148 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Here's a few more of my mutterings on the subject... First off, i dont believe the terriers used nearly 200 years ago had temperements anything like the earthdogs of today and like i said before, how much terrier was used, i'd doubt much at all... A generation, two? Enough to bring size (bulk) down and and add speed. My line bred bull lurchers are 25 years from greyhound blood and apart from speed (and shitting!) they dont show any greyhoundy traits. Lovin the Nuttall romance of the northern mini pit dogs and grandfathers etc, because i've known Brian for over 30 years and to different 'audiences' he'll say the blood is or is absolutley not in the make up of his dogs. You gotta love the romance of it all though... But if it sells eh....! Not sure if that ^ is aimed at me Bos, perhaps i never articulated meself too well earlier but i never for a moment wrote his forefathers (or meant to imply) pit dog mob went into his own line...only that it travelled down to wigan to seek out a specific terrier type fancied by known wiganers....the offsprogs went on to be first registered in Staffordshire, otherwise they'd have been called Wigan bull terriers. Next time you see him ask him if this is bullshit. No, not aimed at you mate. Just saying that I've heard both versions of the history, with one of the 'not's' at the old Wigan club meeting 30 years ago... If them Wigan butchers existed, i recon that would have been the opportunity to air it and get direct feedback and confirmation etc but it was totally the reverse... Funny eh! 30 yrs ago would still have been wide of his grandfathers mark....with a line having to breed true to type the margins widen further. Nuttal was'nt after selling me anything, he did'nt know me from adam when i knocked on his door, he offered me a pup freemans before i left, i was straight with him and told him they did'nt please me eye. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bwfc 164 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Best ever cross is Staffy x Border Terrier. Meet Mouse in family mode and hunting mode. lol 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Navek Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Wtf lol Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Astanley 11,565 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Good looking dog 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BGD 6,436 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 That is the ugliest feckin dog I've seen in my life :laugh: 3 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bosun11 537 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Here's a few more of my mutterings on the subject... First off, i dont believe the terriers used nearly 200 years ago had temperements anything like the earthdogs of today and like i said before, how much terrier was used, i'd doubt much at all... A generation, two? Enough to bring size (bulk) down and and add speed. My line bred bull lurchers are 25 years from greyhound blood and apart from speed (and shitting!) they dont show any greyhoundy traits. Lovin the Nuttall romance of the northern mini pit dogs and grandfathers etc, because i've known Brian for over 30 years and to different 'audiences' he'll say the blood is or is absolutley not in the make up of his dogs. You gotta love the romance of it all though... But if it sells eh....! Not sure if that ^ is aimed at me Bos, perhaps i never articulated meself too well earlier but i never for a moment wrote his forefathers (or meant to imply) pit dog mob went into his own line...only that it travelled down to wigan to seek out a specific terrier type fancied by known wiganers....the offsprogs went on to be first registered in Staffordshire, otherwise they'd have been called Wigan bull terriers. Next time you see him ask him if this is bullshit. No, not aimed at you mate. Just saying that I've heard both versions of the history, with one of the 'not's' at the old Wigan club meeting 30 years ago... If them Wigan butchers existed, i recon that would have been the opportunity to air it and get direct feedback and confirmation etc but it was totally the reverse... Funny eh! 30 yrs ago would still have been wide of his grandfathers mark....with a line having to breed true to type the margins widen further. Nuttal was'nt after selling me anything, he did'nt know me from adam when i knocked on his door, he offered me a pup freemans before i left, i was straight with him and told him they did'nt please me eye. No mate, 30+ years ago 'I' was sat in the Dog & Partridge Pub, Pemberton, Wigan. Listening to denial, when questioned, about bull blood... Anyways, back to subject... IMO terrier blood is absolutly part of the APBT's history, like it or not, in small ammounts, way way back and that's why it's in the name... Prove it otherwise..! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bosun11 537 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 That ain't a dog.. that's a mongy hyena..! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Silversnake 1,099 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 I enjoy this topic even though it is pretty much futile, I personally believe there is terrier blood in apbt and I also believe that the gameness trait comes more from the terrier influence than the bull influence. To me gameness is a terriers greatest asset (I DO NOT mean dead game) when I see a ten pound foxy taking on a hundred pound kangaroo and treating it with disdain it makes my soul glow! My old apbt's used to give me the exact same feeling. I have hunted pigs with many bull type mastiff, ebt, crosses etc, and while they display courage and strength it somehow seems 'different' also reading the old stories of ratting and digging gameness was always spoken of as the highest honour for a terrier by the old boys. I know none of this is conclusive but in my opinion there is definitely terrier in the apbt genes even if now it is only that terrier attitude of 'I CAN TAKE YOU, YOU ARE NOTHING!' in a bull body I still believe that is from terriers somewhere down the line. Atb. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bwfc 164 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 That ain't a dog.. that's a mongy hyena..! Watch it,he nips. lol 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Navek Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Best ever cross is Staffy x Border Terrier. Meet Mouse in family mode and hunting mode. lol staffy x border terrier.jpg staffy x brder terrior 2.jpg think found the sire Quote Link to post Share on other sites
trenchfoot 4,243 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 There are too many signs that terrier is in the mix. But for me, what really matters is whats missing in your own dogs, and where will you look for it? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DogFox123 1,379 Posted August 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 (edited) Here's a few more of my mutterings on the subject... First off, i dont believe the terriers used nearly 200 years ago had temperements anything like the earthdogs of today and like i said before, how much terrier was used, i'd doubt much at all... A generation, two? Enough to bring size (bulk) down and and add speed. My line bred bull lurchers are 25 years from greyhound blood and apart from speed (and shitting!) they dont show any greyhoundy traits. Lovin the Nuttall romance of the northern mini pit dogs and grandfathers etc, because i've known Brian for over 30 years and to different 'audiences' he'll say the blood is or is absolutley not in the make up of his dogs. You gotta love the romance of it all though... But if it sells eh....! I wouldn't call it romance, if anything Brian would say there's no Bull blood in his Terriers and that they don't need it, last time we visited his kennels I'll let you guess what type of dog he had along with his Terriers, one nearly killed one of his Patts straight in front of us.,, Edited August 14, 2015 by DogFox123 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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