Woman Killed By Dog In Cardiff

[Phil Lloyd 10,738]

Well ,.much as I abhor anthropomorphism and find folk who treat animals as humans to be a wee bit silly,..

The reality of the situation is,...some men are born bad,..and some animals appear to be the same....

[Quarter bull 240]

Yeah Phil I agree, just cause there's we armchair dogs, doesn't take away the fact that there animals an should be treated like animals, with caution.

[Casso 1,261]

It's just due to the highly social nature of the dog that there are not more attacks, so much so that society is taken back when a large predator acts predator like,

 

If we take into account the amount of resistance that some of the driven breeds had to overcome to fulfil their breed standard, thankfully most dogs in society today are imploders but their are others whose temperament make them exploders,

 

I do honestly believe these attacks could be prevented if we just addressed the nature of these breeds , the more we address these dogs as mental cases , the more helpless we are

[3175darren 1,100]

 

 

 

I have been around dogs for almost 50 yr and never had a bad one,if I am naive then I am happy to be naive,

Just out of curiosity what breeds have you been around ?......I havent been around dogs as long as you have but ive seen more than a few that would put the fear of god in you for no other reason than they wanted to........to say no dogs are born bad is not naive its just silly in my opinion as it is to say anything born of nature doesnt have the capability to be born bad.

i have been around a fair few breeds, and I have seen dogs that would put the fear of God in you, BUT not a pup, I have never come accross a young pup that would do it,

I know where you are coming from, but twice I've seen it in pups. Once a pitbull and the second an American bulldog. I saw the am bull from 6 weeks to 2 years, and from 8 weeks, you knew that there were "summat wrong" with the way it was wired. Turned on its owner in the end

I will admit I have no experience of American bull dogs, and the pit bulls I have met have all been spot on with me and others, around them,and certainly didn't deserve the bad press they get, but if a dog was that bad it would be uncontrolable and I am not being funny, if it's that bad it should have been, culled/ put down, there's no need for it, everyone around is at risk, and if that's a product of breeding then it's a shame for the dog,nature does sometimes throw a google ball in but in my experience it's extremely rare, the exception not the rule,

[The Seeker 3,048]

This is what your up against.. He's already banned for life from having a dog and now he will have to live with this for the rest of his life he was responsible for the death of his grandmother.

 

"Cardiff Magistrates' Court heard Craig Anthony Greve, 23, of Cardiff, was the owner of an American bulldog which was dangerously out of control.

Rhona Greve, 64, of Ely, Cardiff, suffered 16 bite wounds after the dog, named Solo, attacked her last Friday evening, the court was told.

She later died at the University Hospital of Wales.

Mr Greve is charged with both having a dog while being banned for life from doing so, and being the owner of a dangerously out of control dog which injured Mrs Greve, who died as a result.

Members of his family and friends were in the public gallery for the hearing which lasted nearly an hour.

The case has been sent to crown court and he was remanded in custody."

[beast 1,884]

Temperament? I guess the question is whether you believe temperament can be inherited. And if so, can aggressive inclinations be handed down from parents? I think this can happen, I had a collie cross some years ago which just wanted to take me on all the time from seven weeks old! Made a decent dog in the end, but never trustworthy.

 

From another angle, back in the 70s the dog considered to be the meanest was the Alsatian, but then came the dobermann, then the rottie, then the pit. All at the time became very popular for a few years, and with this popularity came a surge in badly bred and badly managed dogs, along with a subtle change in certain sections of society which meant a savage dog got its owner some kind of status. I saw my first American bulldog around 1996 at a Neapolitan breeders kennels in Manchester and I said at the time that this would be one of the breeds which became a status dog. There are others which I fear may go the same way, as we now have several mastiff breeds which we never saw 30 or more years ago, like bordeaux, Neapolitans, press, corsos etc and I have seen examples of ll these which were unstable to sy the least. This issue is far from over

[gnasher16 30,025]

I do honestly believe these attacks could be prevented if we just addressed the nature of these breeds , the more we address these dogs as mental cases , the more helpless we are

I assume by " address " you mean letting off steam and such like.......how would a dog bred for generations after generations to be aggressive and fight.....let off steam or be " addressed " ?.....................and im not digging you out mate i agree with what your saying.

 

 

nature does sometimes throw a google ball in but in my experience it's extremely rare, the exception not the rule,

 

Make your mind up mate it was your " no bad dogs just bad owners " theory that caught my attention in the first place

 

 

Temperament? I guess the question is whether you believe temperament can be inherited. And if so, can aggressive inclinations be handed down from parents? I think this can happen, I had a collie cross some years ago which just wanted to take me on all the time from seven weeks old! Made a decent dog in the end, but never trustworthy.

 

 

Good post this and yes like you i believe that aggression can and is handed down.....i dont have experience with Am Bulls/Rotts/Alsatians etc but the Pit Bulls that i was around for many years not only still carry the same traits today within the breed but within the same family of that breed,the family bred Alligator dogs i was petting 7 or 8 years ago had the exact same traits and mannerisms their ancestors had in the dogs i was around 25 years before that.....folk from that era might remember that big black head cocked to the side,the twitchy orange eyes,the deep rumbling noise from the chest up,the absolute stillness in the body.......... still puts the shits up me to this day !

Edited March 24, 2015 by gnasher16

[Casso 1,261]

This is what your up against.. He's already banned for life from having a dog and now he will have to live with this for the rest of his life he was responsible for the death of his grandmother.

"Cardiff Magistrates' Court heard Craig Anthony Greve, 23, of Cardiff, was the owner of an American bulldog which was dangerously out of control.

Rhona Greve, 64, of Ely, Cardiff, suffered 16 bite wounds after the dog, named Solo, attacked her last Friday evening, the court was told.

She later died at the University Hospital of Wales.

Mr Greve is charged with both having a dog while being banned for life from doing so, and being the owner of a dangerously out of control dog which injured Mrs Greve, who died as a result.

Members of his family and friends were in the public gallery for the hearing which lasted nearly an hour.

The case has been sent to crown court and he was remanded in custody."

Another case of bad owner , it seems strange that people are dismayed when war dogs as previously mentioned , large mastiff breeds show aggressive traits , the clue is in the war bit , dogs that were once bred to overcome huge resistance , have potential to display huge aggression , the longer we keep believing these breeds are unstable the more damage is done to curtail our own Liberty to choose dog breeds

[Casso 1,261]

Gnasher you and I both know that a dog bred to overcome huge resistance in the form of a dog , man or hog or whatever it is needs to carry that huge potential within itself, the potential is there whether we put it to use or not ,

 

On sites like this there is a general understanding of this and how drive effects a dog , drive is an emotional force to make contact be it a rabbit , fox , hog the list goes on , it was there originally in the first dogs and has been greatly amplified since then ,

 

The dog is the most highly social , highly sexed and highly aggressive animal living with us and all these traits are encapsulated in any dog living in our home but some traits were chosen over others in certain breeds,

 

The major problem is that the dog is so engrained as a social animal in our psyche that we overlook the other elements , why are we then so taken back when certain dog show breed traits in an area that they were bred for in the first place ,

 

I don't know how society can fix this but I do know that part of the problem is that "Mans Best Friend " can be a wolf in sheep's clothing and until gob shites like this with his dog understand the potential for damage these dogs can do it definitely won't be the last,

[3175darren 1,100]

 

I do honestly believe these attacks could be prevented if we just addressed the nature of these breeds , the more we address these dogs as mental cases , the more helpless we are

I assume by " address " you mean letting off steam and such like.......how would a dog bred for generations after generations to be aggressive and fight.....let off steam or be " addressed " ?.....................and im not digging you out mate i agree with what your saying.

 

 

nature does sometimes throw a google ball in but in my experience it's extremely rare, the exception not the rule,

 

Make your mind up mate it was your " no bad dogs just bad owners " theory that caught my attention in the first place

 

 

Temperament? I guess the question is whether you believe temperament can be inherited. And if so, can aggressive inclinations be handed down from parents? I think this can happen, I had a collie cross some years ago which just wanted to take me on all the time from seven weeks old! Made a decent dog in the end, but never trustworthy.

 

 

Good post this and yes like you i believe that aggression can and is handed down.....i dont have experience with Am Bulls/Rotts/Alsatians etc but the Pit Bulls that i was around for many years not only still carry the same traits today within the breed but within the same family of that breed,the family bred Alligator dogs i was petting 7 or 8 years ago had the exact same traits and mannerisms their ancestors had in the dogs i was around 25 years before that.....folk from that era might remember that big black head cocked to the side,the twitchy orange eyes,the deep rumbling noise from the chest up,the absolute stillness in the body.......... still puts the shits up me to this day !

 

As far as I can tel nature didn't breed this type of dog, we did from a soup of other strains of dog, we bred them for reason's mainly for fighting or tackling big game or as mentioned above,war dogs,nature evolved a social pack animal something that worked well as a team with its own social behaviors,so even though I can't rule out the fact that nature will throw a google ball,the majority of the time its after human interference,and Casso sums it up quite well, but the majority of dogs are born stable,and its the back ground that they are brought up in, that starts to trigger the primal instincts, that's why a lot of the time there's working and none working examples of the breed in most breeds,the non working dog still has the tools to do the job,

[skycat 6,173]

It was once said that violence is the symptom of a frustrated mind: this was said about human beings. If you translate, loosely, this premise into dogs, it should come as no surprise that some breeds, some dogs, turn to attacking their owners, other people etc. Not being understood, being frustrated (not being allowed, or able to fulfil their natural drive in the way they were bred to originally), it's no wonder this happens more and more often in these days where most dog owners have no clue at all about what drives their dogs. Look at how many people turn to aggression when they feel misunderstood, frustrated, have no meaningful life. So much worse for a dog living with people who are dumber than they are.

[forest of dean redneck 11,530]

Now you just upset a lot of ex collie lurcher owners skycat,lol

[gnasher16 30,025]

Gnasher you and I both know that a dog bred to overcome huge resistance in the form of a dog , man or hog or whatever it is needs to carry that huge potential within itself, the potential is there whether we put it to use or not ,

 

On sites like this there is a general understanding of this and how drive effects a dog , drive is an emotional force to make contact be it a rabbit , fox , hog the list goes on , it was there originally in the first dogs and has been greatly amplified since then ,

 

The dog is the most highly social , highly sexed and highly aggressive animal living with us and all these traits are encapsulated in any dog living in our home but some traits were chosen over others in certain breeds,

 

The major problem is that the dog is so engrained as a social animal in our psyche that we overlook the other elements , why are we then so taken back when certain dog show breed traits in an area that they were bred for in the first place ,

 

I don't know how society can fix this but I do know that part of the problem is that "Mans Best Friend " can be a wolf in sheep's clothing and until gob shites like this with his dog understand the potential for damage these dogs can do it definitely won't be the last,

Personally i would keep things simple and say that some dogs are simply not suited to the family pet home......and a breed that was never bred to be a pet dog is always going to struggle to adapt to that type of scenario.

 

 

 

As far as I can tel nature didn't breed this type of dog, we did from a soup of other strains of dog, we bred them for reason's mainly for fighting or tackling big game or as mentioned above,war dogs,nature evolved a social pack animal something that worked well as a team with its own social behaviors,so even though I can't rule out the fact that nature will throw a google ball,the majority of the time its after human interference,and Casso sums it up quite well, but the majority of dogs are born stable,and its the back ground that they are brought up in, that starts to trigger the primal instincts, that's why a lot of the time there's working and none working examples of the breed in most breeds,the non working dog still has the tools to do the job,

 

The nature versus nurture debate has gone on for years........if you now accept nature can just as easily dictate then ok......but by saying theres no bad dogs just bad owners i just presumed you were of the nurture brigade.

[gnasher16 30,025]

It was once said that violence is the symptom of a frustrated mind: this was said about human beings. If you translate, loosely, this premise into dogs, it should come as no surprise that some breeds, some dogs, turn to attacking their owners, other people etc. Not being understood, being frustrated (not being allowed, or able to fulfil their natural drive in the way they were bred to originally), it's no wonder this happens more and more often in these days where most dog owners have no clue at all about what drives their dogs. Look at how many people turn to aggression when they feel misunderstood, frustrated, have no meaningful life. So much worse for a dog living with people who are dumber than they are.

What about dogs ( or people for that matter ) who are not misunderstood,not frustrated,who do have a meaningful life......................but are violent anyway ?

 

My common sense logic tells me they probably possess the trait for a physical tussle.....whether the dog attacks a person or another dog is not important the violent trait is there.

Edited March 24, 2015 by gnasher16

[BGD 6,434]

 

Gnasher you and I both know that a dog bred to overcome huge resistance in the form of a dog , man or hog or whatever it is needs to carry that huge potential within itself, the potential is there whether we put it to use or not ,

 

On sites like this there is a general understanding of this and how drive effects a dog , drive is an emotional force to make contact be it a rabbit , fox , hog the list goes on , it was there originally in the first dogs and has been greatly amplified since then ,

 

The dog is the most highly social , highly sexed and highly aggressive animal living with us and all these traits are encapsulated in any dog living in our home but some traits were chosen over others in certain breeds,

 

The major problem is that the dog is so engrained as a social animal in our psyche that we overlook the other elements , why are we then so taken back when certain dog show breed traits in an area that they were bred for in the first place ,

 

I don't know how society can fix this but I do know that part of the problem is that "Mans Best Friend " can be a wolf in sheep's clothing and until gob shites like this with his dog understand the potential for damage these dogs can do it definitely won't be the last,

Personally i would keep things simple and say that some dogs are simply not suited to the family pet home......and a breed that was never bred to be a pet dog is always going to struggle to adapt to that type of scenario.

 

Never had all these attacks in the news when it was just dogmen keeping bulldogs securely on their yards 100% agree with you, some dogs just shouldn't be in pet homes.