BGD 6,436 Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 Gnasher, seems to me like you are running away from the 'fight'. I have stated that those who are turned on by watching pit bulls fighting are little better than nonces.You strongly disagree. So tell us why.I don't expect you to incriminate yourself. Just give us the facts as you see them so we can engage in healthy debate. Don't get me wrong i think dog matching CAN be cruel if .... A....Dogs are used which are not bred off of direct fighting stock. B....Dogs are used who have not been schooled or conditioned correctly. C....Recognised rules are not adhered to. D....Dogs do not receive immediate and correct aftercare. Took the words out of my mouth . Just like terrier work and all forms of hunting dog fighting CAN be cruel if it's being done by scrotes with no respect for the animals just looking to quench some idiotic "blood lust". Done right I really don't see the difference between terrier work and dog fighting in terms of perceived cruelty, doesn't stop some hunting men turning into a bunch of knicker wearing antis when the subject is brought up though Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jukel123 8,650 Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 So these images do not depict cruelty? Are these images not obscene? There's plenty more on the web if you can stomach them.. There's a world of difference between fieldsports and pit bull fighting. Field sports involve respect for the quarry and therefore the elimination of pain as far is possible. The aim is pest control or food gathering, not cruelty. I've witnessed some hard bitten men in a war zone, (who would gladly torture the enemy), club together hundreds of UK pounds to treat dogs injured in crossfire. Not for brownie points but for honest compassion. The cons who have to be separated in prison for their own protection are paedos,grassers and animal sadists. If pit bull fighting doesn't involve sadism in your book then I don't what does. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BGD 6,436 Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 So these images do not depict cruelty? Are these images not obscene? There's plenty more on the web if you can stomach them.. There's a world of difference between fieldsports and pit bull fighting. Field sports involve respect for the quarry and therefore the elimination of pain as far is possible. The aim is pest control or food gathering, not cruelty. I've witnessed some hard bitten men in a war zone, (who would gladly torture the enemy), club together hundreds of UK pounds to treat dogs injured in crossfire. Not for brownie points but for honest compassion. The cons who have to be separated in prison for their own protection are paedos,grassers and animal sadists. If pit bull fighting doesn't involve sadism in your book then I don't what does. There's plenty of anti propaganda on the internet showing poor wee mr foxywoxy being torn apart by hounds and chewed up terriers with missing bottom jaws, does that make terrier work cruel and sadistic? Fanny Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jukel123 8,650 Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 The video I put up was not the one intended. There's others on Youtube much more harrowing. I'll let you macho men find them for yourselves. If you find these videos acceptable, there's nothing more I can write in this debate. I'll leave the thread to the macho men who get a bang out of watching pit bulls fighting. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gnasher16 30,455 Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 (edited) So these images do not depict cruelty? Are these images not obscene? There's plenty more on the web if you can stomach them.. There's a world of difference between fieldsports and pit bull fighting. Field sports involve respect for the quarry and therefore the elimination of pain as far is possible. The aim is pest control or food gathering, not cruelty. I've witnessed some hard bitten men in a war zone, (who would gladly torture the enemy), club together hundreds of UK pounds to treat dogs injured in crossfire. Not for brownie points but for honest compassion. The cons who have to be separated in prison for their own protection are paedos,grassers and animal sadists. If pit bull fighting doesn't involve sadism in your book then I don't what does. What...is that it ?.....I thought you wanted a " healthy debate ".......you haven't said anything yet !!......all you,ve done is post a silly youtube video containing everything that you,ve already been told is cruel......make some strange claim about soldiers animal charities.......and used more silly descriptive words.........YOU haven't actually said anything yet !..............What you are referring to as dog fighting is the equivalent of watching 2 drunks swinging their arms in a pub car park and calling it boxing. To me the beauty of " a fight " is the story of truth it contains.....a beginning,a middle and an end it plays out like a story.......a little bit like life only a fight is fairer than life because it exposes the bullshit and leaves no doubt as to the value of a mans truth ( or animal in this case ).......does he/it have the true confidence in his own ability and heart to have a start a middle and an end win or lose ? Well Mr Jukel you STARTED by making some wild claims and throwing some serious words around.......however you are yet to reach the middle let alone the end of this " healthy debate " you asked for.......................see where im going Edited January 12, 2015 by gnasher16 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AKA-BRINDLE 879 Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 (edited) So these images do not depict cruelty? Are these images not obscene? There's plenty more on the web if you can stomach them.. There's a world of difference between fieldsports and pit bull fighting. Field sports involve respect for the quarry and therefore the elimination of pain as far is possible. The aim is pest control or food gathering, not cruelty. I've witnessed some hard bitten men in a war zone, (who would gladly torture the enemy), club together hundreds of UK pounds to treat dogs injured in crossfire. Not for brownie points but for honest compassion. The cons who have to be separated in prison for their own protection are paedos,grassers and animal sadists. If pit bull fighting doesn't involve sadism in your book then I don't what does. No...cant see no images...your obviously as good at posting pics as iam...but no doubt they was supposed to be the useual horrorshow pics like the antis post about hunting...to give this perspective lets look at an image already on the thread...the one Gnasher16 posted of GrCh Soga...a Grand Champion (GrCh) is a dog that has won 5+ contracted matches...so this bitch is a good example of a dog used for fighting...right?...and as she was out of Mexico you just know she won against top notch opposition...she is a beautiful healthy animal in fantastic condition...you dont keep a dog like that through cruelty and neglect...obviously you have no understanding of the knowledge and effort it takes to condition and campaign such a dog...obviously you have little understanding of these dogs at all...which is why as per f***ing usual the thread drags the gutter with Macho men, nonce type name calling...people like you have never felt a passion for any kind of sporting dog...your just the sort that looks for something to be outraged and offended by Edited January 12, 2015 by AKA-BRINDLE 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
downsouth 7,430 Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 Jukel123 may I ask what particular fieldsport you partake in. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bird 9,977 Posted January 12, 2015 Report Share Posted January 12, 2015 So these images do not depict cruelty? Are these images not obscene? There's plenty more on the web if you can stomach them.. There's a world of difference between fieldsports and pit bull fighting. Field sports involve respect for the quarry and therefore the elimination of pain as far is possible. The aim is pest control or food gathering, not cruelty. I've witnessed some hard bitten men in a war zone, (who would gladly torture the enemy), club together hundreds of UK pounds to treat dogs injured in crossfire. Not for brownie points but for honest compassion. The cons who have to be separated in prison for their own protection are paedos,grassers and animal sadists. If pit bull fighting doesn't involve sadism in your book then I don't what does. No...cant see no images...your obviously as good at posting pics as iam...but no doubt they was supposed to be the useual horrorshow pics like the antis post about hunting...to give this perspective lets look at an image already on the thread...the one Gnasher16 posted of GrCh Soga...a Grand Champion (GrCh) is a dog that has won 5+ contracted matches...so this bitch is a good example of a dog used for fighting...right?...and as she was out of Mexico you just know she won against top notch opposition...she is a beautiful healthy animal in fantastic condition...you dont keep a dog like that through cruelty and neglect...obviously you have no understanding of the knowledge and effort it takes to condition and campaign such a dog...obviously you have little understanding of these dogs at all...which is why as per f***ing usual the thread drags the gutter with Macho men, nonce type name calling...people like you have never felt a passion for any kind of sporting dog...your just the sort that looks for something to be outraged and offended by Quote Link to post Share on other sites
brad88 133 Posted January 13, 2015 Report Share Posted January 13, 2015 Jukel123 may I ask what particular fieldsport you partake in. I believe he sniffs park benches for sport 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lab 10,979 Posted January 13, 2015 Report Share Posted January 13, 2015 Gnasher, seems to me like you are running away from the 'fight'. I have stated that those who are turned on by watching pit bulls fighting are little better than nonces.You strongly disagree. So tell us why.I don't expect you to incriminate yourself. Just give us the facts as you see them so we can engage in healthy debate. No way i can incriminate myself when im not doing anything wrong so im up for healthy debate on subjects of interest......so where to start...........im not even going to comment on the " turned on by watching pit bulls fighting are little better than nonces " statement you made......i,ll give you the benefit of the doubt and say your lack of information led you to make an absurdly silly comment that doesnt really need explaining ! I don't really know what you mean with " running away from the fight " so i cant comment on that. I cant give you facts i can only give you my opinion,but in 30 odd years having similar conversations as these i am yet to hear 1 single person convince me that serious organised dog matching between responsible and knowledgable people is cruel.......i accept some folk think it is but its usually based on lack of understanding of the breed,or lack of understanding of competitive sport......which angle do you point a finger of cruelty from ?......fighting as a sport ?.....in which case do you also think boxing and/or other human combat sports are cruel ?...........or purely animal ? in which case do you think that Greyhound racing/horse racing/terrier work etc etc is cruel ? Don't get me wrong i think dog matching CAN be cruel if .... A....Dogs are used which are not bred off of direct fighting stock. B....Dogs are used who have not been schooled or conditioned correctly. C....Recognised rules are not adhered to. D....Dogs do not receive immediate and correct aftercare. Apart from that no i do not see that 2 purpose bred fit healthy dogs of equal size fought under organised rules between knowledgable responsible people providing the best of conditions before during and after battle should automatically be presumed cruel......fighting is a natural order of life that man has adapted towards a sport that under the correct conditions i see no cruelty in....human or animal...................that doesn't mean i take part in any such sport or ever have done it is simply as you call it " healthy debate "........so theres my opening statement i look forward to yours It really is a great post this.....very informative. Since joining the site I reckon I have learned many things about running dogs and terrier work. I have also changed my opinion on a few things too.....dog fighting being one of them. When growing up the only dog fights you hear about is the what the media wants you to hear/see........I remember reading a similar thread to this a while ago and afte taking an interest a member send me basically what the 'rules' in the pit was........rules? I never realised there was any. And after reading them my mind changed from the media few too the view of dog fighting as an actual sport. I can see what work must go into conditioning these dogs and I'm sure the owners seek the best medical care for there dogs afterwards. Saying that as much as I respect anyone's decision to enter there dog into a pit under the proper rules I'd not wish to watch it. 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bird 9,977 Posted January 13, 2015 Report Share Posted January 13, 2015 Gnasher, seems to me like you are running away from the 'fight'. I have stated that those who are turned on by watching pit bulls fighting are little better than nonces.You strongly disagree. So tell us why.I don't expect you to incriminate yourself. Just give us the facts as you see them so we can engage in healthy debate. No way i can incriminate myself when im not doing anything wrong so im up for healthy debate on subjects of interest......so where to start...........im not even going to comment on the " turned on by watching pit bulls fighting are little better than nonces " statement you made......i,ll give you the benefit of the doubt and say your lack of information led you to make an absurdly silly comment that doesnt really need explaining ! I don't really know what you mean with " running away from the fight " so i cant comment on that. I cant give you facts i can only give you my opinion,but in 30 odd years having similar conversations as these i am yet to hear 1 single person convince me that serious organised dog matching between responsible and knowledgable people is cruel.......i accept some folk think it is but its usually based on lack of understanding of the breed,or lack of understanding of competitive sport......which angle do you point a finger of cruelty from ?......fighting as a sport ?.....in which case do you also think boxing and/or other human combat sports are cruel ?...........or purely animal ? in which case do you think that Greyhound racing/horse racing/terrier work etc etc is cruel ? Don't get me wrong i think dog matching CAN be cruel if .... A....Dogs are used which are not bred off of direct fighting stock. B....Dogs are used who have not been schooled or conditioned correctly. C....Recognised rules are not adhered to. D....Dogs do not receive immediate and correct aftercare. Apart from that no i do not see that 2 purpose bred fit healthy dogs of equal size fought under organised rules between knowledgable responsible people providing the best of conditions before during and after battle should automatically be presumed cruel......fighting is a natural order of life that man has adapted towards a sport that under the correct conditions i see no cruelty in....human or animal...................that doesn't mean i take part in any such sport or ever have done it is simply as you call it " healthy debate "........so theres my opening statement i look forward to yours It really is a great post this.....very informative. Since joining the site I reckon I have learned many things about running dogs and terrier work. I have also changed my opinion on a few things too.....dog fighting being one of them. When growing up the only dog fights you hear about is the what the media wants you to hear/see........I remember reading a similar thread to this a while ago and afte taking an interest a member send me basically what the 'rules' in the pit was........rules? I never realised there was any. And after reading them my mind changed from the media few too the view of dog fighting as an actual sport. I can see what work must go into conditioning these dogs and I'm sure the owners seek the best medical care for there dogs afterwards. Saying that as much as I respect anyone's decision to enter there dog into a pit under the proper rules I'd not wish to watch it. yeh I am the same as you, Gnash puts up a great thread on this post, and always as Ive been round bull breeds long while , and there were a lot of people back then (with the right knowledge +atuide ) in the pit game like gnash talks about , maybe you get few people shouldn't be involved with the breed, but you could say that with anybody today who as had working dogs , these always been few bad'ns in all things . I still think breed finished , don't think it will be around in 20 years time , joe public will see to that , it s a shame what was once a great breed of dog . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mickey Finn 3,016 Posted January 13, 2015 Report Share Posted January 13, 2015 The yanks like to call them " Fur Mommys "......................the same types who sit writing letters to death row inmates saying " Marry me i can change you " You can be lucky 100 times....you only need to be unlucky once !! Fur Mommy's? I've not heard that one. But we have a few other words for people like that. No offense intended Jigsaw. You always bring up interesting topics. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jigsaw 11,897 Posted January 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2015 thank you mickey finn,i think theres enough fighting and bitching going on here so different topics that stimulate decent debate is good for all of us I think.....................plus i get bored easily.lol Quote Link to post Share on other sites
richc12 84 Posted January 14, 2015 Report Share Posted January 14, 2015 Imo Terrier work done correctly should never be compared to fighting dogs!!! Barry wade and the likes have worked hard for many decades so that lads can work there dogs with in the law to fox... This is not a dig pardon the pun... But surely there is a massive difference to putting a terrier to ground and flushing to the gun or a swift ending once dug to... Ideally with a baying terrier some may mix whatever but its not or shouldn't be about full blown combat, should it? And certainly not longer than what's humanly possible... Once broken through!!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gnasher16 30,455 Posted January 14, 2015 Report Share Posted January 14, 2015 It really is a great post this.....very informative. Since joining the site I reckon I have learned many things about running dogs and terrier work. I have also changed my opinion on a few things too.....dog fighting being one of them. When growing up the only dog fights you hear about is the what the media wants you to hear/see........I remember reading a similar thread to this a while ago and afte taking an interest a member send me basically what the 'rules' in the pit was........rules? I never realised there was any. And after reading them my mind changed from the media few too the view of dog fighting as an actual sport. I can see what work must go into conditioning these dogs and I'm sure the owners seek the best medical care for there dogs afterwards. Saying that as much as I respect anyone's decision to enter there dog into a pit under the proper rules I'd not wish to watch it. In my experience this is the difference between an open minded man who has enough about him to watch,listen and learn before making judgement on another mans sport........and a man who believes sensationalist headlines and repeats everything he hears sheep fashion because he hasnt got enough about him to do his own research ! Whether you approve of dog matching or disapprove is not important but those above are words that as another man i can respect. Fur Mommy's? I've not heard that one. But we have a few other words for people like that. Here you go....your people not mine http://www.pitbull-chat.com/showthread.php/75390-Furmommy 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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