Shooting Club

[Born Hunter 17,780]

Alsone, I'm pretty sure there's nothing illegal about using expanding ammo on ranges for zeroing purposes. As things stand it would be breaking the conditions of my FAC to enter a target shooting discipline full stop, but I am conditioned to use expanding ammo and to zero on ranges.

[Alsone 789]

There isn't, zeroing is one of the exemptions.

 

The other poster was asking could he use expanding ammo on the range for non competition target shooting. That's something different entirely from zeroing, sufficient practice or ammo testing.

Edited December 15, 2014 by Alsone

[Born Hunter 17,780]

I don't believe he said about target shooting, just shooting on a club range to improve his ability in the field. Which to my understanding of the law is legal with expanding ammo. Whether there are ranges that cater for this specifically I would be interested to know....

[jacknife 2,005]

So out of interest, is there anywhere in the UK where you can pay to train exclusively with a hunting rifle set-up? And where do you find these places? Without wanting to take up some paper punching discipline and talk about ballistics with all the other target shooters.

So out of interest, is there anywhere in the UK where you can pay to train exclusively with a hunting rifle set-up? And where do you find these places? Without wanting to take up some paper punching discipline and talk about ballistics with all the other target shooters.

You will need to join a club do your range safety about £25 if you already have Fac you may be able to become a full member straight away

 

I use expanding ammo all the time on the range

 

Best website to go to is the NRA they have a list of the clubs plus all the info on what you can and can't do

[Tremo 138]

clubs are like pubs there is allways one dick head and co trying to spoil it for the rest.it might be an age thing but since turning 40 i got so much better at a:ingnoring people or b:telling people exactly my opinion of them so they choose to ignore me.both work with wallys you will often find your not alone in your opinion.

 

We must be twins.

[zx10mike 137]

 

clubs are like pubs there is allways one dick head and co trying to spoil it for the rest.it might be an age thing but since turning 40 i got so much better at a:ingnoring people or b:telling people exactly my opinion of them so they choose to ignore me.both work with wallys you will often find your not alone in your opinion.

 

We must be twins.

 

[pete123 45]

Just checked my cert and seems that I'd be inclined to read it as expanding ammo for vermin only....

 

"The certificate holder may possess, purchase or acquire expanding ammunition, or the missiles of such ammunition, in the calibres authorised by this certificate and use only in connection with the shooting of vermin or, in connection with. The management of any estate, other wildlife"

[Alsone 789]

It's not just what you're authorised to shoot on your Cert, but what's lawful under the Firearms Act as Expanding Ammunition is totally Prohibited by S5 of the Act, this only being partially lifted by the usage / possession exceptions set out in S5A of the Act. So you commit a Criminal Offence to use / possess it for any purpose not covered by the exceptions in S5A.

 

You clearly can use it on the range, but in limited circumstances for limited purposes, general target shooting not being one of them.

[nasher1 258]

Can you get non expanding ammo for a hmr to use on ranges

[pete123 45]

 

You clearly can use it on the range, but in limited circumstances for limited purposes, general target shooting not being one of them.

 

 

What are the limited circumstances and purposes? When does zeroing become target shooting?

 

The said club have got back to me and I asked the question around ammo they just said they would check but they sell 50 rounds for £3 so guess I'll just purchase theirs and be done with any risk lol.

 

Off down on to visit on Sunday and they said can take my rifle and read club rules prior. I'll leave my Winchester subs at home :-)

[Alsone 789]

From what I posted on the previous page:

 

 

Section 10(2)( of the 1997 Act amends section 5A(4)( of the 1968 Act so that the

use of expanding ammunition is in connection with the various exempted purposes. This

allows, for example, a deer stalker or vermin shooter to zero with their rifle on a range or

other suitable land and to do sufficient training and testing with the expanding ammunition.

It does not allow them to take part in target shooting or any competitions using expanding

ammunition.

 

Can't really be any clearer on the exemptions as they're printed.

 

Zeroing is pretty self explanatory and not something you're going to be able to claim for regular visits week in and week out.

 

Definition of "sufficient" in relation to training / ammo comparisons isn't defined so far as I'm aware (I haven't trolled the whole Act to look though so unless it's hidden in the definition section or unless case law has decided it, it's open to interpretation).

 

My own view is that with regards to ammo testing, it's pretty much going to be one off's from testing when you 1st get a gun down to occasional depending on when new ammo hits the market you haven't already tried so not an excuse for week in week out.

 

With regards to "sufficient" training, who knows. That's why I said contact the BASC in case it is case law defined or hidden in some obscure section, or at the very least for their view and guidance on "Sufficient".

 

However, I doubt any of the reasons would be a long term excuse and target shooting is specifically prohibited so it would appear that yes you can occasionally test ammo, train or zero. However, it appears you can't shoot regularly or permanently on the range with expanding ammo. To do so, risks prosecution (given the FAO knows what you're buying).

Edited December 17, 2014 by Alsone

[Born Hunter 17,780]

Why can't you shoot 'regularly' on the range with expanding ammo? It's perfectly legal for practice purposes. There is nothing to suggest otherwise other than your opinion. If someone wants to train 6 days a week to hunt 1 day a week there is nothing illegal about that. Just don't enter any competitive disciplines, stick to sensible practice.

[Alsone 789]

I spoke to the BASC about this and received a reply which more or less confirmed what I believed above.

 

There is currently no definition in law of "sufficient" and they referred me to the Home Office Guidance on usage.

[celticrusader 78]

Tbh I think that its a thin line within using a said rifle on the range for just zeroing or familiarisation and at what point is that considered target shooting is debatable in varying factors to each person, not very clear as everyone's interpretation for this varies.

 

Nasher1 if your willing to travel to s.Wales just over the bridge they've got a range which you can do just as you've stated in one of your previous comments, my friend and I travel there and mainly use the outside 100m firing point in which they drop back to the 200m point later in the day, £15 pp if I remember right and you can drive up to points in your vehicle... If your interested I'll source out the number and see if I can get you the dates for a next meet which are predominantly weekends.

[nasher1 258]

Tbh I think that its a thin line within using a said rifle on the range for just zeroing or familiarisation and at what point is that considered target shooting is debatable in varying factors to each person, not very clear as everyone's interpretation for this varies.

 

Nasher1 if your willing to travel to s.Wales just over the bridge they've got a range which you can do just as you've stated in one of your previous comments, my friend and I travel there and mainly use the outside 100m firing point in which they drop back to the 200m point later in the day, £15 pp if I remember right and you can drive up to points in your vehicle... If your interested I'll source out the number and see if I can get you the dates for a next meet which are predominantly weekends.

I have heard of this range but have been unable to find any contact details for it so if you could find the number out it would be much appreciated atb Roy