New Permission - Checking It's Suitable, Police Rules

[Matthew Phillips 36]

Guys,

 

So i've just been offered a new permission, which has been shot over before with rimfire but the owner didn't know if the previous shooter had an open ticket or not.

 

Thus i've contacted the police to check and they said i have to get the owner to fill in this form and send it to them.

 

<rant>

The problems I have are as follows;

• The form states 'as the owner of the land'; however i was under the impression it's not just the owner who can give me permission. Sometimes people rent land but do not own it, all i need is lawful authority, not permission from the owner.
• The form requests the owner to specify firearms and calibers... WTF? If the owner of the land knew enough about firearms they would likely sort the problem themselves. Why do they need to put this down? It's up to me the shooter to determine what make/model i use and what caliber i use. Now as far as I'm concerned this is the police over stepping their ground. What if the owner had put down Ruger model 452 shooting 1inch exploding armour piercing tracers in full automatic?

So currently I have this new permission (an apple orchard) that needs the rabbits sorted (and the occasional hare). I've called the police to check it's been cleared and they said before they tell me i have to get the owner to fill this bullshit in. Why can't i just give them the farm address and they tell me what caliber it is accepted for? After all it was them who put the condition "LAND deemed suitable by the CHIEF OFFICE of POLICE"

 

</rant>

 

So now this could take months to process.

 

:-(

Edited November 18, 2014 by Matthew Phillips

[dgreenbank 1]

Having read the form its just a standard approval form.you need to sit down with the farmer & go through it.Having rented a lot of land in the past its quite common for the rent agreement to stipulate who is responsible for the control of pests on the land ie the owner or person renting,so first thing is to find that out.Second its reasonable for the police to want to know what firearms /calibre to be used for the permission,as you don't want to be using a .243 on rabbits or a .22lr on deer.So just put rimfire/.22lr or whatever your planning to use.It also shows the firearms dept.that your considerate/safe & both you & the farmer have discussed everything & are in agreement.Hope this helps & you get it sorted soon.

[Matthew Phillips 36]

Ok but the form is to be filled in by the farmer. All i should need is something along the lines of 'XYZ is allowed to shoot ABC on my land at address DEF'.

 

The police don't need for me to tell them what calibers can be used as it's up to them to state the maximum that can be used, and i can then make my decision based on that.

 

Unfortunately the process for this in my county is slow. You'd think that I could just call them and ask over the phone if the land has been cleared before and to what caliber.

[John Stott 202]

Its normal. I recommend you just deal with it as the police want. There can be stipulations in a rental that you may not be aware of. However, if something goes wrong, you are responsible. Do you really want to have the burden of proof lying on you?

Also, to clarify, I would contact BASC legal. Their expertise is second to none.

[SportingShooter 0]

You need permission from one of the following;

 

The owner of the shooting rights on that land, this may be the owner of it, tenant or an entirely separate person,

 

or

 

If the tenancy agreement states that the tenant is responsible for pest control, then he can grant you permission to shoot pests, no other species.

 

Basically, all you need to do is fill in the form with the address, copy the conditions from your FAC to the Firearms/Calibres bit word for word and ask him to sign it,

[charlie caller 3,654]

You can just ring the police and ask them what if any calibre the land is passed for, as all land that is firearms checked/passed is on the police computer, I have done this in the past several times,the fact that your force have sent you this form, suggests that the ground is not passed for fac of any calibre, but I would ring the firearms team of another force and ask them to check the land out because if it turns out that the land is passed for your calibre, and your ticket states, "land deemed suitable by the chief constable for the area the land is situated" you do NOT need to fill any forms in or jump through any hoops, providing you have authority to shoot on the land, you are well within your rights, and conditions of your fac, to do so.

[charlie caller 3,654]

You can just ring the police and ask them what if any calibre the land is passed for, as all land that is firearms checked/passed is on the police computer, I have done this in the past several times,the fact that your force have sent you this form, suggests that the ground is not passed for fac of any calibre, but I would ring the firearms team of another force and ask them to check the land out because if it turns out that the land is passed for your calibre, and your ticket states, "land deemed suitable by the chief constable for the area the land is situated" you do NOT need to fill any forms in or jump through any hoops, providing you have authority to shoot on the land, you are well within your rights, and conditions of your fac, to do so.

[Matthew Phillips 36]

Thanks Charlie Caller, this is exactly what i thought. But the annoying this is the very first thing i did was phone them up to give them the address but they didn't seem interested and said i had to get the form filled in. I said can't you just tell me over the phone and they said 'no i need to send in a permission slip', as far as I'm concerned that's wrong?

 

The annoying thing is the force is pretty slow with anything... I doubt i'll here back for a few weeks.

[charlie caller 3,654]

So ring up the licensing dept from another force, and ask them if its passed, if it is shoot on it, job done alternatively, ring your force again, and put a slightly stronger case forward, I.E "The landowner on ....... farm is very keen on me culling rabbits on his land. I would greatly appreciate you checking to see if the land is cleared for .22rf or whatever, dont be fobbed off by civilian workers in the firearms dept, ask to speak to someone in charge if necessary, it is THEIR job to tell you if land is cleared or not, when you get to speak to whoever is in charge, ask about an open ticket, to avoid all this in future, dont be afraid to ring them, it is their bloody job, not to fob you off, get on with it pal!!!!!!

Edited November 19, 2014 by charlie caller

[Alsone 789]

Just something I would add to what Charlie said above - if the force said the land is already approved for shooting on with calibres up to X, I'd personally ask them to confirm that via email or fax, and pester them daily or hourly until you get it.

 

Otherwise, it's your word vs theirs if they turn up and arrest you for using a gun on a piece of land they later say isn't approved. Having everything in writing is much much safer.

 

Equally, if there is any dispute, give them a copy of their confirmation, not the original! It's always worth remembering that little slip of paper could be the only thing stopping you going to prison. As I've said before, always cover your back. Not all FEO's or dept.'s are as honest as they should be.

 

PS don't keep the proof with your gun - if they ever seize your guns, they may seize your proof along with them.

Edited November 19, 2014 by Alsone