Natural Bait Boxes.

[Mr Muddy 141]

Thanks for your comments.

 

Slightly concerned to hear you’re ‘uneasy’ Deker. How uneasy? Uneasy enough that I should quickly take the photos down?

 

Sorry the photos are so crap, so here’s some background info:

Photo 1 is a small pit dug through leaf litter into clay soil.

Photo 2 is three logs, each weighing several kg, covering the pit - I’m counting on the rats digging their way in.

At the end of the treatment I was planning to scrape up the bait. I’m assuming any clay scraped up with it will dry to dust before I use the bait again. That said; now I’ve read Matt’s comment I will line the pit with some mypex matting next time.

These bait points are strung out in an area that’s approx 3m higher the nearest ditch (which isn’t that near), so well above any ground water.

 

Incidentally; the rats are living in – or certainly running into - a disused rabbit warren. I made the decision that it was not appropriate to put bait into the warren, even though it’s only being used by rats.

 

Again; any advice/opinions welcome.

[Mr Muddy 141]

One more thing; I re-read the label – after Matt’s comment - which states 200g every 10m.

I’ve come close to those limits, but not exceeded them.

[Phil Lloyd 10,738]

Wooden tunnels have always been the master when it comes to getting rats into a feeding mood,..they like the feel of the timber,..it is so natural to them.

My best bait tunnels are fairly long,..far longer than a cubby for spring traps...

I like to get the rats well into the tunnel where they can feed in safety.

Obviously you camouflage the tunnels with some natural debris/brush, etc...

 

Whatever you do,...do go careful,.cos it is getting dangerous, out there.....

 

All the best, Phil.

Edited November 20, 2014 by Phil Lloyd

[Deker 3,478]

Thanks for your comments.

 

Slightly concerned to hear you’re ‘uneasy’ Deker. How uneasy? Uneasy enough that I should quickly take the photos down?

 

Sorry the photos are so crap, so here’s some background info:

Photo 1 is a small pit dug through leaf litter into clay soil.

Photo 2 is three logs, each weighing several kg, covering the pit - I’m counting on the rats digging their way in.

At the end of the treatment I was planning to scrape up the bait. I’m assuming any clay scraped up with it will dry to dust before I use the bait again. That said; now I’ve read Matt’s comment I will line the pit with some mypex matting next time.

These bait points are strung out in an area that’s approx 3m higher the nearest ditch (which isn’t that near), so well above any ground water.

 

Incidentally; the rats are living in – or certainly running into - a disused rabbit warren. I made the decision that it was not appropriate to put bait into the warren, even though it’s only being used by rats.

 

Again; any advice/opinions welcome.

 

As per my other comment as well.....

(but I don't quite follow what has happened between pic 1 and 2, they almost look like different scenes)

 

You have explained that further and I see little or no significant difference now between that or burrow baiting!

 

Ratty has a decent nose so I can but hope you have sited this appropriately and he will dig his way in, but making bait easily accessible to the target species is a good plan.

 

Phil, as usual has made valid/wise comment above.

 

[Mr Muddy 141]

 

You have explained that further and I see little or no significant difference now between that or burrow baiting!

 

 

 

Thanks Deker,

 

Because the rats were going into the disused rabbit warren I decided not to bait their ‘burrows’. Rabbits or no rabbits; I would still deliberately be putting poison into a rabbit warren.

 

I don’t know if other people would perceive that to be a problem, but I decided it could come back to haunt me.

[Matt 160]

Because the rats were going into the disused rabbit warren I decided not to bait their ‘burrows’.

Disused rabbit bury?

 

Have you considered:

 

Gassing?

 

Blocking the holes and then using Fenns in any that open up (you could use Mk4's as you'd be targeting rats)?

 

Blocking and then baiting any holes that have obviously been re-opened by rats?

 

 

Remember the old adage about 'removing harbourage'. Disused rabbit burys are as much harbourage as a pile of old crud that's been discarded.

 

Just some thoughts...

[Mr Muddy 141]

Quick update:

 

I went back to the site at first light this morning.

6 out of 7 points had been dug into, and half of those were virtually empty, with very little mess. So, other than not lining the bottom of the pit, I’m happy I’ve done better by not using plastic boxes.

 

I was fairly confident I knew what I was doing, but it’s nice to have you guys here for a professional second opinion, so thanks again

[talpa 55]

Just another snippet of advice - keep an eye on those bait points, if there wasn't much left was there signs of rats eating it, if not it is likely that rats or mice could have gathered the loose grains and relocated it to a cache elsewhere and you may not see a drop in rat activity. See how any grains have been eaten to tell what was feeding at the bait sites. Loose grain is undoubtedly best for rural situations but it does have limitations/complications. I would do as already suggested, block up the old rabbit warren entrances then if no signs of rabbits bait any that are opened by rats, you can document your work if pro job to cover your rear. This will target your rat, reduce the amount of bait you use as lower losses to mice and less danger from caches being eaten by non targets.

[Mr Muddy 141]

Just another snippet of advice - keep an eye on those bait points, if there wasn't much left was there signs of rats eating it, if not it is likely that rats or mice could have gathered the loose grains and relocated it to a cache elsewhere and you may not see a drop in rat activity.

 

Hi Talpa, hope you - or someone - don’t mind answering another question:

 

If you suspect the rats have been storing the bait what do you do? Give them a bit of a break from baiting so they can eat their cache?

You’ll appreciate that would go against a lot of what I‘d been told about baiting for rats, so I would like to find out what’s what.

 

Thanks again.

[talpa 55]

OK, whats done is done. If the grains have just gone and you have no remnants to judge whether rats or mice have eaten it thenit is likely they have been carried to a cache , you could use your survey/inspection skills to look in the likely places that you would find rodent activity and you may find the cache,. Caches are likely to be in places where the animal feels comfortable and therefore will get robbed by other rodents, which is why we find wood mice covering up bait in boxes with all manner of debris.

 

I would do my best to satisfy my own mind I had done what I can to prevent an non targets eating it. Then as you say you need to get bait down again, so go down the rabbit burrow baiting route if no rabbits occupying it, alternatively look at securing blocks or pasta baits on wires so that the bait remains where you want it. Uptake by rats may not be as quick as loose grain but you can control it better which is part of your statutory conditions for use. The uptake of any bait can be improved by reducing any alternative food source. If you haven't done any environmental improvements ie removing food sources and harbourages then doing this asap will also help get rodents to turn to the baiton wires and any cache from the original baiting you carried out again reducing potential for it to be eaten by non targets.

 

That rabbit burrow could be trapped out with BG's116 or MK6's if rabbits present and you could set up a trap line of tunnels with MK4's or trex etc.

 

Have a step back from the job and have a think about all the options open to you in this situation, it is easy for us to rely on rodenticides without considering other options.

I often find a walk in the opposite direction that I usually take on site can give fresh perspective on things and suggest ways forward.

Hope it is some help.

[Matt 160]

it is easy for us to rely on rodenticides without considering other options.

+1

 

I often find a walk in the opposite direction that I usually take on site can give fresh perspective on things and suggest ways forward.

Hope it is some help.

That, really is excellent advice

 

It's amazing what you miss when you do exactly the same thing every time you go on site

[Mr Muddy 141]

Thanks very much.

 

Just to reassure you; the job I posted this thread about is going well – it’s definitely rats and they have been eating the bait at the points (when I said there ‘wasn’t much mess,’ I just meant there weren’t grains spread out across the area).

 

Thing is, I’m just not someone who thinks they know everything, and what to do if the bait was going straight into a cache was a gaping hole in my knowledge.

 

So, thank again for giving me an answer; much appreciated.