Applying For A Fac

[graham~j 0]

Hi,I have got a six acere small holding,mainly poultry and sheep.I have been have a big problem this yeay with crows and magpies and of corse the old enemy Mr.Fox.

I have a SGC but getting within range of these wiley creatchers is a night mare.So I was thinking of applying for a FAC.

 

1/Do I fill out and send off the form first or contact the police and get the land inspected.

2/there is a byway runs alongside my land and a foot path across the middle will this be a problem.

3/there is very little in the way of back stop on my land but the are several large Oak trees I could build I hide up would this be OK as then I would be shooting down into the ground.

4/what guns would I be best applying for I was thinking air gun and 17hmr should I also apply for .22 rimfire,the fox will be one of my targets crow,magpie,rat,rabbit,and fox.

 

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[celticrusader 78]

Mmmm the big question, well you have land and that is more than most but as you seem undecided which would be best suited many peoples view will vary as will there results.

1.A rimfire of .22lr or 17Hmr or even both for rabbits and fox

2. an air rifle for rats or birds out of trees (permitting the conditions available) which could also be used in places which make the rimmies use questionable...no one rifle will do all but the choice is yours.

Edited May 28, 2014 by celticrusader

[graham~j 0]

Hi thanks for the reply Celticrusader exactly as you say a air rifle for rats and birds out of trees.I think I'm airing towards the 17hmr for every thing else,I perticualy like the fact the bullet head break up on inpct with the ground.I have shot a .22 and was shocked just how much they ricochet off the ground.

What advantages if any dose the .22lr have over the 17hmr

 

Thanks Graham.

[charlie caller 3,654]

This is not 100% mate but with 6 acres with no backstops I would be very surprised if you were granted anything more than a fac air rifle, unless they give you shooting from an elevated position condition, what I would do is ring the feo and ask him/her to come out and asses your ground, and advise accordingly.

[shropshire dan 467]

And the .22lr is alot cheaper to feed and alot quieter than a hmr. I dont think they ricochet as bad as people think to be honest

[celticrusader 78]

As Charlie caller said have a word with the feo first but I would stick with a sub 12footpound air rifle as apposed to an FAC one, both .22lr and 17hmr are great rifles and both offer something that slight bit different than the other..i'll give you an example.

Hot summer days when those pesky rabbits are out in numbers and you need to take a few quietly and get in close in certain times you can dispatch with the 22lr semi auto easier.

But then the heavier rifle which is more accurate , less affected by drop but more affected by wind and quite a bit louder permitting the circumstances will undoubtedly claim the scalp of one of the hairy little sods at double the distance than the 22lr...both have proved to be the right tool for the job in my hand on many occasions.

[graham~j 0]

Hi thanks for the replys,Why do you say stick with a sub 12 ft/lb air rifle.

 

To be honnest a FAC air rifle would probably do most of what I need espcily if I could get a licence to shoot a 22lr or the 17hmr from a high seat.

 

 

Graham.

[Tornado1979 145]

I've had some hassle getting .22 passed on a 10 acre field on one of my permissions, back drop surrounding but the FEO still wasn't happy, ended up getting a crazy condition with elevated position and this was after 6 months of visits / calls / emails, they refused on initial visit and land was passed for FAC air rifle only, but I requested they would re-visit.

[abarrett 462]

 

Don't ask the FEO what he / she thinks the ground is suited for the answer will be air rifle

 

Tell the FEO foxes are causing you a problem you need to deal with them so you want a hmr for the foxes and 22lr for the rabbits

 

You can't use the hmr for both because there are lots of rabbits and the noise off the hmr would be a problem

[shropshire dan 467]

+1 abarrett

[celticrusader 78]

Well personally I think if you get an FAC air rifle not only would it be an expensive tool almost probably more than the rimfires but they are a nightmare for resale apparently...for the sake of rabbits , rats and birds in trees a sub 12 footpound would more than cope, if you were after foxes then yes I guess it would do the job but then you would have a reason for a rimfire.. Its an interesting one to say the least.

Would you buy an FAC air rifle or convert one to a Firearm...once converted there is no going back...its a firearm until its destroyed in the eyes of the law I do believe.

Edited May 29, 2014 by celticrusader

[graham~j 0]

That interesting you can't wind one up and then wind it back then.I have an air rifle that is easly tuned or detuned.So I was hoping to have that wond up to about 40ft/lb the price of a kit is only a few quid.And then buy either a 17hmr or 22lr.Crows and magpies are my big problem as are foxes.Getting close enough to magpies and crows with an coventional air gun is near on impossible,maybe if you have all day to sit in a hide,but then you will only get on or two they are so cunning,being able to take them at range from trees would be good.

I have chickens,turkeys and geese.The crows and magpies are eating literaly hundreds of pounds worth of eggs,I din't belive how many they could eat.I have also had trouble with foxes taking my geese.

 

Graham.

[celticrusader 78]

Well I do believe that would be illegal as the legal limit is 12 ft/lb...that being said if you want to go down the FAC air rifle route thats fine as many people do but its best to have all the info in on it first especially if hassle can be avoided, I do know of a few and even a few who have done it on the dodgy side of things aswell...I guess its just the job that you may require it to do which will determine that.

[charlie caller 3,654]

  On 28/05/2014 at 21:15, abarrett said:

Don't ask the FEO what he / she thinks the ground is suited for the answer will be air rifle

 

Tell the FEO foxes are causing you a problem you need to deal with them so you want a hmr for the foxes and 22lr for the rabbits

 

You can't use the hmr for both because there are lots of rabbits and the noise off the hmr would be a problem

That of course pre-supposes that his licensing dept sanction rimfire for foxes, some dont, mine included, you can have your sub 12ftlbs airgun wound up to 40ftlbs and put on your cert, but once it is done, even if it is wound back down to 12 it remains a firearm for life, and must be on ticket, ring the feo, explain your problem and ask them to come and asses your land, it will save you time and money, because if you apply, and they turn you down, you will have installed an ammo cabinet (assuming your existing cabinet does not have a separate locking compartment) and waited a long time all for nothing, get them out and see what they say, that is what they are there for, make them earn their wages

[Alsone 789]

Personally for birds in trees and rats I'd use the shotty.

 

It's very risky firing any type of rifle into the air (all Firearms (FAC) are a definite no-no and potentially revocation / jail time) and even 12ft lbs air is risky. If you miss a target, the the rifling ensures that the pellet will travel for an extended distance as viable. Apart from the fact that if it leaves your land its armed trespass, it's still capable of causing injury on the way down.

 

By contrast, whilst you still need to keep shotgun fallout within the land for legal reasons, the pellets are harmless and spent on the way down meaning potentially you can get away with a mistake where the pellets travel a little further than expected.

 

There are lots of videos on youtube of people using air rifles against tree born targets, but all I can say is its risky unless you own a lot of land the other side. If the air rifle pellet will eg travel 60 yards when shot horizontally, then that distance is potentially much increased with elevation (depending on the angle).

 

As for your land for rabbits, FAC Air or .22RF sounds ideal. You might struggle with HMR getting a grant because of the extended range, but you could always try. As for paths, the safest way to deal with them is shoot away from the path ie position yourself near the path and shoot back into the field, provided that direction is otherwise safe.

 

I sometimes think FAO's get a little tied up with the backstop idea. All shots need to be backstopped but that doesn't necessarily mean the land can't be flat. The backstop is made by the shooter and the angle of shot he takes as much as anything. Anything without a clear background of earth should never be shot at. Equally long range shots with a very shallow angle of incidence (especially onto wet grass) should be avoided on flat land as should shots into stoney ground, and if you do have a hill or mound on your land, then use it to backstop even if shooting shorter than the mound (it will potentially stop ricochets). Follow those basic rules, and you won't go far wrong in my opinion.