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[dixiefried 269]

5th Gear , drive you to distraction ,if not been around the type before ..starts as soon as in motor..stops once it's been in, latched on ,JOB Done..

Drive yourself .. Everyone else will want to "KILL IT " and if it "JACKS" you'll never hear the end of it !

Will have to" PERFORM " every time out ! The Experts wit that long gone Wonder dog ,will compare ..

This is a Purely Hypothetic Type Tho !

Edited May 25, 2014 by dixiefried

[VOON 1,317]

by

Raymond H. Oppenheimer

 

 

1. Remember that the animals you select for breeding today will have an impact on the breed for many years to come. Keep that thought firmly in mind when you choose breeding stock.

 

 

 

2. You can choose only two individuals per generation. Choose only the best, because you will have to wait for another generation to improve what you start with. Breed only if you expect the progeny to be better than both parents.

 

 

 

3. You cannot expect statistical predictions to hold true in a small number of animals (as in one litter of puppies). Statistics only apply to large populations.

 

 

 

4. A pedigree is a tool to help you learn the good and bad attributes that your dog is likely to exhibit or reproduce. A pedigree is only as good as the dog it represents.

 

 

5. Breed for a total dog, not just one or two characteristics. Don't follow fads in your breed, because they are usually meant to emphasize one or two features of the dog at the expense of the soundness and function of the whole.

 

 

6. Quality does not mean quantity. Quality is produced by careful study, having a good mental picture of what you are trying to achieve, having patience to wait until the right breeding stock is available and to evaluate what you have already produced, and above all, having a breeding plan that is at least three generations ahead of the breeding you do today.

 

 

 

7. Remember that skeletal defects are the most difficult to change.

 

 

 

8. Don't bother with a good dog that cannot produce well. Enjoy him (or her) for the beauty that he represents but don't use him in a breeding program.

 

 

 

9. Use out-crosses very sparingly. For each desirable characteristic you acquire, you will get many bad traits that you will have to eliminate in succeeding generations.

 

 

 

10. Inbreeding is a valuable tool, being the fastest method to set good characteristics and type. It brings to light hidden traits that need to be eliminated from the breed.

 

 

 

11. Breeding does not "create" anything. What you get is what was there to begin with. It may have been hidden for many generations, but it was there.

 

 

 

12. Discard the old cliché about the littermate of that great producer being just as good to breed to. Littermates seldom have the same genetic make-up.

 

 

 

13. Be honest with yourself. There are no perfect dogs (or bitches) nor are there perfect producers. You cannot do a competent job of breeding if you cannot recognize the faults and virtues of the dogs you plan to breed.

 

 

 

14. Hereditary traits are inherited equally from both parents. Do not expect to solve all of your problems in one generation.

 

 

 

15. If the worst puppy in your last litter is no better than the worst puppy in your first litter, you are not making progress. Your last litter should be your last litter.

 

 

16. If the best puppy in your last litter is no better than the best puppy in your first litter, you are not making progress. Your last litter should be your last litter.

 

 

17. Do not choose a breeding animal by either the best or the worst that he (or she) has produced. Evaluate the total get by the attributes of the majority.

 

 

 

18. Keep in mind that quality is a combination of soundness and function. It is not merely the lack of faults, but the positive presence of virtues. It is the whole dog that counts.

 

 

 

19. Don't allow personal feelings to influence your choice of breeding stock. The right dog for your breeding program is the right dog, whoever owns it. Don't ever decry a good dog; they are too rare and wonderful to be demeaned by pettiness.

 

 

 

20. Don't be satisfied with anything but the best. The second best is never good enough.

 

 

Another breeding guide on another forum

[marshman 7,757]

Number 12 is very interesting ? .

[Hot Meat 3,109]

15 an 16 makes a lot of sense, good post voon, thanks for that

[atilla the hunter 60]

Thanks voon another good post in laymans terms

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

f**k me ,tis uncanny .Everything there that i breed to .All makes perfect sense to me .Just as a note ive not found back breeding to be detrimental in any way but may just have been lucky.

[Hot Meat 3,109]

Surely when back breeding it all depends on dogs you start with

[little hedz 118]

f**k me ,tis uncanny .Everything there that i breed to .All makes perfect sense to me .Just as a note ive not found back breeding to be detrimental in any way but may just have been lucky.

Ray oppenheimmer bred for the show ring there is some other articles he wrote and his genetics research and theorys were based on a dogs physical appreance and looks sure he was big on bull terriers and bull breeds for the show ring

[jeemes 4,453]

doesnt really matter what you are breeding for,its just different traits.

[Bolero 67]

On 18/05/2014 at 03:22, jeemes said:

You can get rid of any fault by in breeding even if both of your origional stock have the fault, but you do have to cull without question,to purefy the genes. I always try to remember that genes from both parents divide and rejoin randomly to form whole genes again in the offspring. This is simplifying it but its easier to understand. If you think of a gene as being a whole thing but made up of two parts.It can be DD double dominant, DR Dominant/recessive or RR double recessive. Thats how you can breed together two dogs that both express eg, determination but neither are pure DD for that trait,they are both DR,so that when they breed, a portion of the litter will be in RR and so will express the opposite to determination. If those dogs are culled out from the breeding programme each time relatives are bred back to each other its easy to see how the strain becomes purer for the desired traits. Eventually the strain will become DD double dominant for determination. When you outcross to a dog that has not also been inbred you will then allow in lots of recessive genes again. That may not be apparant straight away because the pure inbred dog would mask the unwanted trait DR but unless the offspring were mated back to him or another pure dog and the culling began again the opposite to determination RR would be present again.

Once you understand the randomness of it it becomes clear that systems of breeding are nothing more than wishful thinking. Instead of thinking of the status of a family member ie brother,sire auntie uncle etc, we should only think in terms of traits expressed and the soundness of the animal and its fitness to breed. Brother/sister Auntie/nephew sire/daughter is irrelevant. The aim should be to purefy the desired traits and make them all DD double dominant.

The only fault in that is your assuming the the trait of jacking caused the dog getting two recessive copies of one gene from the parents and it’s highly unlikely the Jacking trait is caused by one gene. In genetic terms jacking would be considered a behavior and behavioral traits are known be caused by multiple different sets of genes which is known as being a polygenic trait. And to remove a polygenic trait entirely from the gene pool is not easily done and most geneticists say it can never be fully removed from the gene pool like a trait caused by only one set of a recessive gene like you were talking about 

[Bolero 67]

On 18/05/2014 at 03:22, jeemes said:

You can get rid of any fault by in breeding even if both of your origional stock have the fault, but you do have to cull without question,to purefy the genes. I always try to remember that genes from both parents divide and rejoin randomly to form whole genes again in the offspring. This is simplifying it but its easier to understand. If you think of a gene as being a whole thing but made up of two parts.It can be DD double dominant, DR Dominant/recessive or RR double recessive. Thats how you can breed together two dogs that both express eg, determination but neither are pure DD for that trait,they are both DR,so that when they breed, a portion of the litter will be in RR and so will express the opposite to determination. If those dogs are culled out from the breeding programme each time relatives are bred back to each other its easy to see how the strain becomes purer for the desired traits. Eventually the strain will become DD double dominant for determination. When you outcross to a dog that has not also been inbred you will then allow in lots of recessive genes again. That may not be apparant straight away because the pure inbred dog would mask the unwanted trait DR but unless the offspring were mated back to him or another pure dog and the culling began again the opposite to determination RR would be present again.

Once you understand the randomness of it it becomes clear that systems of breeding are nothing more than wishful thinking. Instead of thinking of the status of a family member ie brother,sire auntie uncle etc, we should only think in terms of traits expressed and the soundness of the animal and its fitness to breed. Brother/sister Auntie/nephew sire/daughter is irrelevant. The aim should be to purefy the desired traits and make them all DD double dominant.

Correct but the only way to get to the point where the DD is the only set with the line is by doing those exact systems of breeding you are calling irrelevant. Breeding  unrelated dogs of the same together when trying to do what your describing to get DD as the only possible combination in the gene pool won’t work because of the  two unrelated dogs not being likely to have those genes in the same combination and the same location on the chromosomes. 

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

Bollocks 

[Bolero 67]

1 minute ago, foxdropper said:

Bollocks 

Lmmfao your a perpetual child you clown. The face that you are taking time to find my posts to comment on them shows you think about me way to much. 

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

No mate .Take a step back and think why your a clown .You say you live in back of beyond where no one knows you yet you won’t put  a pic of your dogs up .You feel the need to criticise everyone’s opinion yet still nothing to back up your incessant bleating .Either put pics up of your superior stock or do a festive f**k off .

Finding your  posts ain’t hard  yanky doodle ,it’s in every topic I frequent 

[Bolero 67]

1 minute ago, foxdropper said:

No mate .Take a step back and think why your a clown .You say you live in back of beyond where no one knows you yet you won’t put  a pic of your dogs up .You feel the need to criticise everyone’s opinion yet still nothing to back up your incessant bleating .Either put pics up of your superior stock or do a festive f**k off .

Never once said no one knew me where I live but okay. I live in the rural part of the state people not knowing about a yard of dogs is completely different than them not knowing me both my neighbors know and as it’s a small town we all pretty know each other. I find it funny that a bunch of you do nothing but criticize and talk down to people and when they don’t bow down and give it right back y’all play the victim card and act as if you all weren’t being complete assholes to the person you chose that day as your entertainment. So as far I’m concerned not an ounce of respect needs to be shown to som of such low character as you