South hams hunter 8,926 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 scotts a performance line mate bred for hunting\guard work and the are a lot more athletic, Johnson's type are a heavy set dog. I read that painter line dogs were bred for the box but i'm not sure of it. Was it the English bull terrier who held the record for the most number of rats killed? I believe so kd, thats what I was saying they had the extra tenacity to kill a great deal more rats but couldn't do smaller numbers as quick 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
South hams hunter 8,926 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 Cheers for clearing that up 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
neems 2,406 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 I don't think terriers back then were anything like modern terriers. They wouldn't have had the after care available,and they probably would have been running around free to keep rat populations down etc Any really hard/game ones would just get injured and soon die not passing on their genes. imo some would have been crossed with bulldogs to make them harder for the ratting competitionns,and a small amount of those crosses would have been added to the bulldog to bring down the size. from what I've read the bull and terriers weren't agile enough for small numbers but had the gameness for the big numbers of rats but where prodimently used for dog fighting I don't think a dog bred to hold large aggressive quarry would have been crossed with a dog bred primarily to kill rats and yap at foxes and badgers to make an improved fighting dog. They'd just use the pure bulldog imo they might have added some specially bred rat-pit bull-terrier blood later,to reduce the size without losing too much gameness,but not much imo. all just theories now,but imo the KC have mixed people up,the EBT was a cross bred dog that didn't get used for much but showing,the staff got registered as a terrier too imo to latch onto the show market. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
South hams hunter 8,926 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 The staff was created by breeding the bulldog to a terrier Quote Link to post Share on other sites
j j m 6,553 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 interesting Quote Link to post Share on other sites
neems 2,406 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 The staff was created by breeding the bulldog to a terrier I don't think so,just another of the KC's weird and wonderful stories. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
South hams hunter 8,926 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 The staff was created by breeding the bulldog to a terrierI don't think so,just another of the KC's weird and wonderful stories. oh so please do explain how it was Quote Link to post Share on other sites
neems 2,406 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 The staff was created by breeding the bulldog to a terrierI don't think so,just another of the KC's weird and wonderful stories. oh so please do explain how it was I think it went how I wrote above,all just theories now of course. staffs and pitbulls are basically the original bulldog with a very small amount of terrier blood. probably had more crap like pug added to KC staffs more recently. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
South hams hunter 8,926 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 For there to be a small amount of terrier blood they would have had to produce an f1 to reduce the blood Quote Link to post Share on other sites
neems 2,406 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 For there to be a small amount of terrier blood they would have had to produce an f1 to reduce the blood Yeah and then breed back to the bulldog. maybe there was the odd rat pit dog that could hold its own so they bred it to a bulldog to make a litter of smaller dogs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
South hams hunter 8,926 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 Therefore the bull terrier was created by breeding the bulldog to a terrier Quote Link to post Share on other sites
neems 2,406 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 Therefore the bull terrier was created by breeding the bulldog to a terrierno more than the modern greyhound was created by crossing greyhounds with bulldogs. There was a very small amount of bull-terrier added to the bulldog,Is my thinking. but maybe the KC is right about this and all it's other stories. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
South hams hunter 8,926 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 Ok Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gnasher16 30,270 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 the apbt greatly increases the chances of fire but doesn't Guarantee it otherwise all halfx bull/greyhounds would hammer every fox they ever met but anyone with experience of these will be able to tell you that your chance is greatly increased but you still get ones that will spew like any other cross I no you dont realise it but you are talking about something completely different to what im talking about. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gnasher16 30,270 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 The staff was created by breeding the bulldog to a terrierI don't think so,just another of the KC's weird and wonderful stories.oh so please do explain how it was I think it went how I wrote above,all just theories now of course. staffs and pitbulls are basically the original bulldog with a very small amount of terrier blood. probably had more crap like pug added to KC staffs more recently. Im not much into the history myself but ive seen some really interesting posts by Stabs off here regarding the origins of the Bull and Terrier.......might be worth finding and having a butchers at Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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