Alrounder X Alrounder

[fox digger 1,086]

paulus as i have said if they do it it is a bonus, im sure there are oceans of them that do it but if they didnt do it but done all other running game would you rob them of the title an all round running dog? some of the lurchers ive had would retrieve dead or wounded game, would flush different bits and pieces from cover but it wouldnt bother me if they didnt, and in reality my earlier post i stated that they are not as good as a dog bred for purpose, ie the saluki hybred for hare, bullx for fox, so in reality how will the lurcher compare to a purpose bred gun dog.... poorly imo so ill use them for what they were bred to do and thats run down and catch game, ill stick to hounds and spaniels for cover work or shooting over.....

[bird 9,926]

very few travelled in the old days and these were not to far back in the lurcher all edible onthe land thy dwelt was usually classed has a allrounder .The moorhens and ducks meant the animal had to havera liking for water installed either from breeding or constant ascociation has pups.shooting may not mean the gun sling shot catty was usually the moochers tool or throwing stick.seen many a long ear took out off his stride with a stick .atb bunnys.

 

well i am truly fecked then lol, because both my dogs don't like water, Buck worse than Bryn , they will only go in if they feel there feet on the bottom , lol and Buck got thick coat as well feckin wimps lol

[Sirius 1,391]

SHH was it not too long ago, you had 3 seperate dogs a catch dog, a hold dog and a kill dog? Can't remember the ins and outs but it was many a user name before,

That was THL comedy gold... Good old SHH dances 12345 or whatever other user name!

Edited March 4, 2014 by Sirius

[Sirius 1,391]

So is a allrounder a dog which catches all quarry or a dog which can catch all quarry and be good at all disaplines ?? If it's the latter, it's a perfect dog and I doubt it exists let alone being two of them to bred together lol

[bunnys 1,228]

 

 

Can a dog be classed as an all-rounder if it doesn't work with the gun?

 

with all due respect and im not saying this in a smart way but a lurcher is a running dog, if it does all the game previously mentioned and never used with a gun then imo yes, it an allrounder.

A spaniel or pointer is a gun dog....... i dont ever work any lurcher with a gun and if they did it would possible be a bonus but i use a purpose bred gun dog for gun work. a german pointer is a HPR, as are most of the continental breeds, where as the english pointer isnt HPR, retrieve isnt in its title, some do retrieve, some dont, that doesnt stop them being a gun dog........ if they retrieve its a bonus but you wouldnt buy one expecting it to retrieve, likewise i wouldnt buy or breed a running dog with the intention of using it as a gun dog.

 

they can make a good fist of it when given the opportunity even retrieving wildfowl in water, my old dog loves nothing more than picking up in the hide late summer or roosting late winter, he will flush and find dead and pricked pheasant is handy on the beating line and bob on following a blood trail, so why restrict a dog to running when it potentially has the ability to do far,far more

 

i agree it aint a lurcher ta me if running was the be all end all.atb bunnys

[nothernlite 18,089]

Not all lurcher boys shoot so none of them can own a allrounder lol thing of the past now with the law anyway so whats the point

Edited March 4, 2014 by nothernlite

[fox digger 1,086]

So is a allrounder a dog which catches all quarry or a dog which can catch all quarry and be good at all disaplines ?? If it's the latter, it's a perfect dog and I doubt it exists let alone being two of them to bred together lol

 

spot on,

how many purpose bred dogs does a running dog have to replace before it can be called an all round running dog? be realistic here lads. j darcy in any of the many books you have written, running dog addiction and the likes (ive read some but not all so open to correction) have you compared the lurchers abilities to work to the gun, ive seen loads of fabulous pictures in your books but none of a lurcher retrieving ducks from a lake or swollen river, none of a lurcher retrieving a pheasant to the hand of a waiting gun........ they may be there but i havent seen them (yet)! you write about there abilities to do what they were bred to do and have fantastic action shots to reinforce the fact they were bred to run!! (of dogs and deer in particular, brillient pics)

 

again all in my own opinion,

[leegreen 2,173]

My Bull x retrieves from water and will bite someone if needed, which can be very useful in the right situation.

She will also help round up sheep, which saves me a lot of leg work.

As a Lurcher, she is defo an all rounder and at seven years old she is looking for a replacement.

 

An all rounder to me is a dog that does every thing you need it to.

[J Darcy 5,871]

 

So is a allrounder a dog which catches all quarry or a dog which can catch all quarry and be good at all disaplines ?? If it's the latter, it's a perfect dog and I doubt it exists let alone being two of them to bred together lol

 

spot on,

how many purpose bred dogs does a running dog have to replace before it can be called an all round running dog? be realistic here lads. j darcy in any of the many books you have written, running dog addiction and the likes (ive read some but not all so open to correction) have you compared the lurchers abilities to work to the gun, ive seen loads of fabulous pictures in your books but none of a lurcher retrieving ducks from a lake or swollen river, none of a lurcher retrieving a pheasant to the hand of a waiting gun........ they may be there but i havent seen them (yet)! you write about there abilities to do what they were bred to do and have fantastic action shots to reinforce the fact they were bred to run!!

 

again all in my own opinion,

 

I hope i haven't mis-understood your post....so basically, what you are saying is that I haven't published any pics of my dogs retreiving birds?

As it happens, I don't have dozens of pics of my dogs (over 25+ years), retreiving birds, I have hundreds. Hundreds upon hundreds maybe even. The subjects they are retrieving are ducks, geese (from water), pigeons, pheasants and grouse. I have no need to lie about it, and I'm sure these pics will feature in a book soon enough...

 

There's four feather retrieve photos in Scooby... three in EL.

[paulus 26]

paulus as i have said if they do it it is a bonus, im sure there are oceans of them that do it but if they didnt do it but done all other running game would you rob them of the title an all round running dog? some of the lurchers ive had would retrieve dead or wounded game, would flush different bits and pieces from cover but it wouldnt bother me if they didnt, and in reality my earlier post i stated that they are not as good as a dog bred for purpose, ie the saluki hybred for hare, bullx for fox, so in reality how will the lurcher compare to a purpose bred gun dog.... poorly imo so ill use them for what they were bred to do and thats run down and catch game, ill stick to hounds and spaniels for cover work or shooting over.....

the idea of an all-rounder is for it to be able to be of use in as many situations as possible aka a all-round useful useful dog, i don't need field trial standard or Waterloo cup standards just one that will make a good enough fist of it in order to be able to deliver the goods when out and about, yes all are different i have three here and one will be gone at the sight of a shotgun or rifle but the other two are fine, it also keeps the old one going out when their pace has dropped off,

[mushroom 12,997]

 

very few travelled in the old days and these were not to far back in the lurcher all edible onthe land thy dwelt was usually classed has a allrounder .The moorhens and ducks meant the animal had to havera liking for water installed either from breeding or constant ascociation has pups.shooting may not mean the gun sling shot catty was usually the moochers tool or throwing stick.seen many a long ear took out off his stride with a stick .atb bunnys.

throwing stick now that brings back memories of me granddad

 

He didn't like you either then?? :laugh:

[paulus 26]

 

 

very few travelled in the old days and these were not to far back in the lurcher all edible onthe land thy dwelt was usually classed has a allrounder .The moorhens and ducks meant the animal had to havera liking for water installed either from breeding or constant ascociation has pups.shooting may not mean the gun sling shot catty was usually the moochers tool or throwing stick.seen many a long ear took out off his stride with a stick .atb bunnys.

throwing stick now that brings back memories of me granddad

 

He didn't like you either then?? :laugh:

 

funny you should say that

[fox digger 1,086]

 

 

So is a allrounder a dog which catches all quarry or a dog which can catch all quarry and be good at all disaplines ?? If it's the latter, it's a perfect dog and I doubt it exists let alone being two of them to bred together lol

 

spot on,

how many purpose bred dogs does a running dog have to replace before it can be called an all round running dog? be realistic here lads. j darcy in any of the many books you have written, running dog addiction and the likes (ive read some but not all so open to correction) have you compared the lurchers abilities to work to the gun, ive seen loads of fabulous pictures in your books but none of a lurcher retrieving ducks from a lake or swollen river, none of a lurcher retrieving a pheasant to the hand of a waiting gun........ they may be there but i havent seen them (yet)! you write about there abilities to do what they were bred to do and have fantastic action shots to reinforce the fact they were bred to run!!

 

again all in my own opinion,

 

I hope i haven't mis-understood your post....so basically, what you are saying is that I haven't published any pics of my dogs retreiving birds?

As it happens, I don't have dozens of pics of my dogs (over 25+ years), retreiving birds, I have hundreds. Hundreds upon hundreds maybe even. The subjects they are retrieving are ducks, geese (from water), pigeons, pheasants and grouse. I have no need to lie about it, and I'm sure these pics will feature in a book soon enough...

 

There's four feather retrieve photos in Scooby... three in EL.

 

 

i did say i was open to being told different!! the lurcher books i have read focus on the running end of it and i hadnt seen any pics or write ups of lurchers acting as shooting companions. obviously you have published them and i just havent read them yet.

 

all i can say is i will have a tighter tongue when i describe a lurcher in future and will possible never describe a running dog as an allrounder. from what others describe as an all rounder shows the spectrum of this term is clearly too broad for any lurcher i have or possible ever will see, and in reality dont want as i think the gun dogs will far surpass any lurcher and i will never try to teach a lurcher to stay within shotgun range, not run on a running bird or rabbit and flush it out of range, not to run on a fresh smell of bambi in a big cover and disappear for what feels like hours!! those are the traits i want in a lurcher not try to go against its instinct and teach it to do the opposite....

[mushroom 12,997]

 

 

 

very few travelled in the old days and these were not to far back in the lurcher all edible onthe land thy dwelt was usually classed has a allrounder .The moorhens and ducks meant the animal had to havera liking for water installed either from breeding or constant ascociation has pups.shooting may not mean the gun sling shot catty was usually the moochers tool or throwing stick.seen many a long ear took out off his stride with a stick .atb bunnys.

throwing stick now that brings back memories of me granddad

 

He didn't like you either then?? :laugh:

 

funny you should say that

 

Bloody hell I was right then??? :laugh:

[J Darcy 5,871]

I agree.....when you dissect the term 'all rounder', it soon becomes apparent that they really do not exist. that's JMO.