Malt 379 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 Following on from a thread in the ferret section, this is a 10 minute video about an ongoing experiment in Russia that is using foxes to try to replicate how we ended up with dogs: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b30_1372049732 I know some members have seen it/read about this experiment before, just thought I'd put it up in case anybody might be interested.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mushroom 13,268 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 I think God domesticated dogs and the earth is 6000 years old give or take a couple 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Huan72 687 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 Very interesting, thanks for that. leading on from that, I believe it is now thought that our partnership with wolves helped us survive the ice age and out perform the competition. An archeological dig dating from 24000 to 27000 years ago showed signs of domestication in the dogs, shorter muzzles, different sized skulls and also showed that burial rights may have been performed, the dog was buried with a mammoth bone in his mouth. I find that easy to believe though, in a world were your sometimes living on the edge, the dog elevates himself to honorary human and IMO rightly so, the equivalent now would be service dogs, who you literally are depending on to save your life. Watched a documentary once called "War dogs of the pacific"..................an outstanding watch 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Outlaw Pete 2,224 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 Watched a documentary once called "War dogs of the pacific"..................an outstanding watch War Dogs of the Pacific. Just don't be expecting me to watch it. Because, I've read about that shit. And how the GI's were ordered to kick their Dogs out of the choppers, at the fall of Saigon. Dogs leaping in. Handlers throwing them back out again ..... High Command sent down that the Dogs were 'Obsolete Ordinance'. To be dumped and abandoned. FFS ..... 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Huan72 687 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 Pete, I watched one about WW2 and the blokes really cared about the dogs, never knew about the Saigon thing, were did you read that, I am assuming your talking about Vietnam. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Outlaw Pete 2,224 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 Huan; Just hit Google, mate. There's shit loads on there. To this day there's 'Nam Vet's who'll break down, trying to talk about their Dogs. F**k me; I'm losing it here, just remembering what I've read! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisJones 7,975 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 War Dogs of the Pacific used to be shown pretty frequently on the National Geographic channel. It's f***ing gut wrenching though... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
skycat 6,174 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 Human: the most treacherous, selfish and disloyal animal on the planet. Dogs: the most loyal, devoted and honest animal that has ever had the misfortune to have aided humans in their quest for supremacy. 17 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nik_B 3,790 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 Human: the most treacherous, selfish and disloyal animal on the planet. Dogs: the most loyal, devoted and honest animal that has ever had the misfortune to have aided humans in their quest for supremacy. Yes Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BIG G wheton machine 1,594 Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 skycat some pretty good points but were not all bad we have given use to the wolf/dogs to help them succeed in life too. but most in the western world love and respect their dogs that put lives on the line in pursuit of making their owners happy. imo dogs and man have been the most successful partnership on the planet. as for Russia experimenting for the past 50 yrs they just have to look at England today to see it happen naturally with the urban foxes as they are using humans as a food source, I guess that's how it started with the wolves from antiquity Quote Link to post Share on other sites
keepdiggin 9,561 Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 in Russia they also use jackal\husky mixes as search dogs Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Casso 1,261 Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Since so many breeds originated around the hunt in whatever form that take (elkhound, fox terrier, deer hound etc) and it's not all that long ago that most dogs kept were actually used for a purpose based around instinctive canine including wolf behavior , I find it hard to fathom that it was food alone that domesticated the wolf The major difference between the fox and the wolf is that the wolf is a pack animal, where other members of its community are essential to fulfilling its prey instincts through the hunt , whereas the fox in this case would never become a common pack member for any hunter, prey drive would never be able to over come its natural instincts based on survival The dogs drive is what makes him so social because he can go by how he feels inside, the same way as he can tell how we feel and react accordingly , the fox can only rely on survival instincts because it has no software for group interaction unlike the wolf 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Neal 1,873 Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 I can recommend a book called "In Defence Of Dogs...why dogs need our understanding" by John Bradshaw. It has a lot about the evolution of dogs and goes a long way to debunk the old idea of dogs as constantly fighting for dominance. It encouraged me to change some of the ways I interact with my dogs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Malt 379 Posted January 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Since so many breeds originated around the hunt in whatever form that take (elkhound, fox terrier, deer hound etc) and it's not all that long ago that most dogs kept were actually used for a purpose based around instinctive canine including wolf behavior , I find it hard to fathom that it was food alone that domesticated the wolf The major difference between the fox and the wolf is that the wolf is a pack animal, where other members of its community are essential to fulfilling its prey instincts through the hunt , whereas the fox in this case would never become a common pack member for any hunter, prey drive would never be able to over come its natural instincts based on survival The dogs drive is what makes him so social because he can go by how he feels inside, the same way as he can tell how we feel and react accordingly , the fox can only rely on survival instincts because it has no software for group interaction unlike the wolf Food is the over riding factor behind the hunting instinct though, so it would have come down to it no matter which way you look at it, be it helping in the hunt or scavenging around the camp.. Wild animals don't hunt for the sport.. Other animals have been known to aid humans in the hunt as well, dolphins helping fishermen, killer whales helping whalers etc. No matter which was you look at it they don't do it out of the goodness of their hearts, they do it because of the promise of a full belly.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Casso 1,261 Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Since so many breeds originated around the hunt in whatever form that take (elkhound, fox terrier, deer hound etc) and it's not all that long ago that most dogs kept were actually used for a purpose based around instinctive canine including wolf behavior , I find it hard to fathom that it was food alone that domesticated the wolf The major difference between the fox and the wolf is that the wolf is a pack animal, where other members of its community are essential to fulfilling its prey instincts through the hunt , whereas the fox in this case would never become a common pack member for any hunter, prey drive would never be able to over come its natural instincts based on survival The dogs drive is what makes him so social because he can go by how he feels inside, the same way as he can tell how we feel and react accordingly , the fox can only rely on survival instincts because it has no software for group interaction unlike the wolf Food is the over riding factor behind the hunting instinct though, so it would have come down to it no matter which way you look at it, be it helping in the hunt or scavenging around the camp.. Wild animals don't hunt for the sport.. Other animals have been known to aid humans in the hunt as well, dolphins helping fishermen, killer whales helping whalers etc. No matter which was you look at it they don't do it out of the goodness of their hearts, they do it because of the promise of a full belly.. It's not the overriding factor behind prey drive though Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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