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[MainAttraction! 83]

A better question is if both dogs are complete workers and comparable to each other in every way but one has a scissor bite but can't bust a flippin grape, and the other is undershot but bites like a damnn gator which one would you pick? I know the one I'd choose. If the function is very good than the form is very good.

Edited June 12, 2013 by MainAttraction!

[jawn 449]

A better question is if both dogs are complete workers and comparable to each other in every way but one has a scissor bite but can't bust a flippin grape, and the other is undershot but bites like a damnn gator which one would you pick? I know the one I'd choose. If the function is very good than the form is very good.

LOL.... You know......you may be onto something.

[bobby blackheart 1,209]

i dont care if the dog got a jaw like a british bulldog,if it does the job it was bred for then thats good enough for me-seen dogs with bad mouths, put to others with good mouths and the litters have ALL been perfect in the jaw.i have seen dogs both with shit mouths and they have bred good mouths-it only really makes a differance to those who want to make money from dogs imho-sure it makes sense to breed the best to the best conformation wise-but the best lookers wont always be the best workers-as is seen in countless lines where they dont care about work and just churn out half hearted dogs/bitches at best-if your honest we have all probably owned a looker that was shit-just some folk cant see it i would pick the ugly barrstarrd thats been grafted and proven everytime over the perfect specimen-but thats just me

[coverdogs 888]

Would anyone like to share pics of there dogs with bad mouths. here are two dogs i bred one good one bad from the same litter but two good workers. atb cd

[jawn 449]

I'm guessing that most of us would take an undershot dog that could bite like a gator, (I've had a couple that could) over a dog with a scissor bite that couldn't bust a grape. Especially if the dog did everything else it was expected on top of it.

 

I guess what I'm getting at is... it seems that in order to justify picking the undershot dog....you have to prequalify it as gator mouth and slap an "S" on it's hypothetical chest and tie an imaginary cape around it's neck.

 

I'm not suggesting that undershot dogs can't do the job. I've had undershot bulldogs that could hold on to hogs easily six times their size while taking a monumental a++ whoopin. Anyone who's worked terriers for a while probably has seen undershot dogs do the job...... and do it well. But I've also seen those that couldn't hang on.

 

So back to the question all things being equal...... how many choose the undershot pup?

[Glyn..... 5,208]

i just think its a non issue, the only reason undershot is thought of by some as a faults is because some one wrote it in a breed standard, breed standards on the whole are written by people who like to show there dogs or stand around saying my dogs a perfect type for the breed, i want a dog for work and the work of a terrier is more demanding of that of any breed, if a dog lives long enough to prove its worth as a worker breed from it...the last thing i worry about is breed standards for show dogs and the length of a dogs muzzle ...and Jawn since i tend to pick my pups before there 3 months old, its very rare all things are equal and i have often picked one that's under shot , if all things are equal in the way they work i hope ones a dog and the others a bitch and i'll mate them together, and prey the pups work , last thing i'll be hoping for is a show dog

[Bryan 1,362]

I know I have when I had the pick of a litter, wanted a bitch and picked the one i liked the most and expected to make the size I wanted. She just happened to be undershot as well.

[jawn 449]

I agree that the show types have ruined just about everything with the written standard. I gave the rediculous example to illustrate a point. All things are NEVER equal across a litter. I wouldn't choose the undershot dog for practical reasons.... but I'd be proud as hell to give it a shot if it were the best in every other way.

 

I was just curious how many would do the opposite. I feed my own dogs..... not anyone elses. My hats off to people doing it their own way for their own reasons.

[BIG G wheton machine 1,594]

if undershot dogs bite harder then why would you not breed off them they could prob finish off the fox before you break through but so do scissor bite dogs ive seen both do the job. it wouldn't bother me one bit if I had an undershot dog as long as the main important thing it could do is work well and if it was ugly as sin well, some mothers do ave em. if dogs with different bite profiles cant bust grape maybe that has more to do with the dog that doesn't want too. ive seen a cracking we black bitch yrs ago her name was ratty she worked well and was undershot was put to my mates working border and no pups came undershot but most of the litter worked very well. I think its down to the individual who own what type they like

[bobby blackheart 1,209]

this bitch has a terrible mouth and gave me many seasons of graft-only bitch in litter of 9-finished many a fox in her day and never found her lacking-only thing i never liked was the length of the dock on her tail-little f*****g wotsit-lol.atb Bobby

[BIG G wheton machine 1,594]

surely if an undershot dog or bitch proves its self as a hard graft worker and gave many many hours of its life under the soil accounting for huge numbers in its job then surely it deserves to pass that working quality onto future liters it should go without saying as working ability should be 1st in what we should look for in the dog

[digger. 615]

bad mouth good worker

[jawn 449]

If i'd ever seen evidence of undershot dogs consistently biting harder than anything else I can tell you I'd have bred a few more of em.

 

In my mind it's an undesirable trait because MOST undershot dogs I've had couldn't stay in grip as long as dogs with a correct bite. Sure some can.... maybe even a good portion of them. But it's something I'll breed away from and even cull for MOST of the time.

 

I've hunted some good ones though....hell I'm hunting a couple with far worse tooth problems than being undershot.

[coverdogs 888]

Here are two that i bred from the same litter, one with a good mouth and one with a bad mouth but both good workers.

[coverdogs 888]

Sorry lads wrong pic cant master this photobucket yes. lol