Substituting Saluki Blood For Greyhound Blood.

[birddog 1,354]

Birddog your comments on salukis hunting and the terrain shows youhave no knowledge of the breed,hunting is a man running from a polar bear sport is me running from the wife LOL

your wrong my friend i ran my 1st saluki x in the early 80's when i had the ground and the inclination for that branch of our sport, over the years we all change and my idea of sport now is a little different, in those days a wee wager was king, i wonder now that given a decent lift on big enough ground whether a fell hound would have been as useful

[spiderfly 111]

load of sh*t there is a reason we use greyhound and not the dirty saluki x.i personly tried a saluki x and so have my friends through out the years and now dont get me wrong they are king of the hares but dont show them anything else or you`ll sickened you breed off them now im sure people think there great for stamia but any dog kept fit should have plenty of stamia and no need to breed in saluki blood ! they bring nothing to the table for me anyway !

[baw 4,360]

 

 

 

baw, you say a hare outruns a running dog that has stamina but lacking speed a little and is well gone...........what about a beagle or harrier ? hardly a running dog they get outrun initially but nose and stamina takeover and the hare has no chance, ive seen them run to a bloody nosed standstill by a spaniel

Would you class that as coursing?

so when does coursing become hunting? if we do it for the sport.....fastest to fastest would give the most spectacular maybe not the most successful but if we do it for the kill why not cross a greyhound with a beagle to get nose and stamina?

Coursing is the use of a SIGHT hound or similar lurcher to catch a hare. It's all about chasing the quarry in close proximity of you so you can see what's happening. To follow a beagle on a trail of a hare you'd need some kind of transport like a horse to keep up. It's a whole different form of hunting. We like dogs that can hunt up a hare within say 100 meters not 1/2 mile away then take to the next county to catch it. Not everyone has the luxury of having mile upon mile of permission. As for crossing the beagle, yes it will add good nose and stamina but these aren't always desireable in such large amounts. One of the worst traits to a lurcherman is a dog hunting up on its own accord. I feel this is what would happen. I also think the dog would be too heavy for serious coursing and with a lot of stamina, the pay off is drop in speed. The dog would probably be too slow. I don't know cos I've never seen one but because of the reasons I've said, I'll never risk owning one.

[baw 4,360]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

baw, you say a hare outruns a running dog that has stamina but lacking speed a little and is well gone...........what about a beagle or harrier ? hardly a running dog they get outrun initially but nose and stamina takeover and the hare has no chance, ive seen them run to a bloody nosed standstill by a spaniel

Would you class that as coursing?

so when does coursing become hunting? if we do it for the sport.....fastest to fastest would give the most spectacular maybe not the most successful but if we do it for the kill why not cross a greyhound with a beagle to get nose and stamina?

do beagles not work in a pack ? and a good salxgrey or sal will catch them single handed

beagles only hunt in a pack for the tradition or the spectacle a single hound could do the same job, a saluki needs the right ground to do the job on small tightly hedged or walled fields a collie and a gate net would do it better.....whats hunting ? whats sport?

Everything in hunting has its place or it wouldn't have been used for 100's of years. The rifle will produce larger numbers than any top dog but I feel the dog is a more natural adversary than the rifle. The rifle doesn't select strong from weak hares, it doesn't care. You could shoot 9 hares out of 10 in a field and leave the weakest one to breed. More chance of a strong hare getting away from the dog than a weak one. A rifle can injure a hare and the hare get away and die a slow painful death. With a dog, the hare gets away or doesn't, very little grey area. We aren't out to eradicate hares or any other form of quarry, that's not what it's about. You hunt to keep numbers down, have a few for the pot etc, not wipe them out. I'm not one for praising the saluki but there isn't anywhere it can't hunt that any other animal can. There might be better suited dogs for certain places but that's why there are so many variations of lurchers.

[paulus 26]

 

 

 

 

baw, you say a hare outruns a running dog that has stamina but lacking speed a little and is well gone...........what about a beagle or harrier ? hardly a running dog they get outrun initially but nose and stamina takeover and the hare has no chance, ive seen them run to a bloody nosed standstill by a spaniel

Would you class that as coursing?

so when does coursing become hunting? if we do it for the sport.....fastest to fastest would give the most spectacular maybe not the most successful but if we do it for the kill why not cross a greyhound with a beagle to get nose and stamina?

Coursing is the use of a SIGHT hound or similar lurcher to catch a hare. It's all about chasing the quarry in close proximity of you so you can see what's happening. To follow a beagle on a trail of a hare you'd need some kind of transport like a horse to keep up. It's a whole different form of hunting. We like dogs that can hunt up a hare within say 100 meters not 1/2 mile away then take to the next county to catch it. Not everyone has the luxury of having mile upon mile of permission. As for crossing the beagle, yes it will add good nose and stamina but these aren't always desireable in such large amounts. One of the worst traits to a lurcherman is a dog hunting up on its own accord. I feel this is what would happen. I also think the dog would be too heavy for serious coursing and with a lot of stamina, the pay off is drop in speed. The dog would probably be too slow. I don't know cos I've never seen one but because of the reasons I've said, I'll never risk owning one.

there was some bloke a few years back who did the beagle thing with terriers and look where that got him

[baw 4,360]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

baw, you say a hare outruns a running dog that has stamina but lacking speed a little and is well gone...........what about a beagle or harrier ? hardly a running dog they get outrun initially but nose and stamina takeover and the hare has no chance, ive seen them run to a bloody nosed standstill by a spaniel

Would you class that as coursing?

so when does coursing become hunting? if we do it for the sport.....fastest to fastest would give the most spectacular maybe not the most successful but if we do it for the kill why not cross a greyhound with a beagle to get nose and stamina?

Coursing is the use of a SIGHT hound or similar lurcher to catch a hare. It's all about chasing the quarry in close proximity of you so you can see what's happening. To follow a beagle on a trail of a hare you'd need some kind of transport like a horse to keep up. It's a whole different form of hunting. We like dogs that can hunt up a hare within say 100 meters not 1/2 mile away then take to the next county to catch it. Not everyone has the luxury of having mile upon mile of permission. As for crossing the beagle, yes it will add good nose and stamina but these aren't always desireable in such large amounts. One of the worst traits to a lurcherman is a dog hunting up on its own accord. I feel this is what would happen. I also think the dog would be too heavy for serious coursing and with a lot of stamina, the pay off is drop in speed. The dog would probably be too slow. I don't know cos I've never seen one but because of the reasons I've said, I'll never risk owning one.

there was some bloke a few years back who did the beagle thing with terriers and look where that got him

you know what these writers are like though mate

[Neoleaver 55]

For me if you want to breed for a particular trait the pure breds are a reliable way to achieve that ie: greyhound- explosive pace, raw speed. Saluki: efficient top end running style that equates to optimum stamina. You just have to accept these gains may come with losses in other area's, more speed less stamina and vice versa, as well as reduced tractability, nose etc.

What I would like to see is more people going to the 'full coursing' hybrids instead of gh or whippet to produce 1st cross types ie collie or terrier to coursing dog. Just because a sighthound has bags of speed in the case of gh or stamina if saluki it doesnt always mean they have the drive/nous/cunning to run quarry. A 'tested' coursing hound brings all of this to the table along with the speed/stamina.

On another point, you often here people slating the saluki's intractible, stubborn nature but in my experience they're certainly no worse than a pure gh. Maybe the two I had experience with were unusually good, but to me they seemed like any other sighthound, whippet excepted.

Edited April 20, 2013 by Neoleaver

[weasle 1,119]

Good post baw,You even mentioned twitch muscles you will be writing for the countrymans next.

Im no expert i just do a bit..somtimes.

Greys dont only bring speed in my opion,they are easy to live with, plenty would take fox back in the day,Straight forward.

I dont want to be a dog cycoligist,I want a dog that i can take anywhere,and do what i want it to do.

Horses for courses why do i need half saluki to sprint a 100 yards after a rabbit?Plenty of lurcherxlurchers with saluki in the mix somewhere and decent dogs,but you wouldnt convince me to buy say a colliexsaluki over a greyxcollie.

In my opion it would be a big mistake for the lurcher world to turn its back on the grey,Im really surprised that no one has set about breeding (improving)greyhounds suitable for field work.

[desertbred 5,490]

The greyhound was originally used for field work then it was adapted over generations for the track. The old lines of irish coursing greyhounds were big powerful dogs and could do the job well but then the experimentors took over to introduce more pace as some one said the other day look at that coursing greyhound Master Mcgrath from the 1850,s must have had all the qualities of a field hound

Edited April 20, 2013 by desertbred

[weasle 1,119]

The greyhound was originally used for field work then it was adapted over generations for the track. The old lines of irish coursing greyhounds were big powerful dogs and could do the job well but then the experimentors took over to introduce more pace as some one said the other day look at that coursing greyhound Master Mcgrath from the 1850,s must have had all the qualities of a field hound

Yes mate agrea,What happened with all the greys that where coarsing before the ban,have they all been allowed to die out?

On another note some one said you shouldnt be breeding a dog that isnt perfect or along those lines,Maybe you can get a perfect one trick pony?but for your average lurcher lad that wants to do a bit of this, bit of that theres always going to be somthing that isnt perfect couarage,feet stamina,strength,brains the list is endless.I doubt even lads that claim to have had a "dog of a life time" would be able to say it was perfect.

[Country Joe 1,411]

 

 

Baw,I won't quote that long post as it'll fill the page but you hit the nail on the head..brilliant post.....now who wrote it because it wasn't bollox for a change lol

cheers pal, only took me 4 minutes too

 

 

Baw have you employed a script writer, thats one of the best and sensible posts ive seen on here.

[Country Joe 1,411]

Regarding coursing strain Greyhounds, I remember at a Scottish National Coursing meeting at Annan.

watching two Greyhounds who had come down from Powderhall racing kennels.

being track dogs, i don't imagine they would have done much Coursing.

they didn't win the event, but both accounted for themselves really well,

Regarding Mick The Miller They have him in a case in The Natural History Museum in London,

it was a long time since I was there, but I seem to remember he wasn't biggest.

[baw 4,360]

 

 

 

 

 

Baw,I won't quote that long post as it'll fill the page but you hit the nail on the head..brilliant post.....now who wrote it because it wasn't bollox for a change lol

cheers pal, only took me 4 minutes too

 

Baw have you employed a script writer, thats one of the best and sensible posts ive seen on here.

I don't know about a script writer, but I need a scaffolder to hold my head up after reading your post only wrote it to prove KC wrong and to be fair, I prefer talking shit cheers pal

[stewie 3,387]

All the main lurcher types depend on greyhound blood. Maybe this is because greyhound bitches and dogs are easily available. But now that good saluki blood is becoming available, do you think more breeders should experiment with collie/saluki, bull/saluki, beddie/saluki, deerhound /saluki etc.

I have no experience with salukis at all, but the best ones I've seen on video put a coursing greyhound to shame. They run in a far more relaxed, almost thoughtful way.

I'm told they can lighten the frame of lurchers better than a greyhound too. So that, for example there would be less cloddy pups produced from the likes of bull/saluki and gsd/saluki.

What do you think?

if it aint broke..........dont fix it.............

[St Tropez 3]

 

load of sh*t there is a reason we use greyhound and not the dirty saluki x.i personly tried a saluki x and so have my friends through out the years and now dont get me wrong they are king of the hares but dont show them anything else or you`ll sickened you breed off them now im sure people think there great for stamia but any dog kept fit should have plenty of stamia and no need to breed in saluki blood ! they bring nothing to the table for me anyway !

  any dog kept fit should have plenty of stamina .now why would you assume that .greyhounds havent got stamina nor never have had .they are fast twitch dogs and they tie up after a bit of a run .ther are very injury prone with awful feet .walk one around a few fields and through nettles and a few bits of woods or cover and see where are say in two hours .if these greyhounds were any good every one would have one dont you think .every dvd you watch of coursing rabbiting or mooching it be salukis and saluki hybrids .i never seen one with any greyhounds on have you .or ever see one doing any good in the field .and ive seen a lot of greyhounds over the years ( my dad was a professional greyhound trainer at romford and my uncle trained in tralee