Line breeding

[vixen 528]

Liam I thought the applied sarcasm to the statement!!!!clearly not enough,I used a blue dog as I wanted a blue bitch pup,my choice!! Vixen I assure you people do lie on KC reg papers,its common knowledge but nobody mentions it,I even know somebody who bred in a complete outcross,registered the litter and sold/priced them accordingly,you are very naive if you beleive this doesnt go on!!is it correct the KC have stopped registering father/daughter and mother/son litters if this is so I assure you there will be more dodgy litters than ever.As for putting a dog down for a genetic weakness Liam even though it works well,I think that says a lot about you.If it was mine I wouldnt breed it at all,but if I wanted too it would be to a complete outcross,and I stand by my statement,most on here would not be able to name many generations in their pups breeding!

 

i didn't say it didn't go on in the KC northernlad, i said the people i take anything to do with and KNOW have never done it, the dog world is full of lies whether they are kc, non kc, puppy farm bred, pet bred, and not forgetting work bred...........some of us are honest and some not when it comes to dogs, as i have said many times........a pedigree is only as honest as the person who wrote it!!

[Nick 14]

Surely the same laws of genetics apply as much to a tested working patt/border/lakie as they do a bichon/poodle etc,if a particularly good dog is used over many bitches you could be breeding a lot closer than realised,just to play devils advocate at least with a kc dog you can see on paper at least 5 gens back accuratley how many of the lads on here could without question do that with there new pup? I know there will be lads who can reel off their dogs origins easily,but I bet theres a lot who cant

Northern Lad are you reading this from a book or are you serious?KC papers tell idiots what they want to hear,show people NEVER NEVER put the proper breeding of their champs for all to see,they would be afraid some competitor would know what way they crossed this and that line or particular dog to some particular bitch to get some show shite champion or champions.They always stick in one or two wrong ones in the peds when selling or registering,the pups may not be even from the same litter.The serious working terrier man(not the fly by night men)can trace his peds for years and years all down his line(he is not in it for money)You say you bred your bitch to her father because blues were scarce,why would the colour matter to you,what is so special about the colour blue? Your theory on cousins and second cousins and cousins once removed as line breeding is flawed(in my opinion)they are all still closely related.I have bred closely related terriers for over thirty years,when I breed a good one it is line breeding BUT when I breed a bad one it is inbreeding,and everone else is the same.Somebody said on here that sometimes they come a little small and scraney,I found this sometimes with brother to sister pups and put them down.You advised somebody if the bitch was hindered by genetic weakness go for the outcross, wrong,put down the bitch do not breed from anything with a weakness,breed from sound stock always cull everything else.

 

Your above highlighted statement is total nonsense.............and you would know this of every single person who has bred a litter of kc dogs of whatever breed?? i have NEVER witnessed any of your accusations with any people i know with KC dogs in 36yrs, BUT i have witnessed non KC dogs at working shows being sold for four figured sums of money between terriermen (not the fly by night men), ANY dog can be DNA tested if there is any question of it's parentage , if i had to bet on 100 KC dogs against 100 well known non KC lines then my money would be on the KC bred dogs to have the correct parentage on paper. If you are happy with what you produce in whatever way you breed then crack on, but it doesn't mean you have to pull others down for not doing what you do, Oh and if you ever want to use a KC champion on one of your well bred bitches then i suggest you have it DNA tested just to make sure it is what it says on the tin

[liamdelaney 2,586]

Liam I thought the applied sarcasm to the statement!!!!clearly not enough,I used a blue dog as I wanted a blue bitch pup,my choice!! Vixen I assure you people do lie on KC reg papers,its common knowledge but nobody mentions it,I even know somebody who bred in a complete outcross,registered the litter and sold/priced them accordingly,you are very naive if you beleive this doesnt go on!!is it correct the KC have stopped registering father/daughter and mother/son litters if this is so I assure you there will be more dodgy litters than ever.As for putting a dog down for a genetic weakness Liam even though it works well,I think that says a lot about you.If it was mine I wouldnt breed it at all,but if I wanted too it would be to a complete outcross,and I stand by my statement,most on here would not be able to name many generations in their pups breeding!

Missed your sarcasm Northern lad,we sing from the same hymn sheet,and yes I would work the dog as well.Vixen you must be very naive or living under a rock IF you believe that about KC papers,you say you never witnessed it,its not the kind of information the the breeder will go around shouting about(believe it or not)As for dna all them show dogs must nearly have the same dna at this stage ye have them f****d up so much.If you want to see what your beloved kc and the idiots in it are really like watch the BBC documentary on utube about Pedigree dogs.Thanks very much for the kind offer of injecting your kc blood into my mongrels,DONT CALL ME I WILL CALL YOU.

[TOPPER 1,809]

northern lad in 50 odd years ive never seen a beddy outcrossed to fell / lakie with copper toxosis , ct was a thing KC stock suffered with but i do believe they now have it under control

a pedigee is only as honest as the man who writes it hence if your in it for money its all bollocks

[BOLSTER 808]

I'd trust ''KC'' as much as trusting ''Jackboi'' to not ''Stage a dig'' again

[dee mac 579]

kc is all about money end of it has done more harm than good infact it has done harm and no good load of absolute crap! breed standards they talk about and still an all there s prizes and champions give out to numerous breeds that after a trott round a square of astro turf are out of breath and have to be carried out of the ring so dont come on here vixen talking about kc if you have a breed that you like and want to breed and keep it going can it not be done without the kc of course it can but the numpty punter who lastest fad is a dog are brain washed into thinking dogs need kc so in turn the money grabbers (sorry breeders )go kc to intice the numpty punter in there yard and there money into there pocket thats the main reason of kc and to come on here and try to defend it on a working dog site is sad imo

[downsouth 7,143]

@ downsouth . Mate you'd know more about her breeding than me! I thought she was Brogs Allan to his half sister , I didn't know it went any tighter than that. Probably explains why all the litter looked like clones !

Alan was out of to his Billy to his neice and the mother to your pup as out of Billy to his own daughter so its a lot tighter than half brother sister.The line the dogs are from has produced a decent percentage of very good workers but is not ithout its faults which tend to show up more frequently when bred tight so an outcrosswill probably be the way to go if she makes the grade.I would be tempted to look for a half brother to Billy rather thn a completely unrelated dog.

[vixen 528]

Liam I thought the applied sarcasm to the statement!!!!clearly not enough,I used a blue dog as I wanted a blue bitch pup,my choice!! Vixen I assure you people do lie on KC reg papers,its common knowledge but nobody mentions it,I even know somebody who bred in a complete outcross,registered the litter and sold/priced them accordingly,you are very naive if you beleive this doesnt go on!!is it correct the KC have stopped registering father/daughter and mother/son litters if this is so I assure you there will be more dodgy litters than ever.As for putting a dog down for a genetic weakness Liam even though it works well,I think that says a lot about you.If it was mine I wouldnt breed it at all,but if I wanted too it would be to a complete outcross,and I stand by my statement,most on here would not be able to name many generations in their pups breeding!

Missed your sarcasm Northern lad,we sing from the same hymn sheet,and yes I would work the dog as well.Vixen you must be very naive or living under a rock IF you believe that about KC papers,you say you never witnessed it,its not the kind of information the the breeder will go around shouting about(believe it or not)As for dna all them show dogs must nearly have the same dna at this stage ye have them f****d up so much.If you want to see what your beloved kc and the idiots in it are really like watch the BBC documentary on utube about Pedigree dogs.Thanks very much for the kind offer of injecting your kc blood into my mongrels,DONT CALL ME I WILL CALL YOU.

 

Don't waste your time ............. you'de have no chance, my breeding is kept very tight and select

 

I didn't know that if a dog had papers it didn't work????????? Geez you guys are a font of knowledge , let me get this right....................if a dog doesn't have KC papers it is guaranteed to work AND has no congenital defects AND is cheaper??????? IF it does have KC papers it is guaranteed not to work, it is full of congenital defects AND is more expensive???? WOW ............................ the things you learn, you guys are just so helpfull

 

[dee mac 579]

vixen tight and select from what i ve heard as long as the persons wallet is nt tight they can select any pup they want people in dogs for the working side only and im mean the genuine working dog man with work only in mind is not and never will be interested in kc so fcuk off to what ever hole you popped out off and give my head a bit of peace trying to defend the kennell club they never had and never will have the working interests of any of the breeds at heart its a money racket end of story so its matters nowt weather the odd kc registered dog does a bit off work or not kc has no place in the yards of working dogs especially terriers end of story !

[BOLSTER 808]

dee mac say's it all

[vixen 528]

THANKS GUYS Edited September 22, 2012 by vixen

[francolin 449]

vixen to be fair how many with the PAPERS get a chance to work, not saying all but most are too busy been cash cows.and its the same wth none ped show men.money the root of all evil in the dog world,lol.

[BOLSTER 808]

Think someone should be doing the ''Dishes'' or something else

[Tam O'Void 297]

Liam I thought the applied sarcasm to the statement!!!!clearly not enough,I used a blue dog as I wanted a blue bitch pup,my choice!! Vixen I assure you people do lie on KC reg papers,its common knowledge but nobody mentions it,I even know somebody who bred in a complete outcross,registered the litter and sold/priced them accordingly,you are very naive if you beleive this doesnt go on!!is it correct the KC have stopped registering father/daughter and mother/son litters if this is so I assure you there will be more dodgy litters than ever.As for putting a dog down for a genetic weakness Liam even though it works well,I think that says a lot about you.If it was mine I wouldnt breed it at all,but if I wanted too it would be to a complete outcross,and I stand by my statement,most on here would not be able to name many generations in their pups breeding!

 

i didn't say it didn't go on in the KC northernlad, i said the people i take anything to do with and KNOW have never done it, the dog world is full of lies whether they are kc, non kc, puppy farm bred, pet bred, and not forgetting work bred...........some of us are honest and some not when it comes to dogs, as i have said many times........a pedigree is only as honest as the person who wrote it!!

Vixen ,I may be getting this wrong ..i apologize if I am ...,but are you not involved with the NWDA.. then If you are .Is the cause of your clubs grief not been proven on numerous times ..Guilty of such crimes....Think I highlighted it once or twice and was slated for doing it ?

[dee mac 579]

tell me vixen if you breed your borders for work and they only end up in the homes of the people you really want them to go too what purpose does the kc registration bring to the table it aint going to help them work it aint going to help keep tabs on the way there bred as you know that as your the one doing the breeding plus you could always note it down. so what is so good about kc registration that you feel the need to defend it and associate it with the dogs you breed as you ve staed in previous posts that you breed dogs with the intention of being able to work?