Ireland ballywalter cheating

[Leeview 791]

I thought I had finished on this thread but fair points Pigsy. You and I often disagree but I enjoy our debates!

 

As you will know elsewhere I have asked Kirsty publicly twice to put up the breeder and the breeding of the dog. If I don't get an answer within the next week I will assume that this information will not be made available. To date all we have is a vague assertion that it was bred by someone in Greysteel.

 

I am meeting with the Glenbank club today to discuss these matters. BUT since I made the decision to let it run on Sunday along with two other unegistered dogs I personally will make the decision whether it can run as a whippet at Shanes. I did question its legitimacy as a whippet but was told it had been passed by the Sporting Whippet Club and a top judge of whippets. If the matter is not cleared up Kirsty's dog will be allowed to run at Shanes BUT only in the under 21 class.

 

For 2013 - it is likely that whippet racing will be restricted to KC registered whippets only.

 

I did not see the incident with the black dog but I will be discussing with Matt about the problem about persistent offenders. Such barging can be accidental as can be seen at greyhound raciing daily but there is a case for disqualifying persistent offenders.

 

On the alleged greyhound front - this is difficult. a 15/16 grey hound is eligible and full is not. Without knowing the breeding it is impossible for anyone to distinguish. Again we will look at taking an objection but please don't do so on the basis of rumour.

 

We have introduced the new Novice Directors Challenge and if we decide to continue to support the terriers & lurchers into 2013 we will have it on a level with the Master Mc Grath. So within this everyone has a chance of a good prize.

 

Albertj

 

Albert regarding the incident of bumping you did nt see, ask Martin T how many times a greyhound can turn its head to fight another runner? or what happens to a bumper in the straight?(collisions on bends are different) its called interfering and the greyhounds card is marked and cant run again until its been trialled without turning its head or bumping

As for asking Kirsty her dogs breeding I dont recall last years mm winner telling how/who bred that and there was plenty that asked

Y.I.S Leeview

[Wetnoseman 26]

but how many chances does a regular bumper get in lurchr racing? do you race at lurchers leeview and what would you do ? you seem to be a smart guy

[Wetnoseman 26]

money is the root of all evil

[Wetnoseman 26]

if half these lazy b*****ds had a fu ing job they wouldnt be so keen to cheat for prize money which is the cause of this agro Albert take the money away from it and see how many fights there is

[AlbertJ 569]

I thought I had finished on this thread but fair points Pigsy. You and I often disagree but I enjoy our debates!

 

As you will know elsewhere I have asked Kirsty publicly twice to put up the breeder and the breeding of the dog. If I don't get an answer within the next week I will assume that this information will not be made available. To date all we have is a vague assertion that it was bred by someone in Greysteel.

 

I am meeting with the Glenbank club today to discuss these matters. BUT since I made the decision to let it run on Sunday along with two other unegistered dogs I personally will make the decision whether it can run as a whippet at Shanes. I did question its legitimacy as a whippet but was told it had been passed by the Sporting Whippet Club and a top judge of whippets. If the matter is not cleared up Kirsty's dog will be allowed to run at Shanes BUT only in the under 21 class.

 

For 2013 - it is likely that whippet racing will be restricted to KC registered whippets only.

 

I did not see the incident with the black dog but I will be discussing with Matt about the problem about persistent offenders. Such barging can be accidental as can be seen at greyhound raciing daily but there is a case for disqualifying persistent offenders.

 

On the alleged greyhound front - this is difficult. a 15/16 grey hound is eligible and full is not. Without knowing the breeding it is impossible for anyone to distinguish. Again we will look at taking an objection but please don't do so on the basis of rumour.

 

We have introduced the new Novice Directors Challenge and if we decide to continue to support the terriers & lurchers into 2013 we will have it on a level with the Master Mc Grath. So within this everyone has a chance of a good prize.

 

Albertj

 

Albert regarding the incident of bumping you did nt see, ask Martin T how many times a greyhound can turn its head to fight another runner? or what happens to a bumper in the straight?(collisions on bends are different) its called interfering and the greyhounds card is marked and cant run again until its been trialled without turning its head or bumping

As for asking Kirsty her dogs breeding I dont recall last years mm winner telling how/who bred that and there was plenty that asked

Y.I.S Leeview

 

LV - You are interfering again in something that does not concern you as you were not there nor apparently have you ever been to any of our events. Yet all we get from you is a torrent of criticism. I asked Kirsty the breeding because I was the one that made the decision to allow her to run.

 

Albertj

[AlbertJ 569]

I have spoken to the race organisers today and then to the Harpurs. In future our whippet racing will be for KC registered whippets only. All other dogs must race in the appropriate lurcher races i.e. under 21"; under 23" or over 23".

 

The Harpurs on this occasion DID NOT CHEAT as I made the difficult decision to the dog being eligible to race as a 'pure bred' whippet . I did so when I heard that it had been shown with success under specialist whippet judges and accepted as a whippet for showing and racing by the Sporting Whippet Club. As I passed it eligible for the race they cannot and should not be accused of cheating.

 

BUT I have spoken with them this evening and they will not be racing the dog in question in whippet races in the future

 

I hope that is the end of the matter.

 

I would like to make a gesture to the owner of the 2nd placed dog if he or she wishes to get in touch.

 

Albertj

[twiggy 12]

I thought I had finished on this thread but fair points Pigsy. You and I often disagree but I enjoy our debates!

 

As you will know elsewhere I have asked Kirsty publicly twice to put up the breeder and the breeding of the dog. If I don't get an answer within the next week I will assume that this information will not be made available. To date all we have is a vague assertion that it was bred by someone in Greysteel.

 

I am meeting with the Glenbank club today to discuss these matters. BUT since I made the decision to let it run on Sunday along with two other unegistered dogs I personally will make the decision whether it can run as a whippet at Shanes. I did question its legitimacy as a whippet but was told it had been passed by the Sporting Whippet Club and a top judge of whippets. If the matter is not cleared up Kirsty's dog will be allowed to run at Shanes BUT only in the under 21 class.

 

For 2013 - it is likely that whippet racing will be restricted to KC registered whippets only.

 

I did not see the incident with the black dog but I will be discussing with Matt about the problem about persistent offenders. Such barging can be accidental as can be seen at greyhound raciing daily but there is a case for disqualifying persistent offenders.

 

On the alleged greyhound front - this is difficult. a 15/16 grey hound is eligible and full is not. Without knowing the breeding it is impossible for anyone to distinguish. Again we will look at taking an objection but please don't do so on the basis of rumour.

 

We have introduced the new Novice Directors Challenge and if we decide to continue to support the terriers & lurchers into 2013 we will have it on a level with the Master Mc Grath. So within this everyone has a chance of a good prize.

 

Albertj

kirstys dog is over 21 inchs

[Wetnoseman 26]

mmmmmm... let me get this strait now So the harpurs arnt cheats Albert because you let the dog slip through the net I think if somebody tried to con you they were cheating Like last year when they ran a greyhound they only owned up when somebody spilled the beans They were caught and thats the fact Why are you so quick to take the rap ? Jane that was a good replie hopefully youll be firmer than old felt hat felt hands Al Strange how they havent made any form of appearance on here just some pathetic illness one to Al THANK F CK i only go to birr which is run be a good bunch of boys

[AlbertJ 569]

WNM,

 

Firstly Birr is organised by us as one of the Great Game Fairs of Ireland and as with all events I discuss the classes with the organisers. In the final analysis since I am the Director of the fairs who has responsibility for the dog events in any dispute I make the final decision at Birr, Shanes or Ballywalter. I detest deliberate cheating and if PROVEN not simply ALLEGED I will take the firmest action.

 

In our events we try to be as inclusive as possible and that is why when we had complaints over the split at Birr last year i.e KC registered Whippet and unregistered or non ped whippets . We changed for Ballywalter to Purebred Whippets and under 21". Kirsty asked could she run in the whippets as a 'pure bred whippet without KC registration'. Therefore she put the onus on to us to make the decision.

 

I found it a difficult decision to make because while in my opinion, the other two dogs in this situation were clearly whippets, this was a marginal case in shape and size BUT you can get over size specimens in any breed and I made the decision on the basis that it had been shown and raced as a whippet under a specialist whippet club. As our classification was 'pure bred whippets'. I felt this was the right decision at the time.

 

I discussed the situation with the organising club yesterday and as you know I asked Kirsty to put up the breeding. I spoke to the Harpurs last night and when the 'pure bred' nature of the dog could not be confirmed advised them that it would not be allowed to run as a whippet at Shanes Castle or Birr. Just as it would appear the Racing Whippet Club are acting retrospectively , so did I over this dog. I did ask the size of the diog and as it is over 21" can only race at our events as an under 23".

 

I made an honest judgement on the basis of the information available . When I make a mistake I put my hands up and say so.

 

From Shanes onwards KC registered whippets only in the whippet racing AND complaints will only be addressed or answered if they are made by people actually there on the ground at the time of the race not from people who weren't there a few days afterwards on the forums. NO registration NO entry.

 

Interesting that the one person who hasn't been on here complaining is the runner up in the race - who has acted in a most sporting fashion.

 

Albertj

[lurcher330 2,301]

FFS these game fairs accommodate all field sports ,but after and sometimes even before the event the only people that complain are lurcher and terrier folk,the rest of the field sport folk must think we are a bunch of wingding ole ones along with all the anti groups that can see if we cant get on with each other how will we stand together keep our sport safe from the groups doing their best to stop it.

 

If shows and racing are so important get out off lurchers and gets pugs for showing or greyhounds for racing,and leave the rest that just want to have a bit of crack and friendly competition over the summer at the lurcher and terrier shows

[twiggy 12]

WNM,

 

Firstly Birr is organised by us as one of the Great Game Fairs of Ireland and as with all events I discuss the classes with the organisers. In the final analysis since I am the Director of the fairs who has responsibility for the dog events in any dispute I make the final decision at Birr, Shanes or Ballywalter. I detest deliberate cheating and if PROVEN not simply ALLEGED I will take the firmest action.

 

In our events we try to be as inclusive as possible and that is why when we had complaints over the split at Birr last year i.e KC registered Whippet and unregistered or non ped whippets . We changed for Ballywalter to Purebred Whippets and under 21". Kirsty asked could she run in the whippets as a 'pure bred whippet without KC registration'. Therefore she put the onus on to us to make the decision.

 

I found it a difficult decision to make because while in my opinion, the other two dogs in this situation were clearly whippets, this was a marginal case in shape and size BUT you can get over size specimens in any breed and I made the decision on the basis that it had been shown and raced as a whippet under a specialist whippet club. As our classification was 'pure bred whippets'. I felt this was the right decision at the time.

 

I discussed the situation with the organising club yesterday and as you know I asked Kirsty to put up the breeding. I spoke to the Harpurs last night and when the 'pure bred' nature of the dog could not be confirmed advised them that it would not be allowed to run as a whippet at Shanes Castle or Birr. Just as it would appear the Racing Whippet Club are acting retrospectively , so did I over this dog. I did ask the size of the diog and as it is over 21" can only race at our events as an under 23".

 

I made an honest judgement on the basis of the information available . When I make a mistake I put my hands up and say so.

 

From Shanes onwards KC registered whippets only in the whippet racing AND complaints will only be addressed or answered if they are made by people actually there on the ground at the time of the race not from people who weren't there a few days afterwards on the forums. NO registration NO entry.

 

Interesting that the one person who hasn't been on here complaining is the runner up in the race - who has acted in a most sporting fashion.

 

Albertj

I asked matt snr on the day about the dog. his reply was I DONT CARE they told me it was a whippet and thats it.

[lesleyd 24]

Well i hope you have an extra person on the glenbank team to check all these papers because they can just about do work that they do now if i had not been at the starting line on sunday to tell matt that there was to be an overal novice final then you wouldnt have had one as he was sending the dogs away.

As for this papers only race am i right in saying that a pure breed whippet with no papers has to run in the under 21 lurcher race if so can it be raced in the NOVICE RACE and dose the under 21 race go thought to the MASTER Mc GRATH.

[AlbertJ 569]

WNM,

 

Firstly Birr is organised by us as one of the Great Game Fairs of Ireland and as with all events I discuss the classes with the organisers. In the final analysis since I am the Director of the fairs who has responsibility for the dog events in any dispute I make the final decision at Birr, Shanes or Ballywalter. I detest deliberate cheating and if PROVEN not simply ALLEGED I will take the firmest action.

 

In our events we try to be as inclusive as possible and that is why when we had complaints over the split at Birr last year i.e KC registered Whippet and unregistered or non ped whippets . We changed for Ballywalter to Purebred Whippets and under 21". Kirsty asked could she run in the whippets as a 'pure bred whippet without KC registration'. Therefore she put the onus on to us to make the decision.

 

I found it a difficult decision to make because while in my opinion, the other two dogs in this situation were clearly whippets, this was a marginal case in shape and size BUT you can get over size specimens in any breed and I made the decision on the basis that it had been shown and raced as a whippet under a specialist whippet club. As our classification was 'pure bred whippets'. I felt this was the right decision at the time.

 

I discussed the situation with the organising club yesterday and as you know I asked Kirsty to put up the breeding. I spoke to the Harpurs last night and when the 'pure bred' nature of the dog could not be confirmed advised them that it would not be allowed to run as a whippet at Shanes Castle or Birr. Just as it would appear the Racing Whippet Club are acting retrospectively , so did I over this dog. I did ask the size of the diog and as it is over 21" can only race at our events as an under 23".

 

I made an honest judgement on the basis of the information available . When I make a mistake I put my hands up and say so.

 

From Shanes onwards KC registered whippets only in the whippet racing AND complaints will only be addressed or answered if they are made by people actually there on the ground at the time of the race not from people who weren't there a few days afterwards on the forums. NO registration NO entry.

 

Interesting that the one person who hasn't been on here complaining is the runner up in the race - who has acted in a most sporting fashion.

 

Albertj

I asked matt snr on the day about the dog. his reply was I DONT CARE they told me it was a whippet and thats it.

 

Matt asked me to rule on it and I did.

[AlbertJ 569]

Well i hope you have an extra person on the glenbank team to check all these papers because they can just about do work that they do now if i had not been at the starting line on sunday to tell matt that there was to be an overal novice final then you wouldnt have had one as he was sending the dogs away.

As for this papers only race am i right in saying that a pure breed whippet with no papers has to run in the under 21 lurcher race if so can it be raced in the NOVICE RACE and dose the under 21 race go thought to the MASTER Mc GRATH.

 

Lesley,

 

We will obviously have a dedicated person to do this. To be fair to Matt he had a lot of races & classes to cover in one day. In future, if we have terriers & lurchers, it will be over two days.

 

A pure bred whippet without papers will race in the relevant lurcher races i.e uner 21", under 23" and over 23" depending on its size. The winner of the under 21" DOES NOT QUALIFY FOR THE MASTER Mc Grath this year. If we are running terrier & lurchers events in 2013 we will look again at this. We will be reviewing the terrier , whippet & lurcher participation at our events after Shanes and Birr and making a decision on classifications.

 

Albertj

[AlbertJ 569]

NOW this REALLY is my final word on this. I believe in answering people's queries but if anyone has a query they will only get an answer if they pm or email me to irishgamefair@btinternet.com

 

The one person who comes out of this particular episode with credit is Jason the runner up in the whippet racing. A true sportsman and gentleman.

 

AlbertJ