Does and kids in which order?

[gerfalcon 13]

Its that time of year again when that annual stalkers dilemma in regarding does and their kids and does and their fawns rears its head.

 

Do you shoot the doe first and risk leaving an orphan on the ground or do you shoot the kid/fawn first there by eliminating the orphan risk and hope you either get a chance at the doe immediately afterwards or that you can pick her up at later date.

Edited November 24, 2011 by gerfalcon

[danw 1,748]

I'm surprised in your poll you missed out "my dogs not that fussy"

[Caprelous 217]

Are we talking recreational sportsman who may have shot a few or are we talking professional numbers game here as their is two answers.

in the Respect to roe Management

Best Practice would advise shoot the yearlings first and pick up the mother and other matriarch doe later as the initial shot the matriarch would leg it on report.

The following is not regarded as best practice but carried out by the more competent.

If you are reducing numbers and controlling deer in a professional way and are competent in what you do . you shoot the matriarch doe first and the yearlings will more often than not always stand allowing the more proficient professional to take out the remaining two kids , if one of the kids is not taken out if you remain in the position without approaching the area the remaining kid will return to the scene where it to can be culled.

 

But you need to know your ground and be proficient in what you do, so there are two answers H

Edited November 25, 2011 by Caprelous

[gerfalcon 13]

I'm surprised in your poll you missed out "my dogs not that fussy"

 

I was taking that as read

 

But I'll add it just to keep you happy.

Edited November 24, 2011 by gerfalcon

[gerfalcon 13]

Are we talking recreational sportsman who may have shot a few or are we talking professional numbers game here as their is two answers.

in the Respect to roe Management

Best Practice would advise shoot the yearlings first and pick up the mother and other matriarch doe later as the initial shot the matriarch would leg it on report.

 

If you are reducing numbers and controlling deer in a professional way and are competent in what you do . you shoot the matriarch doe first and the yearlings will more often than not always stand allowing the more proficient professional to take out the remaining two doe kids , if one of the kids is not taken out if you remain in the position without approaching the area the remaining kid will return to the scene where it to can be culled.

 

But you need to know your ground and be proficient in what you do, so there are two answers H

 

Ok, so we've covered the bases in regards to roe. What about the other deer species?

 

Where do you draw the line regarding competency in regards to recreational stalkers or should that be a seperate discussion?

Edited November 24, 2011 by gerfalcon

[paulus 26]

carnt be good for your health spending this long with your head up your own arse

[gerfalcon 13]

I wouldn't know. I was relying upon you and yours to keep us all informed how that all worked.

[Sherrif 1]

Doe first and wait at least 30 minutes to see if the Kids re-appear, others reckon if the kids leg it after the shot they will be there again in the next few days, in my experience that rarely happens.

[Caprelous 217]

Doe first and wait at least 30 minutes to see if the Kids re-appear, others reckon if the kids leg it after the shot they will be there again in the next few days, in my experience that rarely happens.

 

I have found that the kids usually stand immediately after the initial shot for a short period of time ,just enough time in my view to also take out the other kids straight away very rarely do they leg it after the initial shot but when this situation has occurred they revisit the scene within 30 minutes to find the mother doe

[Squirrel_Basher 17,100]

I would say no hard and fast rules in any situation .The size and apparent condition of the followers would be the overriding factor in my choice but to get numbers you HAVE to shoot the doe first there is no alternative .I have taken many followers being one of two with the knowledge that the survivor will do better .Yeld does are a preference but not always apparent ,with followers unseen nearby sometimes . As said ,shoot a doe and then wait or shoot a follower and see the others scamper off not to return .

The lie of the land would be a factor too .If the doe was a marginal shot to start with then a follower in a good position would be my choice .This would apply to fallow as well .Reds i guess also but no knowledge of theses at all .Munties however ,being not that well populated around me would entail a photo shoot with the rifle down .I would say that within herds of larger species of deer,an orphaned follower would stand a better chance of survival.It all runs hand in hand with time spent really but a good topic none the less .

PS many roe in Greece ,lol.

[tommydeer 2]

well said that man

[Yokel Matt 918]

Not that I don't want to stick my neck out but i'm a bit on the fence. In all honesty i'd follow Foxdroppers philosophy although I appreciate a poll is more black and white. Generally Before Christmas - followers first unless its open ground and the chances of the followers pausing safe and within range (with the doe on the floor) are favourable. After Chrismas if the followers seem strong enough I'd probably look to take the Doe first with the intention of picking up the followers. Obviously if there is a weak looking young one, especially out of a pair, they'd be my priority.

[Caprelous 217]

Are we talking recreational sportsman who may have shot a few or are we talking professional numbers game here as their is two answers.

in the Respect to roe Management

Best Practice would advise shoot the yearlings first and pick up the mother and other matriarch doe later as the initial shot the matriarch would leg it on report.

 

If you are reducing numbers and controlling deer in a professional way and are competent in what you do . you shoot the matriarch doe first and the yearlings will more often than not always stand allowing the more proficient professional to take out the remaining two doe kids , if one of the kids is not taken out if you remain in the position without approaching the area the remaining kid will return to the scene where it to can be culled.

 

But you need to know your ground and be proficient in what you do, so there are two answers H

 

Ok, so we've covered the bases in regards to roe. What about the other deer species?

 

Well structure the question in a manner then that takes in the procedure for the different species of deer , your question related to Does and kids , If you had worded it different and included other species then each answer would have been different very ambiguous in its inference to say the least and the poll would need adapting as the answers given would not represent the full and true picture of procedure, also what is regarded as correct procedure by the Deer Initiative does not reflect the proceedure carried out by those engaged professionally in reducing numbers in forestry protection. I have to say the question generally is flawed at the outset.

 

 

Where do you draw the line regarding competency in regards to recreational stalkers or should that be a seperate discussion?

 

Mixing the two questions and trying to lump the two together isnt going to achieve anything other than confusion to a novice stalker , you know it and i know it so keep it separate if you are trying to get statistical answers your going to achieve nothing in the way the questions are put.

Not a fair debate sorry I am crying foul play on this one

Stu

Edited November 25, 2011 by Caprelous

[nastybilly 55]

iv got to agree with cap here if i wanted one for my personal freezer it would have to be the kid but if some roe needed culling it would be the doe and sit back and wait as long as it takes or even return in the evening or following morning ..mind the extra drawers tho it can take longer than the half hour ...lol..

[gerfalcon 13]

Are we talking recreational sportsman who may have shot a few or are we talking professional numbers game here as their is two answers.

in the Respect to roe Management

Best Practice would advise shoot the yearlings first and pick up the mother and other matriarch doe later as the initial shot the matriarch would leg it on report.

 

If you are reducing numbers and controlling deer in a professional way and are competent in what you do . you shoot the matriarch doe first and the yearlings will more often than not always stand allowing the more proficient professional to take out the remaining two doe kids , if one of the kids is not taken out if you remain in the position without approaching the area the remaining kid will return to the scene where it to can be culled.

 

But you need to know your ground and be proficient in what you do, so there are two answers H

 

Ok, so we've covered the bases in regards to roe. What about the other deer species?

 

Well structure the question in a manner then that takes in the procedure for the different species of deer , your question related to Does and kids , If you had worded it different and included other species then each answer would have been different very ambiguous in its inference to say the least and the poll would need adapting as the answers given would not represent the full and true picture of procedure, also what is regarded as correct procedure by the Deer Initiative does not reflect the proceedure carried out by those engaged professionally in reducing numbers in forestry protection. I have to say the question generally is flawed at the outset.

 

 

Where do you draw the line regarding competency in regards to recreational stalkers or should that be a seperate discussion?

 

Mixing the two questions and trying to lump the two together isnt going to achieve anything other than confusion to a novice stalker , you know it and i know it so keep it separate if you are trying to get statistical answers your going to achieve nothing in the way the questions are put.

Not a fair debate sorry I am crying foul play on this one

Stu

 

I'm not mixing the 2 questions or lumping them together. They are completely separate and can be answered as such. No one is suggesting that you can't answer either without the other.

How does this cause or create confusion for the novice stalker?

 

Not everybody novice or otherwise is limited or restricted to stalking just roe. The same stalkers dilemma can be faced by those who stalk any and all of the 6 species, sometime on a more frequent basis if one of those species is Muntjac.

 

Those that advocate shooting the doe first and waiting for the fawn/s to return. Presumably you never shoot does any later than an 30 mins before sunset?

 

The determining stalking competency is going to be a major challenge that those that shoot deer in Scotland as we all know.You are going to have to deal with very soon whether they like it or not. Whether they consider it an unfair debate or not and want to call foul.