The real deal

[Phil Lloyd 10,738]

:whistle:

Edited March 25, 2007 by CHALKWARREN

[subaruwilly 8]

When big fallow/reds are talked about the dog has got to have a "catch as can" hold just to try and slow the deer down (unless it bounced off a fence). people talk about it like its a walk in the park. killing the huge, powerful, heavy critters aint that easy. not for one dog. not easy for two sometimes either! i would like to see the dog that can "Throat" a red or mature fallow buck without slowing it down first.

i have run english reds and they are huge, fast, heavy. the stag ran off with my 70lb dog like it wasnt even there.

you normally find that its the people who haven`t been there and done it that start sounding off saying its not difficult to take a red, blah, blah, blah well for me its one of the most difficult and dangerous jobs a running dog can do, which is why i buzz my tits off everytime we run them even though the majority of the time we are unsuccessful in catching one, its an experience in itsself just seeing them and watching their awesome size,speed and power

[Guest waldorf]

since there are a few members that are talking bolloxs on this thread i though i would put my £0.02p in,here is a small buck taken with out dogs,during the rut,you see the men are men down south we dont need dogs, here we are letting it go,

 

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/8130/422rg5.jpg

 

thats a nice southern buck you got there chalkwarren,

 

i

[J Darcy 5,871]

good on ya Waldorf..... we let loads of the CWD go years ago as long as they were not hurt. and a few muntys too.... thats a fair buck.

 

maybe someone , someday will do the definitive book on taking deer with lurchers,

[Phil Lloyd 10,738]

since there are a few members that are talking bolloxs on this thread i though i would put my £0.02p in,here is a small buck taken with out dogs,during the rut,you see the men are men down south we dont need dogs, here we are letting it go,

 

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/8130/422rg5.jpg

 

thats a nice southern buck you got there chalkwarren,

 

i

 

 

[Guest waldorf]

When big fallow/reds are talked about the dog has got to have a "catch as can" hold just to try and slow the deer down (unless it bounced off a fence). people talk about it like its a walk in the park. killing the huge, powerful, heavy critters aint that easy. not for one dog. not easy for two sometimes either! i would like to see the dog that can "Throat" a red or mature fallow buck without slowing it down first.

i have run english reds and they are huge, fast, heavy. the stag ran off with my 70lb dog like it wasnt even there.

you normally find that its the people who haven`t been there and done it that start sounding off saying its not difficult to take a red, blah, blah, blah well for me its one of the most difficult and dangerous jobs a running dog can do, which is why i buzz my tits off everytime we run them even though the majority of the time we are unsuccessful in catching one, its an experience in itsself just seeing them and watching their awesome size,speed and power

 

i think you are spot on there mate,you dont hear of many dogs being killed by foxes or them other things that bite back,them dogs got it easy,fallow and red kill dogs,

 

 

Was that buck taken with dog waldorf? looks like its been shot in the shoulder. Joe

 

no mate he was not shot or hurt,i saw him a week later he was ok,

 

 

good on ya Waldorf..... we let loads of the CWD go years ago as long as they were not hurt. and a few muntys too.... thats a fair buck.

 

maybe someone , someday will do the definitive book on taking deer with lurchers,

 

put me down for a copy jd,i would love to learn how to do it,

[DUCKWING 302]

YEAH JD,

 

PUT ME DOWN FOR 2 COPYS ....... FOR THE... " . DEFINITIVE " ... BOOK ON CATCHING DEER WITH DOGS .......

 

I TOO COULD DO WITH LEARNING HOW TO ................. THE OTHER COPY I WILL GIVE TO MY MATE WHOS HAD OVER 250 A SEASON FOR AS LONG AS I CAN REMEMBER , MIND YOU IF HE WRITES ONE ..... NOW THEN..... THERE WILL BE A BOOK

 

 

ALL THE BEST

 

DUCKWING

[Phil Lloyd 10,738]

You are all a bunch of poachers...

[Cleanspade 3,324]

You are all a bunch of poachers...

 

now there are deer and there are deer . a full grown healthy red woodland stag. check out how much they weigh.ya dreamers . anyone slipping dogs on them beasts are no better than someone shooting foxes with an air rifle . get real

[J Darcy 5,871]

YEAH JD,

 

PUT ME DOWN FOR 2 COPYS ....... FOR THE... " . DEFINITIVE " ... BOOK ON CATCHING DEER WITH DOGS .......

 

I TOO COULD DO WITH LEARNING HOW TO ................. THE OTHER COPY I WILL GIVE TO MY MATE WHOS HAD OVER 250 A SEASON FOR AS LONG AS I CAN REMEMBER , MIND YOU IF HE WRITES ONE ..... NOW THEN..... THERE WILL BE A BOOK

 

 

ALL THE BEST

 

DUCKWING

lol...... i was only joking actually....

250 a season with dogs is some going....

[Guest Tonedog]

I reckon it's a big call to say NO dog can take a red deer stag.

And then say "EVEN" 70 lbs dogs can't do it. That's a small dog in the big scheme of things.

Red deer are big game, and you'd need a big game dog to take them, not a saluki or collie cross.

You guys have great lurchers for foxes and hares and small deer, but if you wanted to get serious about red deer stags you'd need to breed a totally different kind of dog, probably one which isn't capable of catching a hare.

 

I do think it might be next to impossible for the dogs you already have, but they're just not designed for taking very large game like that, doesn't mean it's impossible for any dog.

I'd start crossing greys with wolfhounds and great danes if I wanted to get serious about red deer hunting.

 

Generally you'd want to end up with really tall dogs around 120 lbs, or even 140 lbs.

My cousin has a wolfhound x pig dog which I reckon could make a great one out red stag dog, and it's about 140.

 

And this isn't based on ignorance of red deers, they come up to my back fence every night, I exercise my dog on them every other afternoon.

He's not quite fast enough but they aren't that quick, this is a bandog that's 70% neo mastiff, and he's gotten pretty close to them, certainly manages to stick with them better than he does wallabies, foxes or fallow deer (and obviously hares) which are also in the area.

The bigger stags are the slowest ones, especially when they have the full head gear on.

So you'd need to start leaning away from speed and more towards power to get a specialised red deer dog.

Something closer to the boar dogs of the world than the hare, fox, roe, etc dogs you guys have.

Which are awesome, just not a big game design.

Their limitations on big game aren't the limitations of "dogs" in general.

[Mitch 0]

I see you are from down here aswell, So what about a nice bg 31' Staghound? or even a Pure Deerhound?

[Guest Tonedog]

I'm not an expert with the definitive answer to any such questions and I don't want anyone to think I'm trying to be one.

 

But I suspect some of the staghounds in oz could do it. The big kangaroo hunters with some wolfhound in them.

The ideal staghound has the head of a wolfhound and the body of a deerhound they say, and I say these dogs could take on red deer stags.

A pure deerhound by definition should be able to do it, but I don't know how true this still rings after not being worked very often in the last century.

 

I'd rather mix up deerhound, wolfhound and greyhound.

 

In all honesty I'm not even convinced you need to focus so much on sighthounds, like I said my bandog gets fairly close to red deer stags in chases quite often. I don't think they're that fast.

If instead of being 25 % amstaff, 2.5 % boxer, 2.5 % boston terrier and 70 % neo, if instead my bandog was 50 % apbt and 50% great dane, I really wouldn't be surprised to see it catch a red deer stag.

I think a dog like that would have the speed and the muscle to take one down.

[deerhound working 3]

Right we have had the discussion on fallow being taken by all kind of lurchers but what about the awesome huge red deer. Anyone had any experience with taking reds with lurchers pre ban. This one creature that is not going to be taken by a 22" whippet cross because we all know it would get killed withe ease but what would you need how many and have anyone had any experience?

 

thanks for any replies

i do a lot of deer a few reds a year ago we came on a big red 14 points a big beast we sliped 2 pure deerhounds a dog and bitch the dog is 80lb bitch is 55lb he burst up the bitch badly and the dog was on him for 35 mins trying to pin him and he did a lot of damage to the dog as well these dogs take a lot of game but this red still got a way he fought the dogs all the way the bitch was 6 months out after it so after that i will never slip less than 4 dogs on a beast that size again and these dogs have taken fallow and sika stags on there own

[hairybull 3]

West Australian ignorance here- how much does a Red weigh and roughly how tall to the shoulder?

13/14 hands or whatever that is in inches (for the non horsey people)? I don't think I have ever seen one in the flesh?