Trespass,poaching,Sight seeing, ok! ?

[sako 23]

Dadioles, again well said! Im usless with the written word, but I agree with everything you say!

[bouncer 51]

I always like the 'how would you like it in your back yard' comments.

I don't get tax write offs and subsidies to produce crops in my garden, i worked hard to buy my back garden it wasn't handed down the family.

Dont agree with damaging anyones property, as for animals of this land being property of someone is strange, I bet you guys would be out gunning for Robin Hood.

a lot of farmers work hard 7 days a week 52 weeks of the year (not 5 days a week)to keep their property wether it be handed down or not.

[sako 23]

I always like the 'how would you like it in your back yard' comments.

I don't get tax write offs and subsidies to produce crops in my garden, i worked hard to buy my back garden it wasn't handed down the family.

Dont agree with damaging anyones property, as for animals of this land being property of someone is strange, I bet you guys would be out gunning for Robin Hood.

a lot of farmers work hard 7 days a week 52 weeks of the year (not 5 days a week)to keep their property wether it be handed down or not.

 

Again well said. Half the clowns poaching haven't worked once in a year, let alone 365 days in the year.

[danw 1,748]

I always like the 'how would you like it in your back yard' comments.

I don't get tax write offs and subsidies to produce crops in my garden, i worked hard to buy my back garden it wasn't handed down the family.

Dont agree with damaging anyones property, as for animals of this land being property of someone is strange, I bet you guys would be out gunning for Robin Hood.

a lot of farmers work hard 7 days a week 52 weeks of the year (not 5 days a week)to keep their property wether it be handed down or not.

 

Or even tenanted :thumbs:

[moley 115]

I always like the 'how would you like it in your back yard' comments.

I don't get tax write offs and subsidies to produce crops in my garden, i worked hard to buy my back garden it wasn't handed down the family.

Dont agree with damaging anyones property, as for animals of this land being property of someone is strange, I bet you guys would be out gunning for Robin Hood.

a lot of farmers work hard 7 days a week 52 weeks of the year (not 5 days a week)to keep their property wether it be handed down or not.

 

Or even tenanted :thumbs:

alot of farmers do f**k all but fill in subsidy forms and drive round in fancy range rovers while thier stock dies in the fields and the walls and buildings of thier farms fall down, yes , plenty of farmers work hard , but so do a fair few of the rest of us and don,t get paid for doing nowt, i know of 1 farmer that gets £90,000 a year before he strikes a bat and he,s the most miserable tight fisted twat you have ever come across,subsidies started so that farmers could produce cheap food , food ain,t cheap anymore so the farmers should get the same as the rest of us, nowt

[danw 1,748]

Moley you are right food isn't cheap but the true profit goes to the supermarket not to the primary producer IF you feel so strongly stop using supermarkets buy direct and then farmers won't need the subsidy they are set by our friends the EU

[sako 23]

You are on about food isn't cheap, try buying animal feed. A few dog tins is nothing, a 1000 sheep will eat £2500 worth every 3 weeks. They need feeding from December until May, roughly 18 weeks equating to £20000. Your man would have the equivilant of 3000 sheep to get that subsidy so £60000 feed bills. £7500 for every 20 ton load of fertilizer, he would at least need 80tonne so £30,000 so that subsidies gone way before he starts spending money actually farming. Tractor £50,000,combine £150,000, machinery £30,000 vetinary bills, seed,fuel,lime, insurance and that's before even taking a wage. Believe me it most certainly isn't a glorified life! The only thing that spoils farming is people!

 

Forgot to add that's bag food without hay or silage at £30 a bale and 600 bales per 1000 sheep so try buying that in aswell!

Edited March 12, 2011 by sako

[Jonophilpott 0]

Well said Sako!

The people that are miserable and tight fisted are normally the people that do well in life !! Good on them.

I know a couple of people that wear shit clothes yet are multi millionaires, If you have the money you dont need the "bling" spend wisely and be tight fisted and your much better off.

They pay there way as much as the rest of us. For some people its not a job but a hobby/lifestyle.

[bouncer 51]

You are on about food isn't cheap, try buying animal feed. A few dog tins is nothing, a 1000 sheep will eat £2500 worth every 3 weeks. They need feeding from December until May, roughly 18 weeks equating to £20000. Your man would have the equivilant of 3000 sheep to get that subsidy so £60000 feed bills. £7500 for every 20 ton load of fertilizer, he would at least need 80tonne so £30,000 so that subsidies gone way before he starts spending money actually farming. Tractor £50,000,combine £150,000, machinery £30,000 vetinary bills, seed,fuel,lime, insurance and that's before even taking a wage. Believe me it most certainly isn't a glorified life! The only thing that spoils farming is people!

 

Forgot to add that's bag food without hay or silage at £30 a bale and 600 bales per 1000 sheep so try buying that in aswell!

well said sako.

[dadioles 68]

You are on about food isn't cheap, try buying animal feed. A few dog tins is nothing, a 1000 sheep will eat £2500 worth every 3 weeks. They need feeding from December until May, roughly 18 weeks equating to £20000. Your man would have the equivilant of 3000 sheep to get that subsidy so £60000 feed bills. £7500 for every 20 ton load of fertilizer, he would at least need 80tonne so £30,000 so that subsidies gone way before he starts spending money actually farming. Tractor £50,000,combine £150,000, machinery £30,000 vetinary bills, seed,fuel,lime, insurance and that's before even taking a wage. Believe me it most certainly isn't a glorified life! The only thing that spoils farming is people!

 

Forgot to add that's bag food without hay or silage at £30 a bale and 600 bales per 1000 sheep so try buying that in aswell!

 

Spot on Sako - for someone "who is useless with the written word" I reckon you have done pretty damned good - big smile.

 

I try and keep the chip on my shoulder under control.

My wife is a nurse with more than 35 years experience and (she will not be reading this) quite frankly the job has really screwed her up emotionally. It is a form of post traumatic stress. Can you imagine what it would be like to have a road accident victim brought into A&E and lift their head only to find that your fingers are squishing into their brain because the back of their head is missing and then have to deal with the distraught wife and children of the deceased. Every day she deals with death, dying, suffering. We don't have much money and the other day I found a credit card bill for a gold bangle. It turned out that she had bought it "so I have something to leave my daughter", after having dealt with a string of people who were dying and who were younger than she is. All that for less than £15 an hour less tax, NI, Pension, parking charges, travel to work, unpaid overtime and so-on.

I just had a boundary dispute with my neighbour... The solicitor charged me £225 per hour plus vat and was not that good.

 

Footballers who shoot people with airguns and get away with it can be paid in a week what some families earn in several years.

 

If a private company goes bust, everyone is out of a job. If a bank goes bust it is bailed out by you and me and they even get bonuses, we of course are screwed.

 

As I have said, life just is not fair. The anarchistic anger expressed by some does not help either, it can be very destructive.

[moley 115]

You are on about food isn't cheap, try buying animal feed. A few dog tins is nothing, a 1000 sheep will eat £2500 worth every 3 weeks. They need feeding from December until May, roughly 18 weeks equating to £20000. Your man would have the equivilant of 3000 sheep to get that subsidy so £60000 feed bills. £7500 for every 20 ton load of fertilizer, he would at least need 80tonne so £30,000 so that subsidies gone way before he starts spending money actually farming. Tractor £50,000,combine £150,000, machinery £30,000 vetinary bills, seed,fuel,lime, insurance and that's before even taking a wage. Believe me it most certainly isn't a glorified life! The only thing that spoils farming is people!

 

Forgot to add that's bag food without hay or silage at £30 a bale and 600 bales per 1000 sheep so try buying that in aswell!

 

i don,t get subsidies for anything i do , so why should he? when i trapped moles for a living, if i was frozen or snowed off , no f****r gave me a big hand out

 

don,t kid yourself that farmers make nowt off thier stock ,sheep and cattle are making good money in the marts at the moment

 

he is a hill farmer so don,t need half the stuff you listed plus there is also all the profit off the stock he sells and he doesn,t have 3000 sheep to feed so dunno where you get those figures, why should my taxes pay for him to buy more houses than he or his family can live in or £25000 on a tup

 

animal feed has gone up , but just a couple of years ago wheat was £60 a tonne , so animal feed was relativly cheap and they were still getting big fat subsidies,

 

you think what you want , but if there was no subsidies the livestock would be cared for better because it would have to live to make farmers some money , the amount they get now , it don,t matter if there stock dies, they still get payed

[dadioles 68]

You are on about food isn't cheap, try buying animal feed. A few dog tins is nothing, a 1000 sheep will eat £2500 worth every 3 weeks. They need feeding from December until May, roughly 18 weeks equating to £20000. Your man would have the equivilant of 3000 sheep to get that subsidy so £60000 feed bills. £7500 for every 20 ton load of fertilizer, he would at least need 80tonne so £30,000 so that subsidies gone way before he starts spending money actually farming. Tractor £50,000,combine £150,000, machinery £30,000 vetinary bills, seed,fuel,lime, insurance and that's before even taking a wage. Believe me it most certainly isn't a glorified life! The only thing that spoils farming is people!

 

Forgot to add that's bag food without hay or silage at £30 a bale and 600 bales per 1000 sheep so try buying that in aswell!

 

i don,t get subsidies for anything i do , so why should he? when i trapped moles for a living, if i was frozen or snowed off , no f****r gave me a big hand out

 

don,t kid yourself that farmers make nowt off thier stock ,sheep and cattle are making good money in the marts at the moment

 

he is a hill farmer so don,t need half the stuff you listed plus there is also all the profit off the stock he sells and he doesn,t have 3000 sheep to feed so dunno where you get those figures, why should my taxes pay for him to buy more houses than he or his family can live in or £25000 on a tup

 

animal feed has gone up , but just a couple of years ago wheat was £60 a tonne , so animal feed was relativly cheap and they were still getting big fat subsidies,

 

you think what you want , but if there was no subsidies the livestock would be cared for better because it would have to live to make farmers some money , the amount they get now , it don,t matter if there stock dies, they still get payed

 

Harsh words moley and you clearly have a small log on your shoulder, never mind a chip. I am glad to hear that you pay taxes. Calm down a bit, keep your blood pressure under control or you may have to take advantage of the NHS and as a (probably) low earner, the cost of your treatment may have to subsidised by those more fortunate.

Seriously though, there is an awful lot of truth behind your anger and the unfairness and inequality in society is getting rather out of hand. The ratio of earnings between the highest paid and the lowest paid has become ridiculous. Footballer incomes are a classic example, the fans will moan but they will not boycott a couple of matches to make the point. Complain about what's printed in a newspaper, but then keep buying it. People are sheep and mostly pretty selfish sheep at that. We can all make a difference but generally cannot be bothered.

 

I saw a slogan printed on a landrover the other day:

"only one life - live it"

 

I felt like changing it to:

"only one life - survive it" because, probably like yourself, I feel that all I seem to do is work.

 

Les

[sako 23]

You are on about food isn't cheap, try buying animal feed. A few dog tins is nothing, a 1000 sheep will eat £2500 worth every 3 weeks. They need feeding from December until May, roughly 18 weeks equating to £20000. Your man would have the equivilant of 3000 sheep to get that subsidy so £60000 feed bills. £7500 for every 20 ton load of fertilizer, he would at least need 80tonne so £30,000 so that subsidies gone way before he starts spending money actually farming. Tractor £50,000,combine £150,000, machinery £30,000 vetinary bills, seed,fuel,lime, insurance and that's before even taking a wage. Believe me it most certainly isn't a glorified life! The only thing that spoils farming is people!

 

Forgot to add that's bag food without hay or silage at £30 a bale and 600 bales per 1000 sheep so try buying that in aswell!

 

i don,t get subsidies for anything i do , so why should he? when i trapped moles for a living, if i was frozen or snowed off , no f****r gave me a big hand out

 

don,t kid yourself that farmers make nowt off thier stock ,sheep and cattle are making good money in the marts at the moment

 

he is a hill farmer so don,t need half the stuff you listed plus there is also all the profit off the stock he sells and he doesn,t have 3000 sheep to feed so dunno where you get those figures, why should my taxes pay for him to buy more houses than he or his family can live in or £25000 on a tup

 

animal feed has gone up , but just a couple of years ago wheat was £60 a tonne , so animal feed was relativly cheap and they were still getting big fat subsidies,

 

you think what you want , but if there was no subsidies the livestock would be cared for better because it would have to live to make farmers some money , the amount they get now , it don,t matter if there stock dies, they still get payed

 

Ok, first off for your hill farmer man to recieve £90000 in subsidies, he either has thousands of sheep,thousands of acres or he's pulling your plonker because he knows how much this winds you up.

Subsidies were previously based on a headage payment so for your hill farmer, at some time he must have kept large numbers of sheep.

 

You say he spend's £25000 on tups well Im afraid anyone spending that sort of money isn't going to neglect their stock are they?

 

You are right animal feed was cheaper years ago. A couple of years ago sugarbeet could be bought for £83 a ton now it's £200. Again diesel and petrol affects everybody but when it cost £1000's to fill up tanks the ppl increase dramatically reduces profits. Fertilizer has gone up from £120 a ton to £350 why? solicitors, auctioneers etc all increase their charges.

 

I agree last year was a good year for the sale of livestock but the few pound difference doesn't come anywhere near the increased cost's. Let me also say hill farmers have been selling their lambs for less money in recent years than what they were selling them for 30 years ago. Stock doesn't increase with inflation!

 

You say if there were no subsidies the stock would be better off Im afraid you are wrong. If you read about the detailed costs involved in rearing each lamb or calf etc they are all produced at a loss. There is no way of farming especially in the hills without subsidy. Without subsidy you would see a lot more dead animals about because the farmers wouldn't be able to afford to feed the stock. I can assure you it wouldn't increase animal welfare. Also there would be a vast reduction in numbers so the price for the house wife for quality meat would become way to expensive for the average household. Have you noticed it's going that way now?

 

With farming you can never predict the price of future sales or the price of feed or how long the winter will last, subsidies help balance out financial gamble and help the farmers to farm to the best of their ability.

 

Just my opinion.

[Richie10 345]

I always like the 'how would you like it in your back yard' comments.

I don't get tax write offs and subsidies to produce crops in my garden, i worked hard to buy my back garden it wasn't handed down the family.

Dont agree with damaging anyones property, as for animals of this land being property of someone is strange, I bet you guys would be out gunning for Robin Hood.

a lot of farmers work hard 7 days a week 52 weeks of the year (not 5 days a week)to keep their property wether it be handed down or not.

 

Again well said. Half the clowns poaching haven't worked once in a year, let alone 365 days in the year.

 

I work anything between 50 to 60 hours a week and that is not including travelling, also I didn't say I was poaching.

If people find it so difficult to farm, then they can put their land to other uses or sell it and do something else. There is enough farmers that have given up land for development and made a killing, now that Labour have removed many laws concerning green belt.

As for predicting prices look at the futures market and that will give an indiction of what to expect.

Increased suicides in farmers, did anyone care about the increased suicides in bankers, another group of well paid people with no concept of what being poor is.

If you are a landowner you are sitting potential weath.

[sako 23]

Quite right potential wealth! The trouble is farmers only know farming and that's their life.They moan about it but would never give up on it, it's in their blood. Obviously there's a minority who manage to work the system to their advantage and those who could potentally become millionaires through land sales but for most it's just a way of life.

Hats off to you for doing your bit for society if everyone was like yourself and stopped sponging off the goverment the country would be in a far better state.

Again hats off to you for not poaching because this is the main reason permission is so difficult to obtain. Who wants to grant permission to people you can't trust when you hear of so much theft and damage going on.

 

As far as future markets they mean nothing in farming you don't know what you are going to get until you are actually in the ring Im afraid.