New International Lurcher Events

[AlbertJ 569]

Five Nations International Lurcher Championship

In line with our GREAT GAME FAIRS of IRELAND objective of giving Ireland's terrier & lurcher enthusiasts the opportunity of competing with the best on Irish soil, we are following last year's Five Nations International Terrier Championship with a Five Nations International Lurcher Championship with its final at Birr Castle on Sunday 28th August 2011. This will have a prize fund in excess of €1,000 and all qualifiers will receive a donation towards their expenses. All qualifiers will also receive a year's subscription to the Irish Countrysports and Country Life magazine, a 25th Anniversary Irish Countrysports and Country Life Tankard and 4 tickets to the Birr Castle Event. Please contact me on irishgamefair@btinternet.com if you would like your show (from anywhere in the UK or Ireland to be a qualifie). We already have five qualifiers in place so first come first served.

 

The Master McGrath Challenge

 

Since a boy I have been interested in the exploits of this great Irish dog and have been collecting memorabilia for several years.

 

When we were thinking of a new Irish lurcher racing challenge I felt it most appropriate to call it the 'Master Mc Grath Challenge'. The objective is to find the fastest dog in the UK and Ireland and to set a British & Irish record for a distance of 150 yards.

 

The first heats for this will take at John Dicker's Show in Kilkenny and the Ballywalter Game & Country Living Fair on the 1st May followed by the Mourne Show on the 15th May. Top two dogs to qualify from each show over the normal distance of the qualifying event - this may vary from show to show. The final heat and Grand Final will take place at Ireland's largest Game Fair at Shanes Castle on Saturday 25th June 2011. The top dog at each qualifying event will receive a year's subscription to the Irish Countrysports and Country Life magazine,a 25th Anniversary Irish Countrysports and Country Life Tankard and 4 tickets to the Shanes Castle Event plus there will be specially commissioned Master Mc Grath commemmorative scrolls for the top two qualifying dogs at each event.

 

The Master McGrath final will see dogs competing for a prize fund of over €1,000. Once again we should like applications from shows anywhere in the UK or Ireland to host qualifiers. Please contact me on irishgamefair@btinternet.com.

 

Albertj

[Leeview 791]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

[AlbertJ 569]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

 

If we are putting up a great deal of prizes and prize money and not taking any entry fees for the final - can you tell me how this could 'smack of money making'?

[fionn 21]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

 

If we are putting up a great deal of prizes and prize money and not taking any entry fees for the final - can you tell me how this could 'smack of money making'?

next time your down south at some working dog show sombody might show you his statue

O BUT YOU DONT GO TO ANY SHOWS DOWN SOUTH YOU OR SHAMUS i might send you a photo for trophy.the travllers will love the lurchers in birr this year

[Leeview 791]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

 

If we are putting up a great deal of prizes and prize money and not taking any entry fees for the final - can you tell me how this could 'smack of money making'?

 

Money brings out the worst in people I thought you would of learnt from last years fiasco with your 5 nations terrier championship(sic) you may of been happy with it BUT there was more criticism than congratulatory slaps on the back

Your "putting up a great deal of prizes and prize money and not taking any entry feesfor THE FINAL" is that 5 or 6dogs? How about free entry to the show for everyone entering a dog at any of your shows? and no prizes or prize money? Might that be a bigger incentive to owners? I could carry on

Y.I.S Leeview

[AlbertJ 569]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

 

If we are putting up a great deal of prizes and prize money and not taking any entry fees for the final - can you tell me how this could 'smack of money making'?

 

Money brings out the worst in people I thought you would of learnt from last years fiasco with your 5 nations terrier championship(sic) you may of been happy with it BUT there was more criticism than congratulatory slaps on the back

Your "putting up a great deal of prizes and prize money and not taking any entry feesfor THE FINAL" is that 5 or 6dogs? How about free entry to the show for everyone entering a dog at any of your shows? and no prizes or prize money? Might that be a bigger incentive to owners? I could carry on

Y.I.S Leeview

 

You really do appear to have a rather odd 'chip on your shoulder' about something. I should have thought most lurcher owners would have welcomed fresh innovative competitions instead of inaccurate and unpleasant sniping.

 

Your first allegation that it was a 'money making' exercise was proven to be wildly off the mark so instead of addressing my response you launch into another coupls of inaccurate diatribes.

 

Regarding the Five Nations International Terrier Championship it was far from a fiasco. It was well organised and was very well received overall. Much of the critism on this forum was proven to be totally unfounded and if you had seen the crowd round the main arena at Birr at 5.30 and knew anything about the number of people who tried to qualify their dogs at the various events you would realise what a success it was. There were no 'tinkers' present.

 

When one tries to be innovative and raise the profile of terrier and lurchers you appear to always get a few disgruntled people such as yourself who try to pour cold water on it. If you don't like the concept of the competitions - there is a simple solution don't enter them! I would suspect that you are someone who has not been terribly successful at shows or racing. Perhaps you would share with us what dogs you have had or bred that have won anything? What shows you have judged etc?

 

The Five Nations Championshp last year was experimental and had a six dog final out of many hundreds who competed in heats. The current competitions are being developed and it is expected there will be much larger finals.

 

I should love to give free entry to all the dog owners but unfortunately an event such as the fair takes a great deal of money to run and of course the venues take a substantial rental so this like many of your comments shows a total lack of common sense.

 

We have introduced many incentives for owners to enter their dogs other than innovative competitions and good prizes such as the two for one ticket offer for Ballywalter and Shanes Castle.

 

Regarding Master Mc Grath

as I said in my preview to the competitions I have had an interest in Master Mc Grath since a boy and have both researched the full history of the dog, collected a great deal of memorabilia including having taken photographs of his statues in Dungarvan and Craigavon and discussed the dog and his history with the late Major William Brownlow - an ancestor of Lord Lurgan.

 

The Summer edition of the Irish Countrysports and Country Life magazine will carry a well researched article on the dog including one of the few photographs in existence. If you let me have your address I'll send you a copy so you too might learn a little about the dog!

 

Now is it too much to ask people like you to give the new competitions a chance?

 

Albertj

[twiggy 12]

what about the man that runs the to greyhounds. talk about given it a chance.

[AlbertJ 569]

what about the man that runs the to greyhounds. talk about given it a chance.

 

Regarding the FN Lurcher Show - it is for lurchers only NOT greyhounds.

 

Equally the racing is also for lurchers only. A lurcher can be defined in many ways but pure bred greyhounds are ineligible.Dogs will be able to qualify at shows over various distances and through heats at the final so the final winner will be well tested.

Edited February 15, 2011 by AlbertJ

[Leeview 791]

You really do appear to have a rather odd 'chip on your shoulder' about something. I should have thought most lurcher owners would have welcomed fresh innovative competitions instead of inaccurate and unpleasant sniping

I'LL APOLOGISE NOW FOR USING CAPITALS TO HIGHLIGHT MY REPLIES ONLY

NO CHIP WHATSOEVER ON MY SHOULDERS.HAVE YOU ACTUALLY ASKED LURCHER OWNERS ABOUT THESE FRESH INNOVATIVE COMPETITIONS?

Your first allegation that it was a 'money making' exercise was proven to be wildly off the mark so instead of addressing my response you launch into another coupls of inaccurate diatribes.

 

Regarding the Five Nations International Terrier Championship it was far from a fiasco. It was well organised and was very well received overall. Much of the critism on this forum was proven to be totally unfounded and if you had seen the crowd round the main arena at Birr at 5.30 and knew anything about the number of people who tried to qualify their dogs at the various events you would realise what a success it was. There were no 'tinkers' present.

WAS NT JUST ON THIS FORUM THOUGH WAS IT? I NEVER MENTIONED TINKERS

 

When one tries to be innovative and raise the profile of terrier and lurchers you appear to always get a few disgruntled people such as yourself who try to pour cold water on it. If you don't like the concept of the competitions - there is a simple solution don't enter them! I would suspect that you are someone who has not been terribly successful at shows or racing. Perhaps you would share with us what dogs you have had or bred that have won anything? What shows you have judged etc?

HANDS UP YOU GOT ME THERE NEVER BEEN SUCCESSFUL AT SHOWING OR RACING WELL ENTERING, BUT ORGANISED A FEW AS FOR THE JUDGING CLONSHIRE TWICE DOWNPATRICK AND THE LIMERICK COUNTY HOPE THAT IS ENOUGH TO ALLOW MYSELF AN OPINION ON WHAT LURCHER AN TERRIER LADS REALLY WANT

 

The Five Nations Championshp last year was experimental and had a six dog final out of many hundreds who competed in heats. The current competitions are being developed and it is expected there will be much larger finals.

6DOGS FROM 5 NATIONS

 

I should love to give free entry to all the dog owners but unfortunately an event such as the fair takes a great deal of money to run and of course the venues take a substantial rental so this like many of your comments shows a total lack of common sense.

YOU FORGOT TO MENTION THE TRADESTANDS HOW MUCH DO THEY PAY TO ATTEND 5-600EUROS EACH SHOW AND HOW MANY TRADESTANDS DO YOU HAVE 100+ THEN YOU HAVE ADMISSION CHARGES TO EACH SHOW ON TOP

 

We have introduced many incentives for owners to enter their dogs other than innovative competitions and good prizes such as the two for one ticket offer for Ballywalter and Shanes Castle

WELL DONE SO WHY NOT FREE ENTRY FOR EXHIBITORS INSTEAD OF HALF PRICE? AFTER ALL BY YOUR OWN ADMISSION THERE WAS A BIG CROWD ROUND THE RING AT BIRR WERE THEY ALL HALF PRICE EXHIBITORS OR THE PAYING PUBLIC WATCHING THE MAIN RING?

 

Regarding Master Mc Grath

as I said in my preview to the competitions I have had an interest in Master Mc Grath since a boy and have both researched the full history of the dog, collected a great deal of memorabilia including having taken photographs of his statues in Dungarvan and Craigavon and discussed the dog and his history with the late Major William Brownlow - an ancestor of Lord Lurgan.

AS I SAID IN MY FIRST POST MASTER MCGRATH WAS A GREYHOUND AND NOTHING REMOTELY TO DO WITH LURCHERS GET ON TO JPM AND SEE IF YOU CAN PUT AN ISTABRAQ OR FLORIDA PEARL TROPHY ON FOR THE LURCHERS AND TERRIERS?

 

The Summer edition of the Irish Countrysports and Country Life magazine will carry a well researched article on the dog including one of the few photographs in existence. If you let me have your address I'll send you a copy so you too might learn a little about the dog!

THANK YOU FOR THAT MOST GENEROUS OFFER I'LL PM YOU NEARER THE TIME

 

Now is it too much to ask people like you to give the new competitions a chance?

 

Albertj

Y.I.S Leeview

[AlbertJ 569]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

 

 

It would appear we could argue all night but you raise one useful point : What do LURCHER people really want?

 

You have raised the question but not given any suggestions. Let's test out your suggestions - certainly the footfall at our competitions appears to prove we are attracting a lot of them to our shows against a very few negatives. But I am interested to hear your suggestions.

 

I have to say I am amused at your very simplified view of the economics of running a fair. If it was so easy why did the first fair at Birr and Emo collapse; why did BASC cancel their Fair at Ballywalter; why are outdoor events closing down all over the UK and Ireland. Running these events is a risky and vey marginal exercise - if I wasn't a country sports enthusiast I would not consider them as a business proposition. As a return on my investment and effort the overall return would be a lost less than keeping the money in the bank! AND I WISH I DID GET €500-600 a stand for 100 plus stands! How many trade stands did you get at €5-600 the shows you organised?

 

We offer the best terrier & lurcher prizes in Ireland and possibly some of the best in the UK - this was because some people raised the issue that our terrier and lurcher prizes had fallen behind those for gundogs and clay shooters; we try to bring a variety of judges; we receive nothing back from terrier & lurcher competition fees; we position the terrier & lurcher rings and racing course in some of the prime central positions of the fair and we are now giving the public two fairs for the price of one and specially for terrier & lurcher competitors the opportunity to have two days at any of the fairs for the price of one. In short the terrier and lurcher exhibitors make a contribution to the costs of running the terrier and lurcher part of the show - we do not make a profit of any kind on them.

 

Now what had Master McGrath to do with lurchers:

 

1. He was an Irish dog.

2.He beat all the best of the Irish & UK dogs for speed & endurance but primarily speed. Thus he could with some justification have claimed to be the fastest coursing dog in the UK or Ireland.

3. He was a coursing dog.

4. He was a greyhound

5. A lurcher is a greygound cross

6.Lurchers are used for coursing

7. Lurchers are used for racing

8. This is a racing competition to find the fastest dog in the UK & Ireland

 

Are you starting to get the connection.....

 

Albertj

[Leeview 791]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

 

 

It would appear we could argue all night but you raise one useful point : What do LURCHER people really want?

THATS WHAT YOU SHOULD BE ASKING THEM AND LISTENING TO THEIR ANSWERS

 

You have raised the question but not given any suggestions. Let's test out your suggestions - certainly the footfall at our competitions appears to prove we are attracting a lot of them to our shows against a very few negatives. But I am interested to hear your suggestions.

YOUR HAPPY WITH YOUR ATTENDANCY THEN=COMPLACENCY

 

I have to say I am amused at your very simplified view of the economics of running a fair. If it was so easy why did the first fair at Birr and Emo collapse; why did BASC cancel their Fair at Ballywalter; why are outdoor events closing down all over the UK and Ireland. Running these events is a risky and vey marginal exercise - if I wasn't a country sports enthusiast I would not consider them as a business proposition. As a return on my investment and effort the overall return would be a lost less than keeping the money in the bank! AND I WISH I DID GET €500-600 a stand for 100 plus stands! How many trade stands did you get at €5-600 the shows you organised?

POOR ORGANISATION,NOT PROVIDING WHAT THE PEOPLE WANTED AND THE ECONOMY DID'NT HELP CHATSWORTH-MIDLAND GF ARE CHARGING £1200 A STAND OVER 3DAYSX 360STANDS,GATE MONEY £12-£18 PPPD X 90,000 VISITORS LOWTHER FOLDED DUE TO WEATHER CONDITIONS BUT IS ON AGAIN THIS YEAR RUN BY COUNTRYMANS FAIRS SO THERE MUST BE SOMETHING TO MAKE THEM WANT TO DO THEM

We offer the best terrier & lurcher prizes in Ireland and possibly some of the best in the UK - this was because some people raised the issue that our terrier and lurcher prizes had fallen behind those for gundogs and clay shooters; we try to bring a variety of judges; we receive nothing back from terrier & lurcher competition fees;

WELL WHO GETS THE MONEY THEN?

we position the terrier & lurcher rings and racing course in some of the prime central positions of the fair and we are now giving the public two fairs for the price of one and specially for terrier & lurcher competitors the opportunity to have two days at any of the fairs for the price of one. In short the terrier and lurcher exhibitors make a contribution to the costs of running the terrier and lurcher part of the show - we do not make a profit of any kind on them.

 

Now what had Master McGrath to do with lurchers:

 

1. He was an Irish dog.

2.He beat all the best of the Irish & UK dogs for speed & endurance but primarily speed. Thus he could with some justification have claimed to be the fastest coursing dog in the UK or Ireland.

3. He was a coursing dog.

4. He was a greyhound

5. A lurcher is a greygound cross SOME ARE NOT ALL

6.Lurchers are used for coursingNO LONGER LEGAL WAS IT EVEN BEFORE THE BAN IN EIRE?

7. Lurchers are used for racingONCE AGAIN SOME ARE NOT ALL

8. This is a racing competition to find the fastest dog in the UK & IrelandTHE FASTEST DOGS IN THE UK AND IRELAND ARE GREYHOUNDS WILL THEY BE ALLOWED ENTRY UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES TO FIND THE FASTEST DOG IN THE UK AND IRELAND?

 

Are you starting to get the connection.....BETWEEN A LEGEND AND USING THE NAME TO ATTRACT LURCHER OWNERS TO YOUR SHOWS?

 

Albertj

Y.I.S Leeview

[fionn 21]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

 

 

It would appear we could argue all night but you raise one useful point : What do LURCHER people really want?

 

You have raised the question but not given any suggestions. Let's test out your suggestions - certainly the footfall at our competitions appears to prove we are attracting a lot of them to our shows against a very few negatives. But I am interested to hear your suggestions.

 

I have to say I am amused at your very simplified view of the economics of running a fair. If it was so easy why did the first fair at Birr and Emo collapse; why did BASC cancel their Fair at Ballywalter; why are outdoor events closing down all over the UK and Ireland. Running these events is a risky and vey marginal exercise - if I wasn't a country sports enthusiast I would not consider them as a business proposition. As a return on my investment and effort the overall return would be a lost less than keeping the money in the bank! AND I WISH I DID GET €500-600 a stand for 100 plus stands! How many trade stands did you get at €5-600 the shows you organised?

 

We offer the best terrier & lurcher prizes in Ireland and possibly some of the best in the UK - this was because some people raised the issue that our terrier and lurcher prizes had fallen behind those for gundogs and clay shooters; we try to bring a variety of judges; we receive nothing back from terrier & lurcher competition fees; we position the terrier & lurcher rings and racing course in some of the prime central positions of the fair and we are now giving the public two fairs for the price of one and specially for terrier & lurcher competitors the opportunity to have two days at any of the fairs for the price of one. In short the terrier and lurcher exhibitors make a contribution to the costs of running the terrier and lurcher part of the show - we do not make a profit of any kind on them.

 

Now what had Master McGrath to do with lurchers:

 

1. He was an Irish dog.

2.He beat all the best of the Irish & UK dogs for speed & endurance but primarily speed. Thus he could with some justification have claimed to be the fastest coursing dog in the UK or Ireland.

3. He was a coursing dog.

4. He was a greyhound

5. A lurcher is a greygound cross

6.Lurchers are used for coursing

7. Lurchers are used for racing

8. This is a racing competition to find the fastest dog in the UK & Ireland

 

Are you starting to get the connection.....

 

Albertj

no 4 he was a greyhound .we didnt have one hunting topic from you all winter SHOWTIME your in it for the money end of ye took the money of people at birr and didnt protect them .you called travellers tinkers some of the best lurchermen in ireland and uk are travellers.good and bad in everyone.but unfortunely a lurcher show will bring all the bad lads back and more because its there main sport

[AlbertJ 569]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

 

 

It would appear we could argue all night but you raise one useful point : What do LURCHER people really want?

 

You have raised the question but not given any suggestions. Let's test out your suggestions - certainly the footfall at our competitions appears to prove we are attracting a lot of them to our shows against a very few negatives. But I am interested to hear your suggestions.

 

I have to say I am amused at your very simplified view of the economics of running a fair. If it was so easy why did the first fair at Birr and Emo collapse; why did BASC cancel their Fair at Ballywalter; why are outdoor events closing down all over the UK and Ireland. Running these events is a risky and vey marginal exercise - if I wasn't a country sports enthusiast I would not consider them as a business proposition. As a return on my investment and effort the overall return would be a lost less than keeping the money in the bank! AND I WISH I DID GET €500-600 a stand for 100 plus stands! How many trade stands did you get at €5-600 the shows you organised?

 

We offer the best terrier & lurcher prizes in Ireland and possibly some of the best in the UK - this was because some people raised the issue that our terrier and lurcher prizes had fallen behind those for gundogs and clay shooters; we try to bring a variety of judges; we receive nothing back from terrier & lurcher competition fees; we position the terrier & lurcher rings and racing course in some of the prime central positions of the fair and we are now giving the public two fairs for the price of one and specially for terrier & lurcher competitors the opportunity to have two days at any of the fairs for the price of one. In short the terrier and lurcher exhibitors make a contribution to the costs of running the terrier and lurcher part of the show - we do not make a profit of any kind on them.

 

Now what had Master McGrath to do with lurchers:

 

1. He was an Irish dog.

2.He beat all the best of the Irish & UK dogs for speed & endurance but primarily speed. Thus he could with some justification have claimed to be the fastest coursing dog in the UK or Ireland.

3. He was a coursing dog.

4. He was a greyhound

5. A lurcher is a greygound cross

6.Lurchers are used for coursing

7. Lurchers are used for racing

8. This is a racing competition to find the fastest dog in the UK & Ireland

 

Are you starting to get the connection.....

 

Albertj

no 4 he was a greyhound .we didnt have one hunting topic from you all winter SHOWTIME your in it for the money end of ye took the money of people at birr and didnt protect them .you called travellers tinkers some of the best lurchermen in ireland and uk are travellers.good and bad in everyone.but unfortunely a lurcher show will bring all the bad lads back and more because its there main sport

 

 

Fionn,

 

What a confused and inconsistent post. What is consistent appears your desire to slate our shows and me personally. The magazine is open to anyone to submit articles - we had lots of hunting, shooting and fishing articles but none submitted by terrier & lurcher enthusiasts in spite of my clear invitation to submit them. That invitation stands. Incidently I do not decide what goes into the magazine my editor does and he happens to keep both terriers & lurchers! In response to people complaining that things were tight - we have put it up online in a FREE to READ version - and we have given a two for one ticket offer for Ballywalter & Shanes Castle fairs - tell me how that makes money? I think both are great value for money and a real service to the real country sports enthusiasts of Ireland.

 

 

I did not call travellers 'tinkers'. I was referring to a post that claimed Birr was overrun with 'tinkers'. I said there were no 'tinkers' at the ring I did not see 'tinkers' or travellers! I don't indentify people by such labels.

 

What a lot of nonsense about taking money from people and not protecting them. At Birr last year there were no reports to us of any trouble, no one was assaulted or threatened physically, there were no altercations whatsoever ergo our security and the garda did a good job and your allegation is groundless. A pup was stolen and we regret that - but THAT WAS THE ONLY THING REPORTED TO US AT THE EVENT.

 

There were reports afterwards ( a couple) by people who said that they had FELT intimidated by people who they THOUGHT were 'travellers' wanting to buy their dogs. We investigated this with staff, show organisers, security, garda and people who competed at the show - they said there was a group of at most a dozen guys trying to purchase dogs. I didn't see the problem myslf - did you? So I prefer to believe what I saw. what I have from unbiased witnesses and the couple of reports I did get of what actually happened to people. I deal in facts not innuendo and inaccurate allegations.

 

The racing final is not at Birr but is at Shanes. Birr will have the Five Nations Final Show. Are you saying we shouldn't have a lurcher show or a lurcher show with good prizes - I seem to remember you complaining we didn't give good enough prizes! I have indicated that there will be zero tolerance of any kind of hassle at the terrier & lurcher rings at Birr and NO DOGS or PUPS for sale. BUT if people feel in any way intimidated or uncomfortable about their property they MUST report it to our security staff or the garda who will be present.

 

Now Fionn we have argued for over a full year and it would appear that we will never agree - I did appreciate you offering to judge Birr last year when it was thought that Des couldn't make it because of a family bereavement - and I have invited you to come to the shows and see them for yourself rather than posting about impressions you have gained ( I don't know how). I repeat my challenge to you to come to our shows and see for yourself that they are amongst the best in Ireland.

 

One final thing because in future I will only answer factual eye witness criticism from you - the terrier & lurcher events at our shows have NEVER made me personally any money whatsoever - if we look at Birr last year the competition actually cost us considerable money.

 

I came on this forum to answr unjustified criticism of our events and show organisers and took up the challenge to improve the status and prize fund for terrier and lurchers. I made a commitment to do the latter and I have met that commitment.

 

Albertj

[Foxgun Tom 75]

First of all, I'd like to apologise for taking this thread slightly off topic! but I feel I have to respond when the "Five Nations International Working Terrier Championship" has been mentioned! it was me that came up with the concept and the idea of such a competition!!, I also had to find finance and sponsorship for the same. This competition was never conceived as a money making exercise but only as a vehicle to promote the working terrier in the main ring at major game-fairs!, I personally ended up using my own financial rescources to fund part of this venture as did many others, as also did the sponsors. Every sponsor deserves and expects some return for their input wether it recognition, advertising or sales relating to an event

 

Albert J and the Great Game-Fairs of Ireland showed a commitment to the event by offering me a wonderfull sponsorship deal and finance I could only dream off! he showed! and came up with the goods when asked for! and never quibbled or detracted from his original sponsorship deal. At the end of the day he's a business man running fairs and out to make a profit! I was sickened by some of the unfair criticism directed at the five nations competition it was supossed to be about dogs not venue's!!

 

I've attended Birr, Moria etc: and would never comment one is better than the other It is also not my remit to slag off any sponsor on how their business is run! I owe AlbertJ a debt of gratitude! because he stepped up to the plate when I needed it! I hope future game-fair organisers do the same

 

Criticise game-fairs and their organisers if you like! but the buck stops with me for "THE FIVE NATIONS INTERNATIONAL WORKING TERRIER CHAMPIONSHIP" mistakes were made with regards to organising! but the final and judging were as straight as a die!! the last thing I'll say is that it was a massive learning curve for me personally!

 

Tom

 

Ps: No monies were earned by me while involved in the event, sponsors do and rightly expect a return for their investment!

[AlbertJ 569]

What has Master McGrath got to do with lurchers? he won 3 Waterloo Cups which were never sprints more endurance related over 3 days Smacks of moneymaking IMHO

Y.I.S Leeview

 

 

It would appear we could argue all night but you raise one useful point : What do LURCHER people really want?

THATS WHAT YOU SHOULD BE ASKING THEM AND LISTENING TO THEIR ANSWERS

 

You have raised the question but not given any suggestions. Let's test out your suggestions - certainly the footfall at our competitions appears to prove we are attracting a lot of them to our shows against a very few negatives. But I am interested to hear your suggestions.

YOUR HAPPY WITH YOUR ATTENDANCY THEN=COMPLACENCY

 

I have to say I am amused at your very simplified view of the economics of running a fair. If it was so easy why did the first fair at Birr and Emo collapse; why did BASC cancel their Fair at Ballywalter; why are outdoor events closing down all over the UK and Ireland. Running these events is a risky and vey marginal exercise - if I wasn't a country sports enthusiast I would not consider them as a business proposition. As a return on my investment and effort the overall return would be a lost less than keeping the money in the bank! AND I WISH I DID GET €500-600 a stand for 100 plus stands! How many trade stands did you get at €5-600 the shows you organised?

POOR ORGANISATION,NOT PROVIDING WHAT THE PEOPLE WANTED AND THE ECONOMY DID'NT HELP CHATSWORTH-MIDLAND GF ARE CHARGING £1200 A STAND OVER 3DAYSX 360STANDS,GATE MONEY £12-£18 PPPD X 90,000 VISITORS LOWTHER FOLDED DUE TO WEATHER CONDITIONS BUT IS ON AGAIN THIS YEAR RUN BY COUNTRYMANS FAIRS SO THERE MUST BE SOMETHING TO MAKE THEM WANT TO DO THEM

We offer the best terrier & lurcher prizes in Ireland and possibly some of the best in the UK - this was because some people raised the issue that our terrier and lurcher prizes had fallen behind those for gundogs and clay shooters; we try to bring a variety of judges; we receive nothing back from terrier & lurcher competition fees;

WELL WHO GETS THE MONEY THEN?

we position the terrier & lurcher rings and racing course in some of the prime central positions of the fair and we are now giving the public two fairs for the price of one and specially for terrier & lurcher competitors the opportunity to have two days at any of the fairs for the price of one. In short the terrier and lurcher exhibitors make a contribution to the costs of running the terrier and lurcher part of the show - we do not make a profit of any kind on them.

 

Now what had Master McGrath to do with lurchers:

 

1. He was an Irish dog.

2.He beat all the best of the Irish & UK dogs for speed & endurance but primarily speed. Thus he could with some justification have claimed to be the fastest coursing dog in the UK or Ireland.

3. He was a coursing dog.

4. He was a greyhound

5. A lurcher is a greygound cross SOME ARE NOT ALL

6.Lurchers are used for coursingNO LONGER LEGAL WAS IT EVEN BEFORE THE BAN IN EIRE?

7. Lurchers are used for racingONCE AGAIN SOME ARE NOT ALL

8. This is a racing competition to find the fastest dog in the UK & IrelandTHE FASTEST DOGS IN THE UK AND IRELAND ARE GREYHOUNDS WILL THEY BE ALLOWED ENTRY UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES TO FIND THE FASTEST DOG IN THE UK AND IRELAND?

 

Are you starting to get the connection.....BETWEEN A LEGEND AND USING THE NAME TO ATTRACT LURCHER OWNERS TO YOUR SHOWS?

 

Albertj

Y.I.S Leeview

 

 

Lee,

 

Once again you come up with nothing positive - let us have your ideas on what YOU think lurcher owners want. I have spoken to several and they are in favour of the competitions as outlined. In 2010 we were not only satisfied but delighted with our attendances at the events we organised : 1. We rescued the Ballywalter Fair with a good crowd who enjoyed the reviralised event. 2. We had record crowds at Shanes Castle for any Irish Game Fair ever and Birr had a record crowd fpor any fair in the ROI. Am I complacent - never - which is why even after 33 years of Fairs I still try to innovate. Anyone who know me knows that I never settle for 'second best'.

 

To me life is all about aspirations and setting goals. When one aspiration is achieved I set a new one. That is what the Master Mc Grath Challenge is all about - to celebrate a great Irish sporting icon by giving Irish lurcher oweners the chance to aspire to competing in, and winning a prestigious competition on Irish soil.

 

If you don't like it you don't have to compete but please don't by your negativity try to spoil the aspirations of people competing in and perhaps winning such a competition.

 

With regards to competitions entry fees, as with all our competitions, the club or organisation organising the events take all the entry fees towards expenses and club/organisation funds. We do request that they donate some of the profits to a worthy cause.

 

I look forward to some positive input from you. I do like the quote you have at the bottom of your posts - if I was unkind I could say it is a bit of a pity that you don't practice it.

 

Another for you : 'There are none so blind as those who will not see...'

 

I am now finishing this conversation unless I see positive practical & workable suggestions from you.

 

I invite you to come as my guest to see the success of the two competitions and the true and justifiable pride in ownership of the winner of the inaugural event.

Albertj