working terriers in usa

[fionn 21]

just want to ask ye u.s.a guys to explain they type of hunting ye do as im getting a bit confused what ye call terrierwork. what type of earth work would ye have.

[Coyotehunter 689]

Fionn, Im from the UK but have lived in Canada 6 years, it depends on where you live as to the type of work and quarry your terriers get , i think the lads down south should get more work for their dogs, more quarry for starters, ive heard of lads starting pups on Armadillo's and Groundhogs, neither are worth messing with in my opinion, but then everybody has there own thoughts and opinions, they have Grey Fox, Red Fox, Racoon, American Badger( out west) and Possum all of which can be dug the same way they can back home, up here in the great white north they tend to do a lot more barn work, because its so hard to get around in deep snow and the ground being frozen sometimes up to 4ft deep.

By barn work i mean old hay and straw barns that normally have coons living in under the old bales or under floor boards in crawl spaces etc etc, thats not to say we don't do some earth work in the deep of winter, it just depends on the equipment and help you have, if you have a good group of lads that will help you shift 4ft of snow and chip through a couple of feet of permafrost before you hit soft ground, and maybe a snowmobile to get you to the earth in the first place, your flying !!

I tend to work on my own so therefore unless the earth is easily accessable and there's not a ton of snow i'll work my dogs, but in my opinion if i haven't got the help i'll not risk my terriers, its just too cold this time of year, if something goes wrong and i have to go away for help for whatever reason ( mobile phones don't work everywhere) and the dog ends up out in the cold it could easily die !!!

Barns are easier to work for someone on there own and the're sheltered from the worse of the weather, you can move bales easily , yes sometimes the bales are big round bales , but even they can be moved around enough for a lurcher to get in and draw a coon

These are just a Brits thoughts, i'm sure a couple of the US lads might chip in if i'm wrong on any points

[STUNTMAN 552]

Coyote hunter being from UK and a Huntsman, do you consider "barn work" proper terrier work?

[ivebeen 176]

Well here in the USA we have a wide variety of game, both above and below ground that people use terriers to work on a regular basis.

From what i can think of i know terriers have been used on the following quarry here in the USA. 3types of fox, coyote, badger, raccoon, opossum, groundhog, bobcat, ditch couger, armadillo, wild boar, ferret, squirell, nutria, beaver etcetc.. Im SURE there are people have let terriers run with hounds on bear and couger hunts.

So really it all depends on where you live and what kind of quarry is around you. Each person uses terriers for different purposes according to what they need. Im sure it differs from terrier work on the other side of the pond.

What kind of quarry do you guys usually use terrier for? Fox?.....

[Coyotehunter 689]

Coyote hunter being from UK and a Huntsman, do you consider "barn work" proper terrier work?

Yes i would consider 'barn work" proper terrier work, the dog has to locate in sometimes massive stacks of hay, then when it finds its Quarry (generally Racoon) it has to try and keep with it, Racoon's as you would imagine can climb and so can sometimes give a terrier a runaround, one of the reason why i don't mind a terrier with a bit of leg, it can be a few hours sometimes before you can move enough bales to get to your terrier, so timescale wise it can be just as punishing .

I'm sure there'll be lads on here that will tell me otherwise, that its not the same as digging 15ft, but i disagree , it has different problems but it can be just as challenging for the terrier

Yes, you can find easy ones , like under two bales or under a small piece of floor board, but then you can have a 1ft dig that take 5 mins as well

[BAD BOB 27]

i think thats a good honest post, just shows there are easy ones and hard ones wether there in a barn or the earth.

 

good post coyotehunter

[Coyotehunter 689]

Ive just been reading one of the other threads about stud dogs in the USA ,

i Work m dogs in barns and earths , each have there pros and cons , one of the lads made the claim that it easy to find a coon in a barn, but when you look at it the terrier has quite the job, unless there's a high density of coons, your terrier has to try and smell a scent through dusty mouldy old hay, your earth dog has damp moist easy to scent earth, your earth dog then has to work in a tight confined area, so can the terrier working the the barn but more than likely to have more area to work in, just a couple of pros and cons in the differences

[McKay69 6]

I am in the north east US and it does get pretty cold around here. Our ground freezes up but if its covered with a nice blanket of snow and it stays like that for a while, then the ground tends to be frozen for only a couple inches. I dig most of the winter and find it is usually easy going unless we get exposed surface and frigid temperatures for several days.

As for quarry, I have found that most of the time the quarry reacts to what the dog does. Fox will bolt or fight back if a terrier pushes it. If the dog holds its position and bays, then you dig. Coons in the ground act the same way. If a dog bays it will turn its back sometimes and just tolerate it. If a dog engages then you can imagine its the same as a fox but a coon uses its paws/claws like hands. They grab and hold. Woodchucks are plentiful where I am. You primarily dig them from spring to early fall. They have tight earth. The fox, coon and opossum don't dig their own hole but use the chuck's hole. Chucks will dig fast and collapse tunnels. They are a challenge in the ground for any terrier that fits well enough to get up to them quickly on their own, that is, the adult chucks. Opossum are pretty much a lightweight compared to the rest. He does play dead and gives a scent off while doing so. Some dogs will walk off. I had my bitch in a couple weekends back, who is a bayer. There was fox sign all around the field nearby. The hole smelled foxy and in she went. First baying, then tugging sounds. More baying. So we dug. It took us 30 min to get 8 inches of hard frozen ground up before we reached digging dirt. She was located 7 feet down on a hillside earth. Half way down we hear tugging. She will mix but mostly bays. We got about 6 feet down and she comes out. I'm sure it was a possum playing dead. She never rags dead game and has walked off several possum that played dead, though she has never walked off quarry in the 3 years she's been dug to. Barn hunting seem very appealing at those time. No one want to spend 1/2 hour or hour digging a couple inches of completely frozen ground while your hands and shoulders are stinging from the solid ground and its 12*F outside and the wind pierces thru you.

The dog that are under 12" and between 10-15 lbs seem to get the majority of the quarry. The digs are typically 2-6 feet but can be a bit deeper, especially on hillside, ridges and berms. We do not have badger, nutria or armadillos anywhere within a 10 hour drive of me so I can't speak on that. Any dog that is up over 14" and 20lbs is only getting into coyote and bear dens around here for proper earth work and good luck to them.

[Coyotehunter 689]

I am in the north east US and it does get pretty cold around here. Our ground freezes up but if its covered with a nice blanket of snow and it stays like that for a while, then the ground tends to be frozen for only a couple inches. I dig most of the winter and find it is usually easy going unless we get exposed surface and frigid temperatures for several days.

As for quarry, I have found that most of the time the quarry reacts to what the dog does. Fox will bolt or fight back if a terrier pushes it. If the dog holds its position and bays, then you dig. Coons in the ground act the same way. If a dog bays it will turn its back sometimes and just tolerate it. If a dog engages then you can imagine its the same as a fox but a coon uses its paws/claws like hands. They grab and hold. Woodchucks are plentiful where I am. You primarily dig them from spring to early fall. They have tight earth. The fox, coon and opossum don't dig their own hole but use the chuck's hole. Chucks will dig fast and collapse tunnels. They are a challenge in the ground for any terrier that fits well enough to get up to them quickly on their own, that is, the adult chucks. Opossum are pretty much a lightweight compared to the rest. He does play dead and gives a scent off while doing so. Some dogs will walk off. I had my bitch in a couple weekends back, who is a bayer. There was fox sign all around the field nearby. The hole smelled foxy and in she went. First baying, then tugging sounds. More baying. So we dug. It took us 30 min to get 8 inches of hard frozen ground up before we reached digging dirt. She was located 7 feet down on a hillside earth. Half way down we hear tugging. She will mix but mostly bays. We got about 6 feet down and she comes out. I'm sure it was a possum playing dead. She never rags dead game and has walked off several possum that played dead, though she has never walked off quarry in the 3 years she's been dug to. Barn hunting seem very appealing at those time. No one want to spend 1/2 hour or hour digging a couple inches of completely frozen ground while your hands and shoulders are stinging from the solid ground and its 12*F outside and the wind pierces thru you.

The dog that are under 12" and between 10-15 lbs seem to get the majority of the quarry. The digs are typically 2-6 feet but can be a bit deeper, especially on hillside, ridges and berms. We do not have badger, nutria or armadillos anywhere within a 10 hour drive of me so I can't speak on that. Any dog that is up over 14" and 20lbs is only getting into coyote and bear dens around here for proper earth work and good luck to them.

I have to repectfully disagree with you on a couple of points , goundhogs , woodchucks call them what you want are not any kind of a challenge for a terrier , you'd be better off with a ferret !!!! pissing around with an animal thats running away and trying to suffacate your terrier in the bargain, been there done that, got the Tshirt , i'd rather not go out than piss around on groundhogs

"Any dog that is up over 14" and 20lbs is only getting into coyote and bear dens around here for proper earth work and good luck to them."

Maybe where you are , but there's plenty of places around here that a 14' 20lbs + will get into and there certainly not coyote or bear holes, People who piss around with groundhogs have this thing about terriers being 5" tall and 3lb, and a 11" chest span, it drives me crazy, go buy a chihuahua if thats the case , if your dog is that small and it comes across a 30lb coon its gonna get its arse kicked !!! end of story , within reason it doesn't matter how tall the dog is, legs fold up if it has a tight chest and the heart it will get anywhere your 10" terrier will get .

JMHO CH

 

 

 

 

[steadymob 4]

I am in the north east US and it does get pretty cold around here. Our ground freezes up but if its covered with a nice blanket of snow and it stays like that for a while, then the ground tends to be frozen for only a couple inches. I dig most of the winter and find it is usually easy going unless we get exposed surface and frigid temperatures for several days.

As for quarry, I have found that most of the time the quarry reacts to what the dog does. Fox will bolt or fight back if a terrier pushes it. If the dog holds its position and bays, then you dig. Coons in the ground act the same way. If a dog bays it will turn its back sometimes and just tolerate it. If a dog engages then you can imagine its the same as a fox but a coon uses its paws/claws like hands. They grab and hold. Woodchucks are plentiful where I am. You primarily dig them from spring to early fall. They have tight earth. The fox, coon and opossum don't dig their own hole but use the chuck's hole. Chucks will dig fast and collapse tunnels. They are a challenge in the ground for any terrier that fits well enough to get up to them quickly on their own, that is, the adult chucks. Opossum are pretty much a lightweight compared to the rest. He does play dead and gives a scent off while doing so. Some dogs will walk off. I had my bitch in a couple weekends back, who is a bayer. There was fox sign all around the field nearby. The hole smelled foxy and in she went. First baying, then tugging sounds. More baying. So we dug. It took us 30 min to get 8 inches of hard frozen ground up before we reached digging dirt. She was located 7 feet down on a hillside earth. Half way down we hear tugging. She will mix but mostly bays. We got about 6 feet down and she comes out. I'm sure it was a possum playing dead. She never rags dead game and has walked off several possum that played dead, though she has never walked off quarry in the 3 years she's been dug to. Barn hunting seem very appealing at those time. No one want to spend 1/2 hour or hour digging a couple inches of completely frozen ground while your hands and shoulders are stinging from the solid ground and its 12*F outside and the wind pierces thru you.

The dog that are under 12" and between 10-15 lbs seem to get the majority of the quarry. The digs are typically 2-6 feet but can be a bit deeper, especially on hillside, ridges and berms. We do not have badger, nutria or armadillos anywhere within a 10 hour drive of me so I can't speak on that. Any dog that is up over 14" and 20lbs is only getting into coyote and bear dens around here for proper earth work and good luck to them.

I have to repectfully disagree with you on a couple of points , goundhogs , woodchucks call them what you want are not any kind of a challenge for a terrier , you'd be better off with a ferret !!!! pissing around with an animal thats running away and trying to suffacate your terrier in the bargain, been there done that, got the Tshirt , i'd rather not go out than piss around on groundhogs

"Any dog that is up over 14" and 20lbs is only getting into coyote and bear dens around here for proper earth work and good luck to them."

Maybe where you are , but there's plenty of places around here that a 14' 20lbs + will get into and there certainly not coyote or bear holes, People who piss around with groundhogs have this thing about terriers being 5" tall and 3lb, and a 11" chest span, it drives me crazy, go buy a chihuahua if thats the case , if your dog is that small and it comes across a 30lb coon its gonna get its arse kicked !!! end of story , within reason it doesn't matter how tall the dog is, legs fold up if it has a tight chest and the heart it will get anywhere your 10" terrier will get .

JMHO CH

 

 

 

 

 

 

Coyotehunter,

 

I have to respectfully disagree with a few of your retorts. You and I live very close to each other and have very similar climates and game available to us. I also know of a very good terrierman just to the north of you and a couple right around my area. All are diggers and barn workers. All of them may not desire a dog quite as small as I do but they all would agree that a 20 pound dog is very limited on what it can do in the ground. In my opinion it is a rarity that you would find any holes aside from some beaver dens that a 20 pound dog can work.

 

As far as the tiny dog getting its ass kicked by a thirty pound coon.... since I have personal experience with this I will fill you in on the details of actual feild work instead of assumptions. A small mixer takes less damage then a big hard dog in most occasions because the coon only fights as hard as it has to. If a dog bays...the coon lays, If the dog fights then the coon fights. Its as simple as that.

 

Woodchucks on the other hand are a whole different kind of beast. Alot of so called terriermen over here like to down play there significance as a formidable quarry. Funny how I have never heard of anyone that has dogs small enough to work them say this. Its always the people with dogs that are too big and ineffective against them that make this claim. Its a pride thing and people would rather down play the quarry rather then just say "I dont hunt woodchucks because my dogs are too big."

 

Next time the woodchuck convention comes back to your area grab me a "woodchuck t-shirt" please! I would love to have one!

[steadymob 4]

Ive just been reading one of the other threads about stud dogs in the USA ,

i Work m dogs in barns and earths , each have there pros and cons , one of the lads made the claim that it easy to find a coon in a barn, but when you look at it the terrier has quite the job, unless there's a high density of coons, your terrier has to try and smell a scent through dusty mouldy old hay, your earth dog has damp moist easy to scent earth, your earth dog then has to work in a tight confined area, so can the terrier working the the barn but more than likely to have more area to work in, just a couple of pros and cons in the differences

 

Coyotehunter,

 

Again I have to disagree with you. I hope your not offended because it seems like I am attacking you but it just so happens we are ending up on the oppoisite sides of these debates. nothing personal!

 

Barn work is fun and it is a nice tool to pass some time when digging is tough to come by. But it is not true terrierwork. Coons are easy to find in comparison to other game and especially in barns. I barn hunt just as much as I dig so this is just my personal opinion from my time in the field and in barns.

 

IMO what it comes down to is this. Barn work is very attractive to alot of us here because it is very easily accessible and easy on man and beast. The game is abundant and the human in the equation can be absolutly out of shape and still enjoy a day out in the barns. Digging is tough and takes way too much commitment for most to enjoy.

 

Here is the best way to some up barn hunting and put into perspective its true significance here in the states. Barn hunting is a quick way to snap some pictures of your dogs above ground on game and gain credibility among all these keyboard hunters without any real personal dedication and sweat on your brow! In other words , Instant fame and Keyboard cred! lol fire away!

[BAD BOB 27]

I am in the north east US and it does get pretty cold around here. Our ground freezes up but if its covered with a nice blanket of snow and it stays like that for a while, then the ground tends to be frozen for only a couple inches. I dig most of the winter and find it is usually easy going unless we get exposed surface and frigid temperatures for several days.

As for quarry, I have found that most of the time the quarry reacts to what the dog does. Fox will bolt or fight back if a terrier pushes it. If the dog holds its position and bays, then you dig. Coons in the ground act the same way. If a dog bays it will turn its back sometimes and just tolerate it. If a dog engages then you can imagine its the same as a fox but a coon uses its paws/claws like hands. They grab and hold. Woodchucks are plentiful where I am. You primarily dig them from spring to early fall. They have tight earth. The fox, coon and opossum don't dig their own hole but use the chuck's hole. Chucks will dig fast and collapse tunnels. They are a challenge in the ground for any terrier that fits well enough to get up to them quickly on their own, that is, the adult chucks. Opossum are pretty much a lightweight compared to the rest. He does play dead and gives a scent off while doing so. Some dogs will walk off. I had my bitch in a couple weekends back, who is a bayer. There was fox sign all around the field nearby. The hole smelled foxy and in she went. First baying, then tugging sounds. More baying. So we dug. It took us 30 min to get 8 inches of hard frozen ground up before we reached digging dirt. She was located 7 feet down on a hillside earth. Half way down we hear tugging. She will mix but mostly bays. We got about 6 feet down and she comes out. I'm sure it was a possum playing dead. She never rags dead game and has walked off several possum that played dead, though she has never walked off quarry in the 3 years she's been dug to. Barn hunting seem very appealing at those time. No one want to spend 1/2 hour or hour digging a couple inches of completely frozen ground while your hands and shoulders are stinging from the solid ground and its 12*F outside and the wind pierces thru you.

The dog that are under 12" and between 10-15 lbs seem to get the majority of the quarry. The digs are typically 2-6 feet but can be a bit deeper, especially on hillside, ridges and berms. We do not have badger, nutria or armadillos anywhere within a 10 hour drive of me so I can't speak on that. Any dog that is up over 14" and 20lbs is only getting into coyote and bear dens around here for proper earth work and good luck to them.

I have to repectfully disagree with you on a couple of points , goundhogs , woodchucks call them what you want are not any kind of a challenge for a terrier , you'd be better off with a ferret !!!! pissing around with an animal thats running away and trying to suffacate your terrier in the bargain, been there done that, got the Tshirt , i'd rather not go out than piss around on groundhogs

"Any dog that is up over 14" and 20lbs is only getting into coyote and bear dens around here for proper earth work and good luck to them."

Maybe where you are , but there's plenty of places around here that a 14' 20lbs + will get into and there certainly not coyote or bear holes, People who piss around with groundhogs have this thing about terriers being 5" tall and 3lb, and a 11" chest span, it drives me crazy, go buy a chihuahua if thats the case , if your dog is that small and it comes across a 30lb coon its gonna get its arse kicked !!! end of story , within reason it doesn't matter how tall the dog is, legs fold up if it has a tight chest and the heart it will get anywhere your 10" terrier will get .

JMHO CH

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As far as the tiny dog getting its ass kicked by a thirty pound coon.... since I have personal experience with this I will fill you in on the details of actual feild work instead of assumptions. A small mixer takes less damage then a big hard dog in most occasions because the coon only fights as hard as it has to. If a dog bays...the coon lays, If the dog fights then the coon fights. Its as simple as that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

i agree 100%. i cant speak for others but i really don't want a straight bayer, then you have to get a 60lb lurch to do the business...

[marky r 25]

theres times when you have a game terrier and you still need a lurcher to finish the job. and come on then get some pics up.

[BredtoHunt 8]

In the Areas around me north eastern USA and Southern part of Canada it is very simple. If your mad about digging terriers you will be digging groundhogs. They are the pretty much the most abundant summer quarry. South of here you will find some coons in the ground in summer to get away from the heat but not very many. Those are usually so small they are a breeze.

 

Digging groundhogs with fairly consistent success takes good effort on both the terrier and the mans behalf. Small dogs can get up to them easier but a medium sized terrier with heart can work em. Most of the repairs we do are caused by groundhogs. Raccoon is probably the easiest thing we dig. A 10 lb terrier has no problem whatsoever holding a 30 lb raccoon in place while you dig.

[McKay69 6]

I am in the north east US and it does get pretty cold around here. Our ground freezes up but if its covered with a nice blanket of snow and it stays like that for a while, then the ground tends to be frozen for only a couple inches. I dig most of the winter and find it is usually easy going unless we get exposed surface and frigid temperatures for several days.

As for quarry, I have found that most of the time the quarry reacts to what the dog does. Fox will bolt or fight back if a terrier pushes it. If the dog holds its position and bays, then you dig. Coons in the ground act the same way. If a dog bays it will turn its back sometimes and just tolerate it. If a dog engages then you can imagine its the same as a fox but a coon uses its paws/claws like hands. They grab and hold. Woodchucks are plentiful where I am. You primarily dig them from spring to early fall. They have tight earth. The fox, coon and opossum don't dig their own hole but use the chuck's hole. Chucks will dig fast and collapse tunnels. They are a challenge in the ground for any terrier that fits well enough to get up to them quickly on their own, that is, the adult chucks. Opossum are pretty much a lightweight compared to the rest. He does play dead and gives a scent off while doing so. Some dogs will walk off. I had my bitch in a couple weekends back, who is a bayer. There was fox sign all around the field nearby. The hole smelled foxy and in she went. First baying, then tugging sounds. More baying. So we dug. It took us 30 min to get 8 inches of hard frozen ground up before we reached digging dirt. She was located 7 feet down on a hillside earth. Half way down we hear tugging. She will mix but mostly bays. We got about 6 feet down and she comes out. I'm sure it was a possum playing dead. She never rags dead game and has walked off several possum that played dead, though she has never walked off quarry in the 3 years she's been dug to. Barn hunting seem very appealing at those time. No one want to spend 1/2 hour or hour digging a couple inches of completely frozen ground while your hands and shoulders are stinging from the solid ground and its 12*F outside and the wind pierces thru you.

The dog that are under 12" and between 10-15 lbs seem to get the majority of the quarry. The digs are typically 2-6 feet but can be a bit deeper, especially on hillside, ridges and berms. We do not have badger, nutria or armadillos anywhere within a 10 hour drive of me so I can't speak on that. Any dog that is up over 14" and 20lbs is only getting into coyote and bear dens around here for proper earth work and good luck to them.

I have to repectfully disagree with you on a couple of points , goundhogs , woodchucks call them what you want are not any kind of a challenge for a terrier , you'd be better off with a ferret !!!! pissing around with an animal thats running away and trying to suffacate your terrier in the bargain, been there done that, got the Tshirt , i'd rather not go out than piss around on groundhogs

"Any dog that is up over 14" and 20lbs is only getting into coyote and bear dens around here for proper earth work and good luck to them."

Maybe where you are , but there's plenty of places around here that a 14' 20lbs + will get into and there certainly not coyote or bear holes, People who piss around with groundhogs have this thing about terriers being 5" tall and 3lb, and a 11" chest span, it drives me crazy, go buy a chihuahua if thats the case , if your dog is that small and it comes across a 30lb coon its gonna get its arse kicked !!! end of story , within reason it doesn't matter how tall the dog is, legs fold up if it has a tight chest and the heart it will get anywhere your 10" terrier will get .

JMHO CH

 

 

 

 

It seems you do not like to work groundhogs. I can appreciate the fact that it's frustrating. That is understandable if the dog is too large to get (Fit) up close without having to dig a few hole to let the dog turn. If the earth near you are easily accessed by a large (20lbs Dog) that is great. Here, it is not going to happen unless it is a breeding earth with kits that are grown. I've been to the U.K. and seen the settes and can understand what may fit. I did see some small earths as well. The dog that fits in these big earths is not going to fit in the dens were I am from. I wish it was different. It would be a lot easier to get the right dog for the job. Woodchucks digging probably make up the majority of quarry that is being taken below ground in the US. You can dig them March thru November if you want and you don't have to worry about frozen ground or access issues due to snow. Most people want them gone; farmers, orchards, gardeners, homeowners, golf courses, etc. Some fields are full of individual earths that can have 1-10 openings. They are kind of like some of the badger settes I've seen but on a smaller scale. Then multiply that by 15 or 30 for one good field, and there is usually only one animal per earth. The dog must fine quick, get in close and keep the thing from digging. End of story. If the dog can't get there quickly, well then it's going to be walled off. I will say that some places I hunt have clay soil and in the summer the chucks have a hard time digging on so if the dog has drive he will get there eventually. The places I work the most have very easy digging soil and the chucks can move earth very fast. I find that coon usually just sit there and fox will bolt as soon as they can. They don't run and hide or wall off anything. There isn't the hunts here. We have a few guys that run hounds around but they aren't digging or even working with terriermen. This means the foxes rarely ever encounter terriers because people are not digging that much especially in December, January or Feruary when they are to ground and the weather is a bitch.

I agree that leg size is negotiable and that a hard tiny dog will get their attitude handed to them by any big coon or mean old fox. As I said, the quarry react to how the dog works. I also think that barn hunting has a sense of tunnel work in it but it is not digging. I have to say that there is probably very few chihuahuas that have worked to ground but I know of plenty of farm dogs that have worked coon in the hey barns.

I believe Fionn asked about EARTHWORK. This is the work that I do in the earth. If you are a digger then you know it isn't easy especially in the winter or the summer when its very hot. Most people are not going to go for a walk with the dogs and decide to dig a 6ft hole when they just paid $1000 for Fido. People are lazy, plain and simple.

There is not a lot of terriermen or women around. It is not something that most people even realize people do. I worked a fox den on a horse farm this weekend and the owner asked how we did. He knew I hunted with terriers (Most people hunt fox with calls) and asked if we got any. I told him we had one in the net but it got away because I didn't set it right. It snagged on a couple sticks I should of moved. He asked what made the fox come out of the hole. I told him the terrier. He couldn't wrap his head around it. I had to explain that the dog goes in the hole and moves the fox or keeps it in it's place. People just don't know about terrier work around here. There is not that many of us doing it. It doesn't help that many of these US terrier guys are constantly talking shit about each other and calling each other names. We are not representing ourselves too well with all that crap.