shooting dogs

[comanche 2,999]

It all comes under property legislation now. If a farmer's property, eg sheep, is being dameged by a dog, he or his appointed representative can take reasonable steps to prevent further damage. If that entails shooting a dog, the dog must be shot with a gun of suitable calibre - .243 is recommended. The owner of the dog may then take civil, not criminal, action action to recover the cost of the dog, but the farmer may counter-claim for the cost of sheep which have died or lost lambs as a result of the attack. Wild-life remains a grey area. A wild animal is the property of the person on whose land it lives. If a farmer has an area where he allows pheasant to breed, in order to sell shooting rights in season, then a dog running amok in that area could be deemed to be damaging his property and shot. AFAIK, there is no test case on this.

 

It comes back to common sense. If the dog is causing real harm, it may be shot. If it's a yaphound playing silly bugglers, grab the little wretch by the scruff of the neck, give the dog back to him and tell him to feck off.

 

All good stuff RicW cept that nobody owns game . Once released it is nobody's property . However only the person on who's land it is living has the "right to take it". Hence anyone letting their dog chase game is interfering with someone's legal right to the game on their land and that can be the route to civil proceedings .

Think there have been a few cases where angling clubs have taken folk to court for interfering with their right to fish even though the fish were essentially wild and therefore not actually property .

Edited February 7, 2011 by comanche

[HUnter_zero 58]

wasn,t sure which section to ask this question but when doe,s a farmer/landowner have the right to shoot a dog ?

 

Roxy, bottom line is that a farmer doesn't really have the right to shoot a dog, even if the dog is worrying sheep. In the first instance, the owner of the dog that is worrying the livestock is committing an offence. If a farmer (or anyone for that matter) shoots a dog, then he/she is committing criminal damage as the dog is "property", when the farmer ends up in court he/she could use 'protection of livestock' as a defence for shooting the dog BUT would need to show that it was the last resort and that they had done everything else that was practical before shooting the dog. A court is a two way street and the law will not reward the good or the good of will! If the farmer wins the case, then he/she could then claim by default any costs incurred and damages from the dog owner. If they lose, they may not have to pay anything, as it could be in retrospect, however everyone's dog suddenly becomes a show winner in court! If the farmer used a Firearm, then he may also be in breach of the firearms act. In any case, anyone shooting a dog, must tell the police with in a reasonable time (usually 48 hours).

 

Thats my understanding anyway.

 

 

John

[Rake aboot 4,935]

My Fac states, shooting of any animal causing a danger to humans or other animals..

 

 

So am I the only one with this on there cert, pretty clear cut wording!,, not in a hurry to put it to the test though

 

ATB

[SNAP SHOT 194]

As HZ has said all other routes must be exhausted before the decission is made to shoot the animal.

 

Witnesses are always good, should it be the farmer or a hunting partner, but where there is no doubt of animal loss then

you have little to worry about if you have the permission to make such a judgement...

 

Snap.

[KittleRox 2,147]

Thanks for the replies folks,the two guys in question were saying the dog could be shot if it was off the lead or if it was running through crops kicking up turf I knew they were talking bollocks,just needed confirmation,thanks again

[CUPCAKE118 0]

SNAP your right about the dog Laws! the laws on dogs are strict by rights if a dog is off the lead on your property it is an offence and would carry a fine as it would be not to have a dog on the lead in the street so as for a dog off the lead that is attacking stock then its game over dog! In the eyes of good prictice a warning shot or verbal warning to the owner would be needed i would of thought otherwise i think a court would pull you apart with how firearms licensing is!

 

A friend has just told me that someone near him was sent down for 3months for not having his dog on the lead after being cautioned previously how ever there might be more to it! but with dog attacks as they are it is understandable!

Edited February 7, 2011 by CUPCAKE118

[stinkymalinky 0]

I have the same wording on mine. My Fac states, shooting of any animal causing a danger to humans or other animals..

Edited February 7, 2011 by stinkymalinky

[RicW 67]

We're all pretty well in agreement here. I have to disagree with HZ though. (Sorry John!)It is no longer a criminal offence to shoot a dog that is worrying livestock, provided that you use a gun of suitable calibre; if the gun is too low powered you could be in breach of laws about cruelty. It could be deemed a civil offence and lead to a claim for damages to property. As I said, the farmer would have a good counter-claim for damages to his stock.

 

The West Midlands Police site is worth a look on this. You'll have to trawl around to find it, but it covers the subject in detail.

 

I for one hope I never find myself having to decide what to do in a case like this . . .

 

Ric

[coldweld 65]

Some cans are better unopened !

[fitchet 788]

ive got to admit that even though my dogs are well broken to farms stock they do sometimes hunt up the odd pheasant they are never allowed to run amok but if anyone even pointed a gun at my dogs they would regret it thats not me givin it the biggun its fact.

[dave1372 83]

Some cans are better unopened !

 

 

.... I agree forget right or wrong its just social suicide:

 

Shoot a dog to save a couple of hundred quids worth of liverstock - all that will happen is you get you car vandalised every couple of months, tyres slashed, house windows broken and for the next couple years your missus will nag you to death! All because the press get hold of the story and all of a sudden every dog guy/anti with a 10 mile radius wants to exact some kind of revenge.

 

......shit to think that, but true!

[jimmy.jim86 1]

As a farmer myself if a dog was attacking worrying sheep, an then the ewes slipped there lambs I would certainly take some action, I had 20 Ewes slip lambs a couple of years ago because of a Rotty cross attacking and running the ewes into a stream. I also on another occasion picked 5 ewes dead out of a stream they where driven into. Anybody who moaned that there dog was shot for ruining and killing either unborn or thriving livestock should standback and let me worry there dog and let it slip its pups. Apart from the loss of revenue from the sheep, which after all sheep for a farmer is business. Then they might realise what they are doing. Anyone letting a dog off a lead whether where it can or shouldnt should have it under control at all times. Another legal point, its an offence for any dog to be of the lead on a public footpath.

 

 

James

[Bryony 4]

As a farmer myself if a dog was attacking worrying sheep, an then the ewes slipped there lambs I would certainly take some action, I had 20 Ewes slip lambs a couple of years ago because of a Rotty cross attacking and running the ewes into a stream. I also on another occasion picked 5 ewes dead out of a stream they where driven into. Anybody who moaned that there dog was shot for ruining and killing either unborn or thriving livestock should standback and let me worry there dog and let it slip its pups. Apart from the loss of revenue from the sheep, which after all sheep for a farmer is business. Then they might realise what they are doing. Anyone letting a dog off a lead whether where it can or shouldnt should have it under control at all times. Another legal point, its an offence for any dog to be of the lead on a public footpath.

 

 

James

I've lived and worked on estates

most of my life and it is tru so many people just don't think or care about controlling their dogs . They just see a field to let it run and hunt in and dont really understand the country code or the unseen damage and disturbance that a dog even e few yards off a track can do . I once met two people who let there dogs off to chase deer for exercise. They said "its ok because the dogs are too slow to catch one" and these people did'nt agree with hunting and were always moaning to the estate about the shoot . They seemed to think it was ok to disturb the deer and other animals for no real reason though .

I do agree with James about the worrying of livestock too .Because people don't see the game running away on the other side of a hedge or the sheep aborting a while after the dogs have chased them about they find it hard to accept that hey are wrong.

Just one thing though James that you said a bit wrong. It is not against the law for a dog to be off a lead on a footpath but it must be under close control. In other words if not on a lead preferably walking at heel or no more than a yard or so away and respond to commands .

Bryony

[pegleg33 134]

As a farmer myself if a dog was attacking worrying sheep, an then the ewes slipped there lambs I would certainly take some action, I had 20 Ewes slip lambs a couple of years ago because of a Rotty cross attacking and running the ewes into a stream. I also on another occasion picked 5 ewes dead out of a stream they where driven into. Anybody who moaned that there dog was shot for ruining and killing either unborn or thriving livestock should standback and let me worry there dog and let it slip its pups. Apart from the loss of revenue from the sheep, which after all sheep for a farmer is business. Then they might realise what they are doing. Anyone letting a dog off a lead whether where it can or shouldnt should have it under control at all times. Another legal point, its an offence for any dog to be of the lead on a public footpath.

 

 

James

 

 

my understanding was your dogs had to be under close control.however i'm not 100% on this

[danw 1,748]

from the NE website

 

 

Keep dogs under close control

The countryside is a great place to exercise dogs, but it’s every owner’s duty to make sure their dog is not a danger or nuisance to farm animals, wildlife or other people.

 

By law, you must control your dog so that it does not disturb or scare farm animals or wildlife. On most areas of open country and common land, known as 'access land' you must keep your dog on a short lead on most areas of open country and common land between 1 March and 31 July, and all year round near farm animals.

 

You do not have to put your dog on a lead on public paths, as long as it is under close control. But as a general rule, keep your dog on a lead if you cannot rely on its obedience. By law, farmers are entitled to destroy a dog that injures or worries their animals.

 

If a farm animal chases you and your dog, it is safer to let your dog off the lead – don’t risk getting hurt by trying to protect it.

 

Take particular care that your dog doesn’t scare sheep and lambs or wander where it might disturb birds that nest on the ground and other wildlife – eggs and young will soon die without protection from their parents.

 

Everyone knows how unpleasant dog mess is and it can cause infections – so always clean up after your dog and get rid of the mess responsibly. Also make sure your dog is wormed regularly to protect it, other animals and people.

 

At certain times, dogs may not be allowed on some areas of access land or may need to be kept on a lead. Please follow any signs. You can also find out more by phoning the Open Access Contact Centre on 0845 100