Our own worst enemy...

[dadioles 68]

I have only had my firearms certificate for a couple of years and I am proud to have it and feel that it is a priviledge which sets me apart from many other people.

 

When I read some of the posts in this and other shooting forums I really find myself wondering how long we are going to be able to keep shooting before the wishy washy anti brigade finally manage to tie us up in so much legislation that it is just not practical to carry on.

 

Too many posts, tongue in cheek or whatever, portray shooters as blood thirsty and irresponsible and quite frankly I question whether some of them should have firearms.

 

When I go out to shoot animals I do it humanely to the best of my ability. Sometimes, inevitably, I will only wound and not kill, but I feel really bad about that. Some of you seem to have lost that bit of humanity and don't appear to care.

 

Boasting about long range shots on rabbits with .22 and HMR is really quite pathetic, the risk of wounding is too great.

 

The Hunting Life forums are among the best and most responsible but please always remember that not everyone who reads these pages is on our side or even has the foggiest idea about country life and the need to control rabbits, foxes, deer or whatever.

 

The biggest damage is done to us on YouTube, and probably by Americans who come across as inbred and insane. Reading the follow up text on YouTube is quite an education, and scary. There really are some pretty strange people around.

 

Anyway..... we are all under the spotlight and need to be seen to be responsible, law abiding and "nice" so please take care how you post and not least of all try and make published photo's look acceptable and not too shocking. Even legitimate pictures of a shot swan can work against us, unfair yes, but what percentage of the population agree with us having guns?

 

Best wishes to all

 

Les

[Nik_B 3,790]

Antis are allways going to hate what we do regardless of how people act.

 

There's a fly fishing forum I go on and one topic was critising a magazine for displaying two large brown trout that had been killed saying that this was a bad image for the sport. In the end we can bend over backwards to try to please the anti but they will never go away.

 

Killing animals cannot be called anything other than cruel...by the very nature of the word is isn't a nice act...but it must be done for conservation and other reasons....and in the end we enjoy doing it.

 

The only thing that talks is money and votes. Shooting generates billions in the UK so it wont get banned but if we let them, the policy makers could chip away making life harder and harder, so let your MP how you feel and refuse to vote for anti MPS no matter what.

 

The few thousand sweaty crusties are way over represented in their oposition to hunting because they are more vocal and we are not.

 

You will do more damage by pandering to them and they wont thank you for not posting a picture of a dead swan anyway.

 

ATB

[scothunter 12,609]

Im guessing the swan pic,made you think about this thread.agree in principle.however the swan was shot in germany and its not an all british exclusive site.antis will get ammo no matter what mate.there nutters plain and simple

[Lab 10,979]

Im guessing the swan pic,made you think about this thread.agree in principle.however the swan was shot in germany and its not an all british exclusive site.antis will get ammo no matter what mate.there nutters plain and simple

Agree totally here.........antis will never like what we would do whether it be classed as sport or vermin control so i have a 100% f**k you attitude towards them.... Humanely killing your quarry is a completley different issue entirely and should be something that is first and foremost in every hunters mind...

[scothunter 12,609]

If all hunting was banned tomorrow,they would move on to fishing,and keepers of tropical fish or some other crackpot idea to sustain thier empty heads and lifes.

[SNAP SHOT 194]

Hi just to add that those who maybe boast about a long range shot have tried to prefect their shooting over many years, So the risk of the wound is the same

as that of the weekend shooter out to bag a meal, the risk of wounding will ALWAYS be there NO MATTER what the range is,

 

its down to the person behind the lethal bit to make that decision, And know whats achieveible in their own shooting ...

 

ATVB.

 

Snap.

[RicW 67]

Good post Les. I don't agree with all you say, but it needs saying. When we get some cretin yapping about shooting rabbits at 250 yards with a .22lr we can all just treat him with the contempt he deserves. The antis, some of whom do know about guns, can twist his words into a general claim by all shooters.

 

I do not agree with Nik that shooting, or any other hunting method, must needs be cruel. Unless you're a real weird cnut, you surely try to kill with as little cruelty as possible? Clean head-shot or boiler-room fragmenting round is the ideal we all go for, do we not? Game bird shooters train their dogs to retrieve pricked birds so they can be killed ASAP, and not just because of their financial value. The dog lads expect their bull x greys to kill quick and clean or lose the quarry entirely. There is a lot less cruelty in field hunting than there is in your average abattoir.

 

Not been out much lately. A pal has asked me to join him Friday. Pasha with his 12b sbs, me with a 10/22. No cruelty, just a bit of pest control and fill the pot.

 

[scothunter 12,609]

Good post Les. I don't agree with all you say, but it needs saying. When we get some cretin yapping about shooting rabbits at 250 yards with a .22lr we can all just treat him with the contempt he deserves. The antis, some of whom do know about guns, can twist his words into a general claim by all shooters.

 

I do not agree with Nik that shooting, or any other hunting method, must needs be cruel. Unless you're a real weird cnut, you surely try to kill with as little cruelty as possible? Clean head-shot or boiler-room fragmenting round is the ideal we all go for, do we not? Game bird shooters train their dogs to retrieve pricked birds so they can be killed ASAP, and not just because of their financial value. The dog lads expect their bull x greys to kill quick and clean or lose the quarry entirely. There is a lot less cruelty in field hunting than there is in your average abattoir.

 

Not been out much lately. A pal has asked me to join him Friday. Pasha with his 12b sbs, me with a 10/22. No cruelty, just a bit of pest control and fill the pot.

 

 

worked in a abbotoir for a few years as a killer,and got to say mate never seen any cruelty whatsever mate.

[RicW 67]

Fair dos. Most are OK but the bad ones can be very bad.

[scothunter 12,609]

Fair dos. Most are OK but the bad ones can be very bad.

 

Got to add you prob right,the one i worked in was a pretty a big affair,and thier were a few inspectors and and a vet reg called in.im sure you are right tho in the smaller ones mate.

[dadioles 68]

Thanks for all the replies, maybe I was just having a bad day, but then again....

 

You are right (Nik_ that whatever we do the Antis will work against us but most of the population are like sheep and they just follow a trend without thinking so let's at least not fall into their stereotyped view of us as bloodthirsty killers.

Your comment "Killing animals cannot be called anything other than cruel..." is kind of true but perhaps a bit harsh, when I shoot a wild free ranging rabbit in the head it is instant lights out and dinner for my family, that is not cruel unless you think it would be missed socially by its fellow rabbits who may be a bit upset at the demise of Flopsy. You also go on to say "we enjoy it" and that can be a bit more contentious. Yes, I do enjoy being out with a gun in the countryside and the "hunt" and feel pleased with myself when I dispatch a pest cleanly and painlessly but at the same time I do have a slight sadness at taking a life, necessary though it is. I cannot say that I enjoy killing and I think that is an important point to get across.

 

You are right (Scothunter) that it was the picture of the swan that triggered my post but I have no issues with that picture, personally. If there are so many swans in Germany (or here in UK) that they are becoming a nuisance then the numbers need to be controlled and shooting is ok. If it was just for the ego of the shooter then that is rather a sad reflection on his personality. He could have pointed his gun, satisfied himself that the shot was possible, pretended to shoot it and then watched that majestic bird fly away. But as long as he eats the meat, no problem. I too rather wonder what swan tastes like (smile).

 

(Snap Shot) is right about the skill of the shooter and the possibility of wounding but my point was that certain bullets suit certain ranges.

For example, a good shooter on a good day can be reliably accurate with a .17 HMR out to about 200 yards. The bullet drop at that distance is getting on for 10 inches but cleanly killing a rabbit is a probability. Anything much further than that and the ballistics dictate that, no matter how good the shooter, the probability of wounding becomes too great. 100-150 yards max would be better, but we all like a challenge. If you want to shoot really long distances with that small calibre, shoot paper. Don't use living things as target practice.

100 yards with a 22LR can be quite challenging. Again, based on rabbits, if you cannot group your shots, every time, within the area covered by, say, a 50p coin, at the distance you are shooting then don't shoot at rabbits at that distance. Move nearer, keep practicing on targets until you can.

 

Oh, and without a laser rangefinder, that two hundred yard shot may have only been 120!! We all know how hard it is to judge distance, almost impossible at night. Pace out 100 yards and it is probably only 75.

 

I find releasing large numbers of pheasants for mass slaughter "we bagged over 400" pretty unpalatable as well.

 

Not sure what you are on about abbatoirs for (Scothunter) but I have missed the point. As an aside, in my village is a brilliant butcher and one of very few left that have their own abbatoir "out the back". Bullocks, lambs and pigs in one door, cracking good meat a suitable time later. Some of the best beef - hung for getting on for a month. Before slaughter the animals are bedded down on straw and calmed down an treated really kindly, no stress, better meat that way. Not really possible in a big slaughterhouse.

Many years ago I worked as a summer job for a chicken factory in Essex. Live birds in one end and frozen out the other. Not a pleasant job but respect for those who do it. There were a couple of nutters, however, and if during tea break a live chicken was unlucky enough to break loose it would be used as a football, familiarity breeds contempt, no respect for life. Now there are cameras in slaughterhouses and vets all over the place, regulated to the nth degree and one reason meat is so expensive.

 

Maybe I should have a cup of coffee and go and lie down for a bit.....

 

smile...

 

Les

[Dan_Smiff 2]

Re the comment about Pheasants; Just think of them as the most free range meat bird on the planet. They are fed, protected from natural prey, given a good enviroment to live in (roaming hundreds of acres) and at the end of the day a lot of them live to see another year. You can't say that about even the most free range, organic, freedon food chicken.

 

Most people that are against shooting will still happily eat cheap meat from the supermarket every day without thinking of where it came from, thus making them stinking hypocrites!

Edited January 20, 2011 by Dan_Smiff

[dadioles 68]

Yes Dan, you make a fair point.

 

The same people who turn down my offer of a free rabbit, skinned gutted and prepared for cooking, will happily buy "two for 5 pounds" chickens in the supermarket that have red marks from urine burns or bent bones from inbreeding or cramped conditions, or foreign pork reared in much worse conditions than UK pigs.

 

Les

[scothunter 12,609]

good post dadioles.i was replying to ricw posting about slaughterhouses mate.

[Nik_B 3,790]

I told my missus to stop buying meat from the supermarket for that reason mate. The quality of the meat is not good, probably due to the way they were reared. I'd rather less but better quality. I noticed even the Best Tescos Bacon is full of water and virtually impossible to get nice and crispy.

 

What I meant before about enjoyment was not that I enjoy the killing but I enjoy the sport. I actually always feel a bit bad when I kill anything but as long as there is a good reason (i.e. food on the table) then I'm happy to do it but I don't get any pleasure from the act of killing as such.

 

I just dont worry about the antis, I hardly ever meet any so I'm not so sure there are that many of the hardcore ones. There are plenty of people that eat meat but say "awwww" when you talk about shooting an animal (and it is usually rabbits) but they're a different matter and at least you can talk to them and explain why you do it.