AlbertJ 569 Posted June 19, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 19, 2010 what happened to the original plan of the winner of the "entered terrier" class qualify,s for the five nation championship. Good to hear from you Tully - last time we heard from you you wanted the 'champion' from your show to qualify -now something else! What would appear consistent about you is your desire to criticise. If you look back through the mass of correspondence I have had it was always the Champion from the All Ireland at Shanes and the Champion from Birr who were the Irish qualifiers. The other qualifying shows chose their qualifier differently. It will make for an interesting qualifier. To be frank as someone who has shown working dogs at KC shows I really don't know what the fuss is about 'working' and 'show' terriers. In gundogs there is often a 'working' class BUT unlike 'working' terriers one has had to actually win an award in a trial under actual competitive working conditions. If I happened to win this class I was always delighted to go on and compete against the best 'show' only dogs. But I was realistic enough to realise that I was at a disadvantage as it was a show and shows can only be judged on conformation not on POTENTIAL working ability. Seamus and I are working on something to test working terrier working ability analagous to gundog working tests - it will be interesting to see the critics put their money where their mouth is. One thing I know about KC shows is that usually one one person goes home really happy and thinks the judge is the best! All the judge can do at a show is to choose the dog with the best conformation in their opinion. Hope you get to Shanes Tulleyed and if so come and make yourself known to me. AlbertJ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AlbertJ 569 Posted June 19, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 19, 2010 john hunpherys working lurchers judge my ass Twiggy, Simple question what have you done in lurcher showing or racing that is comparable to what John has done? It would really sappear from comments on this forum that a 'prophet has no honour in his own country' and especially if he is successful in his or her chosen sport. We happen to think that Irish lads who have done well and been game enough to 'put their money where their mouth is' and have gone to compete and beat the best in the Uk are entitled to some respect and offered the chance to judge in their own country. Fair enough everyone has the opportunity to decide whether they want to show under them or not but lets not constantly criticise our own! AlbertJ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AlbertJ 569 Posted June 19, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 19, 2010 china and colt they are some lurchers ha ha Twiggy, I don't know John terribly well except for seeing him at the Fairs and watching his dogs run. I also know he has travelled to compete with the best in the UK with Storm, Colt and China. What impressed me most about him was that he takes his wins graciously and his defeats well - I remember him taking Seamus Erwin's immortal line really well when Seamus coined the phrase ' Colt shot down in flames' and we published it! All the top shows in the Uk accept that these dogs are lurchers - but I suspect that many who finish behind them wish they weren't! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tullyeyed 90 Posted June 19, 2010 Report Share Posted June 19, 2010 what happened to the original plan of the winner of the "entered terrier" class qualify,s for the five nation championship. Good to hear from you Tully - last time we heard from you you wanted the 'champion' from your show to qualify -now something else! What would appear consistent about you is your desire to criticise. If you look back through the mass of correspondence I have had it was always the Champion from the All Ireland at Shanes and the Champion from Birr who were the Irish qualifiers. The other qualifying shows chose their qualifier differently. It will make for an interesting qualifier. To be frank as someone who has shown working dogs at KC shows I really don't know what the fuss is about 'working' and 'show' terriers. In gundogs there is often a 'working' class BUT unlike 'working' terriers one has had to actually win an award in a trial under actual competitive working conditions. If I happened to win this class I was always delighted to go on and compete against the best 'show' only dogs. But I was realistic enough to realise that I was at a disadvantage as it was a show and shows can only be judged on conformation not on POTENTIAL working ability. Seamus and I are working on something to test working terrier working ability analagous to gundog working tests - it will be interesting to see the critics put their money where their mouth is. One thing I know about KC shows is that usually one one person goes home really happy and thinks the judge is the best! All the judge can do at a show is to choose the dog with the best conformation in their opinion. Hope you get to Shanes Tulleyed and if so come and make yourself known to me. AlbertJ i realy hope to get to the shanes castle show Aj, looking forward to meeting you. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AlbertJ 569 Posted June 20, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2010 what happened to the original plan of the winner of the "entered terrier" class qualify,s for the five nation championship. Good to hear from you Tully - last time we heard from you you wanted the 'champion' from your show to qualify -now something else! What would appear consistent about you is your desire to criticise. If you look back through the mass of correspondence I have had it was always the Champion from the All Ireland at Shanes and the Champion from Birr who were the Irish qualifiers. The other qualifying shows chose their qualifier differently. It will make for an interesting qualifier. To be frank as someone who has shown working dogs at KC shows I really don't know what the fuss is about 'working' and 'show' terriers. In gundogs there is often a 'working' class BUT unlike 'working' terriers one has had to actually win an award in a trial under actual competitive working conditions. If I happened to win this class I was always delighted to go on and compete against the best 'show' only dogs. But I was realistic enough to realise that I was at a disadvantage as it was a show and shows can only be judged on conformation not on POTENTIAL working ability. Seamus and I are working on something to test working terrier working ability analagous to gundog working tests - it will be interesting to see the critics put their money where their mouth is. One thing I know about KC shows is that usually one one person goes home really happy and thinks the judge is the best! All the judge can do at a show is to choose the dog with the best conformation in their opinion. Hope you get to Shanes Tulleyed and if so come and make yourself known to me. AlbertJ i realy hope to get to the shanes castle show Aj, looking forward to meeting you. Tully, Hope you do get to it. I thought our show last year was hard to beat I in the context of Ireland)but I think granted decent weather it should be better this year. We have more stands, more attractions ( including Foxgun Tom!) and with a large number of people coming on from Ballywalter we should have good crowds. We have had our spats on this forum but I prefer people who speak their mind ( and to one's face rather than behind one's back) as I try to do. Since I canme on this forum to defend friends of mine from what I thought was unfair criticism it has led to us thinking more about the terriers and lurchers. I suppose in spite of Matt & Seamus's constant pressure I had always given preferential treatment to my own interests- gundogs and shooting. But this year we have improved the prize structure and launched an innovative competition which I hope will bring terrier & lurcher showing in Ireland forward greatly. In addition we are working on a competition for working terriers that will test ability - rather like a working test for gundogs. I look forward to meeting you if you make it to Shanes - I don't hold grudges and I hope neither do you. Albertj Quote Link to post Share on other sites
artful212 394 Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 (edited) albert i think what twiggy means is that in the lurcher ring there are classes for lamping and fox etc and i for 1 know that john doesnt work his lurchers so wudnt know much but as u say it is a show and he has won plenty and he deserves the cred for it Edited June 21, 2010 by artful212 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AlbertJ 569 Posted June 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 albert i think what twiggy means is that in the lurcher ring there are classes for lamping and fox etc and i for 1 know that john doesnt work his lurchers so wudnt know much but as u say it is a show and he has won plenty and he deserves the cred for it I appreciate what you are saying but fast dogs have to have good construction or heart. I am sure John is sensible enough to make a decent job of the 'working classes' within the constraints of judging for confirmation. as I say we hope to produce new competitions next year for real 'working dogs. Albertj Quote Link to post Share on other sites
artful212 394 Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 albert i think what twiggy means is that in the lurcher ring there are classes for lamping and fox etc and i for 1 know that john doesnt work his lurchers so wudnt know much but as u say it is a show and he has won plenty and he deserves the cred for it I appreciate what you are saying but fast dogs have to have good construction or heart. I am sure John is sensible enough to make a decent job of the 'working classes' within the constraints of judging for confirmation. as I say we hope to produce new competitions next year for real 'working dogs. Albertj glad to here it hope it works out Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Doohan 46 Posted June 24, 2010 Report Share Posted June 24, 2010 I along with my good friend Tom Chalmers will be wearing my kilt (a pint to the first individual who recognised the tartan), looking forward to meeting you all Joe Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HGN 150 Posted June 24, 2010 Report Share Posted June 24, 2010 What day / time will these be on? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hogie 103 Posted June 24, 2010 Report Share Posted June 24, 2010 john does a bit of lamping with colt so the working class shouldn't be to bad Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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