DEFRA lead ban?

[Tiddler66 3]

I find the whole thing sad....I have no doubt that we will see proposals for a total ban.......and where will that leave the ordainary guy who shoots maybe 50 shots a year whilst out walking the hedges etc......the chances are most guys have a bit of a stock so it will turn many of us into criminals.....or we have to pay out £1 a shot........Guys who pay £500 a day can afford to spend £75 on a days non-toxic ammo and most clay shooters in the main fire modern guns that could cope with steel shot.....but the poor old rough shooter..........I know its coming...I know we can't stop it, but it makes me sad to feel that the shooting scene my little lad will know is different to hours....

[HUnter_zero 58]

I find the whole thing sad....I have no doubt that we will see proposals for a total ban.......

 

 

To be honest it's a bit of a sore subject for me. A few years back I was offered a great chance of some very fine wildfowling just off the foreshore, being law-abiding I promptly took a trip to Keens and enquired about non-toxic shot, if that makes any real sense. Everything the shot hits, dies so it isn't that non-toxic , £38 I was told, 'oh, my mistake, I only want box of 25 please'. Sorry we only sell them in boxes of ten!

 

£3. per bang. That was the end of my wildfowling days.

 

To my mind, there is so much crap along the foreshore lead is the last of peoples worries. Hardly a day go past that I don't spot some drug takes old needles poking out of a bush in some unsuspecting location, Condoms litter car parks, and all manner of female sanitary products can be found. It boggles the mind why these people scatter such things as if they don't have a home or bin of their own. Bloody sickening is what it is. A walk up with woods after the school holidays will reveal all manner of discarded flotsam.

 

Back on track, to my mind stealth is the name of the game and these little tadpoles in Westminster are like little ninjas waiting to bump us off one by one.

I am sure their motto is a simple " IF WE CAN NOT BAN THEM, BANKRUPT THEM!!", as a group of people we need to fight all manner of crap these idiots throw at us.

 

John

Edited April 8, 2010 by HUnter_zero

[MOO 730]

They done a survey on our local wild fowling spot that has been shot on with lead shot since shooting began ...they sifted through the mud and from what I was told no lead shot was found not one pellat .....I hear for next season the wardens will be getting scanners so they can check wild fowlers ducks and geese for lead shot but what will happen is if any one on the mud comes accross a pricked bird they will have second thoughts about puting it out of its misery as they do not know who shot the bird in the first place and whether it was shot with legal shot .....just another rule that has not been thought out properly and does not really have any positve affects to the wildfowl

[flytie 1]

 

 

Was there not a consultation period, which for some of the part was dependant on evidence from the BASC? Is it not a FACT that there was so much more evidence that could have been put forward but was held back, why was that? What evidence, please explain?

 

 

John, With all your "supposed" facts I am surprised you were not called as an expert witness along with the other scientists to the select committee, i am sure you would have swayed them, with your dulcet toungue and fascinating prose.

 

I actually agree that the lead ban is a farce, i have said so before and will continue to do so. Do I think it will make any difference what i say, no. Do i think your rantings will have any effect, no!

 

The BASC were allowed a small voice in the consultation period discussions, I do not think it would have made any difference what they had said, the Government had stated aims and pushed towards them, hard.

 

I look forward to hearing of your election to the BASC/NGO/CA and seeing how you remedy the situation. Or will it just be a big fat Zero? I think I know which i would put my money on.

 

ft

[flytie 1]

They done a survey on our local wild fowling spot that has been shot on with lead shot since shooting began ...they sifted through the mud and from what I was told no lead shot was found not one pellat .....I hear for next season the wardens will be getting scanners so they can check wild fowlers ducks and geese for lead shot but what will happen is if any one on the mud comes accross a pricked bird they will have second thoughts about puting it out of its misery as they do not know who shot the bird in the first place and whether it was shot with legal shot .....just another rule that has not been thought out properly and does not really have any positve affects to the wildfowl

Moo, you ought to read the Lidisfarne Study (Palmer & Evans 1991). Lindisfarne has been shot over since game shooting began and they found lots of shot in the tidal flats, held in suspension in the grass roots. What they could not find was any effect on the wildlife there! The scientists came to the conclusion that the wildfowl must excrete the lead in salt form.

 

Either that or it has no effect.

 

Unfortunately there were plenty of other studies produced that suggested the opposite. I think when the Government pays for studies to take place, they get the results they want.

 

ft

[HUnter_zero 58]

 

I actually agree

ft

 

I'm SO happy.

 

John

[flytie 1]

 

I'm SO happy.

 

John

 

John, selective, disingenous and untruthful

 

Situation normal then

 

ft

[HUnter_zero 58]

 

 

Situation normal then

ft

 

 

Good

 

John

[Tiddler66 3]

Do you think that we on this forum are part of the "Inaccurate and alarmist reports that have appeared in the shooting press and on email concerning BASC's position on lead ammunition."...............................If the answer is yes, then perhaps BASC will take notice on how silly the quarry based ban is, as opposed to banning use of lead over wetlands. Nice to know that they are listening too.

[FightTheBan 1,147]

I for one am sick to death of relying on a spineless, gutless organisations who seemingly allow dogooders to walk all over us.

 

BASC did feck all about the new snaring bill or the ban on shock collers in Wales. We are slowly but surely loosing our rights and we need a no bullshit organisation with balls to put a foot down and say enough is enough.

 

If you take it away bit by bit, eventually we will have feck all left.

 

For BASC/CA to support a ludacris ban on lead shot (whilst the current legislation is sufficient) is baffling.

 

I refuse to give money to these cuunts so they can piss it up a wall, potentially causing more harm in the process.

Support SGA or the NGO, the only organisations with morals.

 

FTB

[waidmann 105]

They done a survey on our local wild fowling spot that has been shot on with lead shot since shooting began ...they sifted through the mud and from what I was told no lead shot was found not one pellat .....I hear for next season the wardens will be getting scanners so they can check wild fowlers ducks and geese for lead shot but what will happen is if any one on the mud comes accross a pricked bird they will have second thoughts about puting it out of its misery as they do not know who shot the bird in the first place and whether it was shot with legal shot .....just another rule that has not been thought out properly and does not really have any positve affects to the wildfowl

Moo, you ought to read the Lidisfarne Study (Palmer & Evans 1991). Lindisfarne has been shot over since game shooting began and they found lots of shot in the tidal flats, held in suspension in the grass roots. What they could not find was any effect on the wildlife there! The scientists came to the conclusion that the wildfowl must excrete the lead in salt form.

 

Either that or it has no effect.

 

Unfortunately there were plenty of other studies produced that suggested the opposite. I think when the Government pays for studies to take place, they get the results they want.

 

ft

 

 

 

the studies carried out in germany showed that fowl were not the problem directly.

the problem was that birds of prey were scavenging them/catching them (deer,pigs and fowl)after being shot/ingesting lead.

the bop has a very acidic stomach which cause lead oxide in reaction and poisons the birds.

 

it is still very controversial in germany as to the accuracy of these findings. fact is the bop are dying from lead oxide.

 

some very big areas in germany (run by the forestry commision)have a total lead ban(brandenburg,mecklenburg-vorpommern.....)

 

i'm not up to date on the balistic performance of the "alterative" projectiles but a couple of years ago they were looking pretty much second rate.

 

waidmann

[Tiddler66 3]

I don't think that Birds of Prey ingesting lead will be a real issue in the uk.........BOPs seem to be more numerous now that previously in my life time.......but thats not to say that the RSPB might try it on.......If only they would review the current lead ban.....and change it from a quarry based system to a location based system......surely it would be easier for them to police...