Stamina bull/greyhound vs collie greyhound

[stabba 10,745]

We’ve probably all heard the argument; collies are smart and bull terriers are dumb. Or should that be collie crosses are smart and bull crosses are dumb? They are both bandied about quite regularly and argued passionately on various internet hunting websites and (no doubt) beer tents the length and breadth of Britain. Both crosses possess drive aplenty and can’t be criticised for heart. There’s also the argument that both types are trainable, although there’s a certain element of “Pavlov’s Dog†to some collies I’ve seen. Some collie aficionados clearly see the bull as just a brute, rather like The Hulk – all brawn and no brains – only able to destroy things regardless of the damage done to themselves while they do it. I would be foolish to deny that there’s an element of that to their psyche, but there’s far more to it than that.

A collie is more of a natural dog in my opinion. What I mean by that is that like most animals, a dog will attempt to avoid injury when faced with danger. Fights between animals in the wild are generally a lot of posturing and threat, with very little actual sustained physical contact. A little like the Maoris and their Hakka – a display to intimidate with a view to avoiding physical confrontation. I guess that this is due to the fact that even the slightest injuries in the wild can mean death due to the risk of infection. It’s the natural order and dogs are no different. Bull terriers are a bit of an exception though. They possess an attribute that very few other animals have – gameness – that ability to “over-ride†that natural desire to avoid confrontation and push on despite receiving punishment themselves. Not all have it, and the ones that don’t are not fit to carry the name of the bull terrier. This is a peculiar trait that acts as an “over-ride†button when it comes to perceived intelligence. Certain people I have spoken to over the years have said that their (non-bull blooded) lurchers are too intelligent to get punished on their quarry and invariably this is down to some conferred ability or “knack.†Fair enough. I own non-bull blooded lurchers myself, but to put the bull crosses down for a perceived lack of intelligence is unfair. Let’s take a human analogy – it’s like saying that all rugby players are the equivalent of Neanderthals; or that all boxers are brain dead. It’s simply not true. They know they might get hurt by following their vocation, but that doesn’t stop them doing it. Does it make them stupid? I had a little bull terrier that I trained as a quasi gun dog. She would obey hand commands and was a lovely, well mannered dog who was a joy to own. Put her to her quarry though and she was a demon. I have said many times before it was as if she loved being bitten. She was brutal and driven and unflinching, and if she wanted to, she could have stayed out of harm’s way. She never did. Does that mean she was dumb? Well the same dog was still my gun dog and she would invariably do both tasks within hours, if not minutes of each other. It’s the “over-ride†switch. If you have a dog that knows when this switch is needed and when it isn’t, then you have the makings of some tool in your yard. Does this make bull crosses dumber than collie crosses? No, but it doesn’t make collie crosses smarter either. Accept that you’re dealing with different things and move on. I personally don’t keep a bull blooded dog of any kind anymore, although I probably will in the future. Many of you will know that I keep collie crosses now, as they suit the work that I do. It absolutely boils my piss though when I hear other lads who run other types, especially collie crosses, talk down to bull cross lads. They might not suit the work that you do, but they are far from stupid. They can be intelligent, trainable and sociable, but they can also possess a fury that has to be seen to be believed when on their quarry. At the end of the day, what do I care what type of dog another man uses to run at game? I won’t tell a bloke what he should and shouldn’t be feeding and I’ll expect the same courtesy in return. Good luck to them all.

Here here

[Bosun11 537]

@ Stabs.. Best post on here for a long while...

[divingshoes 0]

Fitness is fitness whichever way you look at it... a 100% fit bullx will go all nite.. and put more determination in than any colliex will... colliex,s are well known for preserving energy by doing just enough to get the job done.. sadly doing just enough doesnt do it any favours on certain quarry... atb stabba

 

Fitness is fitness yes, but on the other hand a boxer in top physical condition won't be able to touch along distance runner on a off day..

yeah but we are not talking about boxers and long distance runners are we,we are talking about dogs you forget we are not talking about pure bulls or pure collies competing you forget half the make up of either cross or more is made up from a sprinting dog both the greyhound and bull are athletes in the dog world a collie is a herding dog with a good brain, a bull is a game as hell package of raw power and does not know when to quit,a collie has endurance but it also has the brain to say ive had enough i am knackerd where a bull cross wont there is not many collie cross dogs you hear of that have run till they drop a good game bull cross would if you would let it

regards hedz

bollocks your saying a collie isnt an athlete love to see a pitbull herding live stock all day....... what a load of shite

[lurcherboy2 1]

ive always had bull grey x collie grey excellent stamina with brain and game as you like its a great cross

[whin 463]

yet too see a good bull cross last the nite up my way on big nites but there maybe about

[Guest joely b]

as the topic says stamina. have a few mates here and there that run bull xs , and the collie xs , yes the bull x is a handy dog to have , r/f/d/. but in truth they do tend to blow up. and i have seen this many a time whilst running them hard witch i think every lurcher should be tested , now the x is good at its job dont get me wrong here, but i will go with the collie x for more stamina its simple collie xs will run all night the ones i have seen have anyway , what i am talking about here is bull x greyhound, nothing eles in there this can be first x , or 3/4 greyhound 1/4 bull. to me this seems to the better one . same as the collie x a first x collie greyhound will run 7 nights aweek . the 3/4 greyhound 1/4 collie is the better one . as you can see i like that bit more speed in the dogs . starting to see bullgreyhound x salukigreyhound . and what i am seeing of this x is very very good plenty stamina

[fieldsman 51]

There are different types of stamina too. Are you talking about run after run like on a lamp, which they would have done for rabbit coursing back in the day? Or long runs a la hare coursing? A lot to do with recovery rates as well as actual physical stamina. I’ve seen a collie cross take a puncture through the throat, one through the chest, suffer a broken shoulder, broken leg, get an 8 inch gash in it’s flank and have it’s guts half hanging out, and still not let go of a wild boar. It certainly didn’t demonstrate some of the qualities that have been attributed to a collie cross in this thread. And I’m from a bull background and love them dearly. Not everything is black and white guys.

only collies

[dogs-n-natives 1,182]

If the lurcher is in fit shape, both crosses should be able to work the fells all day hunting up, or put in a full nights lamping... no good to me if they couldnt do that, its all about good feeding, and keeping them in tip top fitness

[hedz31 1,308]

Fitness is fitness whichever way you look at it... a 100% fit bullx will go all nite.. and put more determination in than any colliex will... colliex,s are well known for preserving energy by doing just enough to get the job done.. sadly doing just enough doesnt do it any favours on certain quarry... atb stabba

 

Fitness is fitness yes, but on the other hand a boxer in top physical condition won't be able to touch along distance runner on a off day..

yeah but we are not talking about boxers and long distance runners are we,we are talking about dogs you forget we are not talking about pure bulls or pure collies competing you forget half the make up of either cross or more is made up from a sprinting dog both the greyhound and bull are athletes in the dog world a collie is a herding dog with a good brain, a bull is a game as hell package of raw power and does not know when to quit,a collie has endurance but it also has the brain to say ive had enough i am knackerd where a bull cross wont there is not many collie cross dogs you hear of that have run till they drop a good game bull cross would if you would let it

regards hedz

bollocks your saying a collie isnt an athlete love to see a pitbull herding live stock all day....... what a load of shite

ok clever arse i would like to see a collie taking the sharp end all night and on a regular basis hmmmmmmmmmm how many do that and last a few years bet you have owned loads aint you

[hedz31 1,308]

Fitness is fitness whichever way you look at it... a 100% fit bullx will go all nite.. and put more determination in than any colliex will... colliex,s are well known for preserving energy by doing just enough to get the job done.. sadly doing just enough doesnt do it any favours on certain quarry... atb stabba

 

Fitness is fitness yes, but on the other hand a boxer in top physical condition won't be able to touch along distance runner on a off day..

yeah but we are not talking about boxers and long distance runners are we,we are talking about dogs you forget we are not talking about pure bulls or pure collies competing you forget half the make up of either cross or more is made up from a sprinting dog both the greyhound and bull are athletes in the dog world a collie is a herding dog with a good brain, a bull is a game as hell package of raw power and does not know when to quit,a collie has endurance but it also has the brain to say ive had enough i am knackerd where a bull cross wont there is not many collie cross dogs you hear of that have run till they drop a good game bull cross would if you would let it

regards hedz

bollocks your saying a collie isnt an athlete love to see a pitbull herding live stock all day....... what a load of shite

ok clever arse i would like to see a collie taking the sharp end all night and on a regular basis hmmmmmmmmmm how many do that and last a few years bet you have owned loads aint you

all bull xs do,most of them are not marked that much,funny years a go the ones that did get stuck in ( not bull xs ) ended up with there fangs gone and most the meat from under their jaw,can you explain this

if you explain the question better i might can explain yeah because what you have just asked makes bugger all sense to me malmute man

[DEERMAN 1,020]

Fitness is fitness whichever way you look at it... a 100% fit bullx will go all nite.. and put more determination in than any colliex will... colliex,s are well known for preserving energy by doing just enough to get the job done.. sadly doing just enough doesnt do it any favours on certain quarry... atb stabba

 

Fitness is fitness yes, but on the other hand a boxer in top physical condition won't be able to touch along distance runner on a off day..

yeah but we are not talking about boxers and long distance runners are we,we are talking about dogs you forget we are not talking about pure bulls or pure collies competing you forget half the make up of either cross or more is made up from a sprinting dog both the greyhound and bull are athletes in the dog world a collie is a herding dog with a good brain, a bull is a game as hell package of raw power and does not know when to quit,a collie has endurance but it also has the brain to say ive had enough i am knackerd where a bull cross wont there is not many collie cross dogs you hear of that have run till they drop a good game bull cross would if you would let it

regards hedz

bollocks your saying a collie isnt an athlete love to see a pitbull herding live stock all day....... what a load of shite

ok clever arse i would like to see a collie taking the sharp end all night and on a regular basis hmmmmmmmmmm how many do that and last a few years bet you have owned loads aint you

all bull xs do,most of them are not marked that much,funny years a go the ones that did get stuck in ( not bull xs ) ended up with there fangs gone and most the meat from under their jaw,can you explain this

if you explain the question better i might can explain yeah because what you have just asked makes bugger all sense to me malmute man

sorry i live in a village but im not welsh

no your deff not welsh

[DEERMAN 1,020]

Fitness is fitness whichever way you look at it... a 100% fit bullx will go all nite.. and put more determination in than any colliex will... colliex,s are well known for preserving energy by doing just enough to get the job done.. sadly doing just enough doesnt do it any favours on certain quarry... atb stabba

 

Fitness is fitness yes, but on the other hand a boxer in top physical condition won't be able to touch along distance runner on a off day..

yeah but we are not talking about boxers and long distance runners are we,we are talking about dogs you forget we are not talking about pure bulls or pure collies competing you forget half the make up of either cross or more is made up from a sprinting dog both the greyhound and bull are athletes in the dog world a collie is a herding dog with a good brain, a bull is a game as hell package of raw power and does not know when to quit,a collie has endurance but it also has the brain to say ive had enough i am knackerd where a bull cross wont there is not many collie cross dogs you hear of that have run till they drop a good game bull cross would if you would let it

regards hedz

bollocks your saying a collie isnt an athlete love to see a pitbull herding live stock all day....... what a load of shite

ok clever arse i would like to see a collie taking the sharp end all night and on a regular basis hmmmmmmmmmm how many do that and last a few years bet you have owned loads aint you

all bull xs do,most of them are not marked that much,funny years a go the ones that did get stuck in ( not bull xs ) ended up with there fangs gone and most the meat from under their jaw,can you explain this

if you explain the question better i might can explain yeah because what you have just asked makes bugger all sense to me malmute man

sorry i live in a village but im not welsh

no your deff not welsh

im lucky you got a sense of humour

[Trigger 26]

Fitness is fitness whichever way you look at it... a 100% fit bullx will go all nite.. and put more determination in than any colliex will... colliex,s are well known for preserving energy by doing just enough to get the job done.. sadly doing just enough doesnt do it any favours on certain quarry... atb stabba

 

Fitness is fitness yes, but on the other hand a boxer in top physical condition won't be able to touch along distance runner on a off day..

yeah but we are not talking about boxers and long distance runners are we,we are talking about dogs you forget we are not talking about pure bulls or pure collies competing you forget half the make up of either cross or more is made up from a sprinting dog both the greyhound and bull are athletes in the dog world a collie is a herding dog with a good brain, a bull is a game as hell package of raw power and does not know when to quit,a collie has endurance but it also has the brain to say ive had enough i am knackerd where a bull cross wont there is not many collie cross dogs you hear of that have run till they drop a good game bull cross would if you would let it

regards hedz

bollocks your saying a collie isnt an athlete love to see a pitbull herding live stock all day....... what a load of shite

ok clever arse i would like to see a collie taking the sharp end all night and on a regular basis hmmmmmmmmmm how many do that and last a few years bet you have owned loads aint you

all bull xs do,most of them are not marked that much,funny years a go the ones that did get stuck in ( not bull xs ) ended up with there fangs gone and most the meat from under their jaw,can you explain this

if you explain the question better i might can explain yeah because what you have just asked makes bugger all sense to me malmute man

what he has said is apparently all bull Xs are doing the job. but why dont they look anything like the dogs did years ago as they ended up with there k9 teeth missing along with most of the meet under there bottom jaw.

 

like this one

[ProHunter80 1]

ive always had bull grey x collie grey excellent stamina with brain and game as you like its a great cross

got and pics mate ive got my first bullgrey x colliegrey he's 7 month now

[hedz31 1,308]

Fitness is fitness whichever way you look at it... a 100% fit bullx will go all nite.. and put more determination in than any colliex will... colliex,s are well known for preserving energy by doing just enough to get the job done.. sadly doing just enough doesnt do it any favours on certain quarry... atb stabba

 

Fitness is fitness yes, but on the other hand a boxer in top physical condition won't be able to touch along distance runner on a off day..

yeah but we are not talking about boxers and long distance runners are we,we are talking about dogs you forget we are not talking about pure bulls or pure collies competing you forget half the make up of either cross or more is made up from a sprinting dog both the greyhound and bull are athletes in the dog world a collie is a herding dog with a good brain, a bull is a game as hell package of raw power and does not know when to quit,a collie has endurance but it also has the brain to say ive had enough i am knackerd where a bull cross wont there is not many collie cross dogs you hear of that have run till they drop a good game bull cross would if you would let it

regards hedz

bollocks your saying a collie isnt an athlete love to see a pitbull herding live stock all day....... what a load of shite

ok clever arse i would like to see a collie taking the sharp end all night and on a regular basis hmmmmmmmmmm how many do that and last a few years bet you have owned loads aint you

all bull xs do,most of them are not marked that much,funny years a go the ones that did get stuck in ( not bull xs ) ended up with there fangs gone and most the meat from under their jaw,can you explain this

if you explain the question better i might can explain yeah because what you have just asked makes bugger all sense to me malmute man

what he has said is apparently all bull Xs are doing the job. but why dont they look anything like the dogs did years ago as they ended up with there k9 teeth missing along with most of the meet under there bottom jaw.

 

like this one

the fact of the matter is trigger if i was a rabbiting man and ferreted and lamped rabbits on a regular basis a collie grey would be for me but i dont lamp rabbits or go ferreting so there not for me i actualy keep wheaten/greys not bull/greys but ive seen more collie/greys turn there nose up and say ive had enough than i have seen bull/greys do it