English Bull's

[lampinglurcher 36]

The trouble is that good working Pit Bulls tend to be very Dog aggressive so make working as a pack tricky if not impossible, especially when they're hyped up. They have comparatively little natural hunting instict, they don't know the meaning of 'let go' and although they apperently have a good nose they tend not to be as willing to use it as an IBT.

 

If you want a wrecking machine with balls of steel and loads of drive then a game bred Pit is what you want.

 

If you want a Dog that can work in a pack, use it's nose without training, have huge natural hunting instinct and will let go when you want it to then the IBT is the way to go.

 

If you want a gaurd Dog then the IBT is also a much better choice.

 

Horses for courses, they're not the same type of Dog.

i have been around and trained both, some pits mite not work in a pack some can, it is [bANNED TEXT] you put in to your dog from the very start, as for a gaurd or a PP dog give me a pit bull from the right stock, i have trained both for this and the pit bull shits all over the them,

 

lets face it, no bull terrier is going to be as good a pp dog (consistently) as a purpose bred one - malinois, german shep, etc etc. not to say they can do it well, where i worked in sydney i trained loads of pits for pp and manstopper work and they can be ok or even good occasionally. but not like a purpose bred dog.

 

again, in australia i have seen pits scent and catch pigs well, never seen an ebt do it but that dont mean they wont or cant. also amstaffs are very popular for it. - just what ive seen.

[jigsaw 11,875]

look lets cut through the bullsh*te,in fairness ALL bull terriers,let it be english,staff or pit were originally formed for combat sport of some form,either dog versus dog or dog versus wild animals but they were meant to bring devestation to what ever they were pitched against.Now man/woman kind(im not sexist/chauvanistic) have moved on a little from those dark days and its frowned upon to even speak of such pastimes,BUT english bulls were never meant to hunt in packs unless under strict supervision and they certainly werent meant to chase rabbits.Its great for the dog no doubt to hunt up and crash through whatever in the pursuit of a bunny,rat.If you can run your bull terrier with other dogs and in the heat of the hunt with a dog or two yapping,he doesnt get a bit over excited and decide to take whatever runs across his path,be it the rabbit or the dog,then its a hell of a different bull terrier to the ones I saw as a lad and i wouldnt be interested in owning one.It just wouldnt be a proper bull terrier in my eyes.Id love to see the englisg bull recover from the deformed stereotypical monstrosities that the show people have developed and the IBT is just such a dog i believe but can he take the stick that comes with what was the test of all bull terriers of old,has anyone in the past,preban used them as draw dogs?I think your own words sum it up,''with balls of steel and loads of drive then a game bred Pit is what you want.''your dogs lack loads of drive?im not being nasty here,Hogdog your dog is a stunning animal,and looks like a very capable animal,I think you deserve great credit for the work done for the breed,but theres only one way to find out if hes the oldtime champion.Have a look at the new book out from darcy books,all the englisg bulls there wetre tested and capable,which is the way it should be.

[lampinglurcher 36]

well said jigsaw

[hogdog 61]

I'm not sure what you know of their history but we've reached different conclusions on what a Bull terrier was (and should be) bred for.

 

Fighting and hunting are two different jobs, why would you need a hunting dog to be good in the pit? What purpose would it serve?

 

I have the utmost respect for the Pit Bull, they are incredibly versatile and capable Dogs but there are reasons the Bull terrier suits me better.

 

As I said before, if you want a fighting Dog you might as well take the short cut and get yourself a Pit Bull, I can't see any reason for trying to breed 'game' Bull terriers.

[hogdog 61]

BTW I'm not suggesting that my Dog or any other Dog from this line lacks drive. Anyone who knows them will know that you can't get more drive in a Dog.

[nobo 1]

I'm not sure what you know of their history but we've reached different conclusions on what a Bull terrier was (and should be) bred for.

 

Fighting and hunting are two different jobs, why would you need a hunting dog to be good in the pit? What purpose would it serve?

 

I have the utmost respect for the Pit Bull, they are incredibly versatile and capable Dogs but there are reasons the Bull terrier suits me better.

 

As I said before, if you want a fighting Dog you might as well take the short cut and get yourself a Pit Bull, I can't see any reason for trying to breed 'game' Bull terriers.

[/quot

about 250 dog books on my book cases mate and thats just the tip of the iceberg. how about you [bANNED TEXT]

[bANNED TEXT] books are you reading to fined out about the history of the different bull terriers, bull breeds, mastiff breeds and the working terriers and long dogs, as for me to fined out about the bull breeds you have got to do the same with the different mastiff and terrier breeds as well, as they are all in there make up.

Edited August 20, 2010 by nobo

[hogdog 61]

I agree, to understand the Bull Terrier you have to understand other breeds too.

 

You also have to be able to sort truth from fiction.

[samuri 4]

hey pongopalmer

 

iv always liked EBTs from a young age so when i got me own place i got 1 only as a pet.his worst problem is recall

 

hey hogdog

 

nice EBT mate did he take a lot to train as mine is very strong headed does what he wants

 

drive........... he will chase anything horses cows runners and cyclist his favorite

temperament..... he is very excitable when people come to the house few mins and he calms down he just wants to lick and chew fingers not hard tho

health.......... had to have balls removed as 1 never droped

breeding........ no got no balls

 

atb samuri

Edited August 20, 2010 by samuri

[nobo 1]

I agree, to understand the Bull Terrier you have to understand other breeds too.

 

You also have to be able to sort truth from fiction.

you wont fined the truth on the net you have got to read every think, have a look under every stone and do a bit with your dogs

[hogdog 61]

He was REALLY hard work to train and tested me to my limits. He needed a firm hand but he also needed a positive approach. He's still hard work when he gets too excited but he's a clever fella and will catch on quickly to whatever you teach him. Certainly not a Dog for beginners...even though I liked to think I knew how to train a Dog he forced me to become a better owner. I did get frustrated at times and it's easy to blame the Dog, it just required a bit of humility on my part to admit that my own skills were lacking and that I needed to brush up a bit. It took some time but his obedience is absolutely spot on now, the most obedient Dog I've ever owned.

[samuri 4]

He was REALLY hard work to train and tested me to my limits. He needed a firm hand but he also needed a positive approach. He's still hard work when he gets too excited but he's a clever fella and will catch on quickly to whatever you teach him. Certainly not a Dog for beginners...even though I liked to think I knew how to train a Dog he forced me to become a better owner. I did get frustrated at times and it's easy to blame the Dog, it just required a bit of humility on my part to admit that my own skills were lacking and that I needed to brush up a bit. It took some time but his obedience is absolutely spot on now, the most obedient Dog I've ever owned.

 

hes the only dog iv owned. well done for training an EBT. most obedient dog ever owned never thought i would here EBT owner sy that

[whatdog72 287]

I will try to get some done this weekend. I took him out last night and I didn't see what he did he got pretty banged up so I might be a bit scabby in the photos.

It would be good to see these rabbits round by you if they smash your bullterrier up

[hogdog 61]

I will try to get some done this weekend. I took him out last night and I didn't see what he did he got pretty banged up so I might be a bit scabby in the photos.

It would be good to see these rabbits round by you if they smash your bullterrier up

 

PMSL, it looks like he took a tumble on hard ground because he was covered in cuts and grazes. Either that or he ran into something. They're certainly not bite marks. I don't let him loose on anything but Rabbits.

[jigsaw 11,875]

right i conceed,but I believe the bull terrier was never meant to be an out and out hunting dog.It was a competetive vermin killing dog if we believe the books,but surely they made the E/B terrier big as to have strength to draw and hold quarry.Am I wrong but wasnt the sport of badger baiting,ie pulling one from a barrell or something just as pathetic written about in an english bull book,if im right and i think I may be,then here we have the fighting side of the origional E/B,a side which you may be omiting in your line of dogs.''I can't see any reason for trying to breed 'game' Bull terriers.''with that statement arent you breeding just another replica?I thought the testing and culling by the old time bulldog fanciers was to keep that side of the breed tiptop.Anyway enjoying the discussion and still a nice dog.

[Stabs 3]

If any of you have an interest in the creation of the Bull Terrier then "Master Craftsman" by Kevin Kane, which is a biography of James Hinks, is a must read.