BIG NAMES

[francolin 449]

That post is the biggest load of crap I ve ever read."interbred to the extent that deformities are common"then the punch line,"some of which aren t visible"?the greatest deformity in an "earthdog"is the inability to work to ground.it's the lack of family or line breeding of dogs of a high standard that is the main reason for the lack of "good dogs".worker to worker within a family is the way to maintain terriers,in the truest sense of the word.If the good genes contained within the good dogs where saturated by family breeding we would nt be gambling and hoping for 1 worker out of every litter.what made the apbt what it is or was?a good understanding of genes and family traits and breeding from "producers".the big names?say what you want are big names because they had/have the know how to PRODUCE workers in high percentages.saturation of good blood and an understanding of genetics and working terriers is the way forward.if some want to make big money that's their choice,as long as they re puttingworkers on the ground.

Makes me wonder whether some are concerned about "big names"or are they jealous that some are more well known than them and know how to make a few pound while doing it?Lol

agree 99% with what your saying but disagree about the money changeing hands its all gone a bit daft to much breeding for profit rather than breeding for quality

[wexford Pa 84]

That post is the biggest load of crap I ve ever read."interbred to the extent that deformities are common"then the punch line,"some of which aren t visible"?the greatest deformity in an "earthdog"is the inability to work to ground.it's the lack of family or line breeding of dogs of a high standard that is the main reason for the lack of "good dogs".worker to worker within a family is the way to maintain terriers,in the truest sense of the word.If the good genes contained within the good dogs where saturated by family breeding we would nt be gambling and hoping for 1 worker out of every litter.what made the apbt what it is or was?a good understanding of genes and family traits and breeding from "producers".the big names?say what you want are big names because they had/have the know how to PRODUCE workers in high percentages.saturation of good blood and an understanding of genetics and working terriers is the way forward.if some want to make big money that's their choice,as long as they re puttingworkers on the ground.

Makes me wonder whether some are concerned about "big names"or are they jealous that some are more well known than them and know how to make a few pound while doing it?Lol

Spot on response mate..

[madgerboy 11]

Oohmydog,you ve listened to too many myths mate.I have a 3rd season bitch in my yard who's mother is her half sister and she is a very steady worker but more so she has never had so much as a kidney infection.she is far from show dog but as healthy an animal as I ve ever kept and while tightest bred in the yard she is is the most biddable and precisely the opposite of what you imagine family breeding produces.if all goes according to plan she ll be bred to her best half brother,and while I don t see any defects physically all I'm doingis saturating the characteristics I want to maintain.sick and my granny would nt agree but I ve seen it work.oh and if I was in a position where I needed a pup and the best available dog and bitch where full bro and sis yes me being a red neck I d mate them without hesitation but then I'd go out to the best available producer,and preferably somewhere in the same family.ps I would nt sell a pup never have,they d go to honest terriermen.even if the best terrierman was my worst enemy.

Its all about the dogs

sorry for going of topic(I can t stick them dog dealing scumbegs either)lol

[wexford Pa 84]

worker to worker is the best name

i agree mate. And for me finally getting to a point with a little help from some of the older big names producing some steady away old fashioned terriers. Not the show types. Not that there is anything wrong with that, i just cant seem to get that mix right. Not that im worried about looks

20 odd years ago you went to look at a litter of terrier pups checked the teeth and feet and bought one because of the parents and what you had seen them do or been told .the breeding in some dogs these days is gross (interbred to the extent that deformities in the litters are regular some of which are not visible .i think thats when the dreaded pound as taken over i dont and im sure that a lot of lads dont rely understand the genes in mammals

what defects have you come across and how close interbred is too close in your opinion ,are you commenting from your own findings out of interest .

mouth defects ,(weak teeth undershot early blindness and mental)this is only my opinion when you put father to daughter grandfather to granddaughter you are doing it to keep the colour ,confirmation or size for showing and its a slippery slope ,you see working terriers so undershot if you took them out in the rain they would drown ,some call it bullmouthed i dont buy that any terrier as only one thing it can defend it self with ,there its teeth ,bring your bottom set of teeth forward of your top set and try and bite say a broom handle and get a grip ,i just think its a breeding defect

im sorry mate but obviously know very little about how a workin dog actually work or breedin dogs never line breeding.. U said 'this is only my opinion when you put father to daughter grandfather to granddaughter you are doing it to keep the colour ,confirmation or size for showing'.. Now we're breedin for work NOT show, secondly grandfather to grandaughter has only 12.5% chance of any defects in a litter and is a relatively safe way to line-breed and father to daughter mating is inbreeding which carries a 25% chance of deficiency in a litter as they share half the chromosomes which is to close for breeding successfully.. Another thing is that undershot mouth is not that much of a defect in a working dog as it gives a scissors like bite which holds better than a straight bite.. Hope this as helped a little..

.... Pa

[Hepher 86]

worker to worker is the best name

i agree mate. And for me finally getting to a point with a little help from some of the older big names producing some steady away old fashioned terriers. Not the show types. Not that there is anything wrong with that, i just cant seem to get that mix right. Not that im worried about looks

20 odd years ago you went to look at a litter of terrier pups checked the teeth and feet and bought one because of the parents and what you had seen them do or been told .the breeding in some dogs these days is gross (interbred to the extent that deformities in the litters are regular some of which are not visible .i think thats when the dreaded pound as taken over i dont and im sure that a lot of lads dont rely understand the genes in mammals

what defects have you come across and how close interbred is too close in your opinion ,are you commenting from your own findings out of interest .

mouth defects ,(weak teeth undershot early blindness and mental)this is only my opinion when you put father to daughter grandfather to granddaughter you are doing it to keep the colour ,confirmation or size for showing and its a slippery slope ,you see working terriers so undershot if you took them out in the rain they would drown ,some call it bullmouthed i dont buy that any terrier as only one thing it can defend it self with ,there its teeth ,bring your bottom set of teeth forward of your top set and try and bite say a broom handle and get a grip ,i just think its a breeding defect

 

O.M.D THAT'S THE BIGGEST LOAD OF B00LOCKS I'VE EVER READ, MY DIGGING PARTNER IS DIGGING A BITCH FROM FATHER DAUGHTER BREEDING, I'VE SEEN DOGS FROM BROTHER SISTER THAT WERE PERFECT, I'VE SEEN UNDERSHOT DOGS WORK PERFECTLY FINE. YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVEN'T A CLUE ABOUT LINE BREEDING AND KEEPING A TIGHT WORKING GENE POOL, YES EVERY SO OFTEN AN OUTCROSS IS NEEDED AND CAREFUL CONSIDERATION IS TO BE TAKEN AS TO WHICH BLOOD YOU USE, AS WITH ANY LINING THE GENES MAY NOT GEL. BREEDING IS A HIT AND MISS EVERYTIME, FOR THOSE THAT GET IT RIGHT FAIR PLAY TO THEM. WITHOUT THE SO CALLED BIG NAMES WE WOULD'NT HAVE SOME OF THE GENE POOLS WE HAVE TODAY TO WORK WITH.

[madgerboy 11]

It would be boring if we all agreed and all was black and White but imagine ye had your perfect dog he produced a high percentage of workers one of which was his daughter.your old dogs done,10 year old and ye want to clone him,ye can t so ye go for as high a percentage of him as ye can.ye stick him over his daughter you ve 75percent of your super dog.my friend was given this advise by a well known terrierman."aim for 75percent of your best dog".I seen it done and the bitch I got was 25ib and 14"tts.I know what your saying wex pa but your looking at it from a "glass half empty"point.it can work with the percentage in your favour but the original animals have to be as faultless as you ve seen.Omo.there's lots to be learnt from oldtime breeders of apbt.

[madgerboy 11]

Don't you blow my cover hepher and tell them I'm your digging partner lolYou have to excuse hepher he comes from a long line of brother/sis matings and is hideously undershot.very bad temperment also lol

[Catcher 1 639]

IS IT JUST ME OR IS IT JUST BECAUSE A DOG IS BRED OF SUCH AND SUCK A DOG IT GETS TO BE TALKED ABOUT IVE SEEN SOME HANDY DOGS BRED OUT OUT OF NO NAME AND I WOULD PUT ANY COULOUR OF MONEY THEY ;D BAIT ANY DOG OFF THE FIELD PEOPLR ARE TO MUCH GOT UP IN NAMES. NAMES DONT MEAN f**k ALL THERE JUST A MARK OR PEOPLE TRYING TO MAKE $$$$$

 

 

Said it before name dropping seems to be the fad on here

[jack crowley 5]

IS IT JUST ME OR IS IT JUST BECAUSE A DOG IS BRED OF SUCH AND SUCK A DOG IT GETS TO BE TALKED ABOUT IVE SEEN SOME HANDY DOGS BRED OUT OUT OF NO NAME AND I WOULD PUT ANY COULOUR OF MONEY THEY ;D BAIT ANY DOG OFF THE FIELD PEOPLR ARE TO MUCH GOT UP IN NAMES. NAMES DONT MEAN f**k ALL THERE JUST A MARK OR PEOPLE TRYING TO MAKE $$$$$

 

 

Said it before name dropping seems to be the fad on here

thats exactly the point i was trying to make iv nothing against the people breeding the genuine dogs, in fact i admire them .but its the people breeding off wankers and selling on dirt drives me mad .but you might as well be pissing against the wind for the good it will do......

[Hepher 86]

Don't you blow my cover hepher and tell them I'm your digging partner lolYou have to excuse hepher he comes from a long line of brother/sis matings and is hideously undershot.very bad temperment also lol

 

SORRY COUSIN CLEETUS, NOW LETS GO GET OURSELVES SOME NEEGERS! :secret: :secret: :wacko: :wacko:

[madgerboy 11]

Don't you blow my cover hepher and tell them I'm your digging partner lolYou have to excuse hepher he comes from a long line of brother/sis matings and is hideously undershot.very bad temperment also lol

 

SORRY COUSIN CLEETUS, NOW LETS GO GET OURSELVES SOME NEEGERS! :secret: :secret: :wacko: :wacko:

In the corn fields with ma daddi an de chainsaws lol

[wexford Pa 84]

It would be boring if we all agreed and all was black and White but imagine ye had your perfect dog he produced a high percentage of workers one of which was his daughter.your old dogs done,10 year old and ye want to clone him,ye can t so ye go for as high a percentage of him as ye can.ye stick him over his daughter you ve 75percent of your super dog.my friend was given this advise by a well known terrierman."aim for 75percent of your best dog".I seen it done and the bitch I got was 25ib and 14"tts.I know what your saying wex pa but your looking at it from a "glass half empty"point.it can work with the percentage in your favour but the original animals have to be as faultless as you ve seen.Omo.there's lots to be learnt from oldtime breeders of apbt.

Sorry forgot to mention the most important thing when line-breedin that both parents should be without faults n most importantly healthy and strong..

..... Pa

[oohmydog 82]

It would be boring if we all agreed and all was black and White but imagine ye had your perfect dog he produced a high percentage of workers one of which was his daughter.your old dogs done,10 year old and ye want to clone him,ye can t so ye go for as high a percentage of him as ye can.ye stick him over his daughter you ve 75percent of your super dog.my friend was given this advise by a well known terrierman."aim for 75percent of your best dog".I seen it done and the bitch I got was 25ib and 14"tts.I know what your saying wex pa but your looking at it from a "glass half empty"point.it can work with the percentage in your favour but the original animals have to be as faultless as you ve seen.Omo.there's lots to be learnt from oldtime breeders of apbt.

Sorry forgot to mention the most important thing when line-breedin that both parents should be without faults n most importantly healthy and strong..

..... Pa

Who do you think as f****d the border terrier up some big names there ,don,t listen to myths never have understand what lads are on about but i think when dogs have a good reputation and everybody wants a pup things go tits up and its usually all for money thin line between big name and big dealer

[Hepher 86]

It would be boring if we all agreed and all was black and White but imagine ye had your perfect dog he produced a high percentage of workers one of which was his daughter.your old dogs done,10 year old and ye want to clone him,ye can t so ye go for as high a percentage of him as ye can.ye stick him over his daughter you ve 75percent of your super dog.my friend was given this advise by a well known terrierman."aim for 75percent of your best dog".I seen it done and the bitch I got was 25ib and 14"tts.I know what your saying wex pa but your looking at it from a "glass half empty"point.it can work with the percentage in your favour but the original animals have to be as faultless as you ve seen.Omo.there's lots to be learnt from oldtime breeders of apbt.

Sorry forgot to mention the most important thing when line-breedin that both parents should be without faults n most importantly healthy and strong..

..... Pa

Who do you think as f****d the border terrier up some big names there ,don,t listen to myths never have understand what lads are on about but i think when dogs have a good reputation and everybody wants a pup things go tits up and its usually all for money thin line between big name and big dealer

 

SO BY YOUR EARLIER POST ABOUT LINE BREEDING, FATHER/DAUGHTER ETC, THAT'S WHAT FCUKED UP THE BORDERS? IF I HAD 2 DOGS IN MY YARD AT STUD, 1 WAS UNDERSHOT BUT AN OUTSTANDING WORKER AND THE OTHER WAS PHYSICALLY FAULTLESS BUT WAS NOT AS GOOD A WORKER, I WOULD BREED FROM THE UNDERSHOT DOG, SIMPLY FOR THE WORKING ABILITY. LOOKS AIN'T GOT FECK ALL TO DO WITH WORKING ABILITY IMO. LINE BREEDING IS THE REASON WHY WE HAVE SOME GOOD DOGS ON THE GROUND TODAY.

[oohmydog 82]

It would be boring if we all agreed and all was black and White but imagine ye had your perfect dog he produced a high percentage of workers one of which was his daughter.your old dogs done,10 year old and ye want to clone him,ye can t so ye go for as high a percentage of him as ye can.ye stick him over his daughter you ve 75percent of your super dog.my friend was given this advise by a well known terrierman."aim for 75percent of your best dog".I seen it done and the bitch I got was 25ib and 14"tts.I know what your saying wex pa but your looking at it from a "glass half empty"point.it can work with the percentage in your favour but the original animals have to be as faultless as you ve seen.Omo.there's lots to be learnt from oldtime breeders of apbt.

Sorry forgot to mention the most important thing when line-breedin that both parents should be without faults n most importantly healthy and strong..

..... Pa

Who do you think as f****d the border terrier up some big names there ,don,t listen to myths never have understand what lads are on about but i think when dogs have a good reputation and everybody wants a pup things go tits up and its usually all for money thin line between big name and big dealer

 

SO BY YOUR EARLIER POST ABOUT LINE BREEDING, FATHER/DAUGHTER ETC, THAT'S WHAT FCUKED UP THE BORDERS? IF I HAD 2 DOGS IN MY YARD AT STUD, 1 WAS UNDERSHOT BUT AN OUTSTANDING WORKER AND THE OTHER WAS PHYSICALLY FAULTLESS BUT WAS NOT AS GOOD A WORKER, I WOULD BREED FROM THE UNDERSHOT DOG, SIMPLY FOR THE WORKING ABILITY. LOOKS AIN'T GOT FECK ALL TO DO WITH WORKING ABILITY IMO. LINE BREEDING IS THE REASON WHY WE HAVE SOME GOOD DOGS ON THE GROUND TODAY.

D o you think undershot dogs loose there teeth a lot quicker than a dog with a good mouth ,if worked and the dog gets up to his quarry