first fac application

[gundogbob 1]

hi guys right could you clear somthing up for me my mate is wanting to apply for his first fac application and was wanting 22 hornet for fox and 243 for muntjack and chinise water deer plus the odd roe he has permission to take these spieces but i dont think that our fao will let him as he has no rifle expirence he has been shooting shotguns for 4 years so understands the safty aspect do you think he will get it or not

would he be better off getting 22lr and 17hmr for rabbit then asking for variation in a few months time

many thanks

[JonathanL 4]

Don't see why not. If he has permission I doubt there'll be a problem - he has experience with firearms too which will go in his favour.

 

J.

[jamie g 17]

depends on the force area but i wouldnt think he will get a 243 right from the off. inless he has some sort of mentoring.

 

well the safety side is still the same you said yourself. he has no use of rifles before

Edited February 14, 2010 by jamie g

[Deker 3,478]

If he has the land and the need then he should be ok, but FEO's and the regions often want to flex their muscles these days so who knows.

 

But apply for sure and take it from there!!

[langouroux 14]

on my first application 18 months ago i got .22LR for rabbit / vermin including fox as well as a .308 for fox ad deer.

 

his first application will have restrictions on it though.

[gundogbob 1]

on my first application 18 months ago i got .22LR for rabbit / vermin including fox as well as a .308 for fox ad deer.

 

his first application will have restrictions on it though.

what kind of conditions can he expect

[fatboy 0]

what kind of conditions can he expect

 

I would think he would have mentoring of some sort on his first application.

[cassshantia 16]

hi there ,

regarding the .243 and feo and the police they have no right of refusing you

if you have the permission /land to shoot on

they try to tell you alsorts of bullshit and it should not rub off on you

be confident and when you fill in your application for this the info you put down

is very very important

this can and will do put you in good stead for an open ticket

ive no experience on 243or .17 apart from the odd shot with a keeper

and got 2 mates to tell me the correct info to put on my ticket

i should sound like this

.243 uses for fox and deer and for zeroing of rifle on ranges and land over which i lawfully have authority to shoot (so this gives you the right to go on land which you have written permission )and you should state that you carry out activities in connection with the management of any estate(ie syndicate member on a shoot etc etc) this again is the ultimate wording for an open ticket

hope this helps

[jamie g 17]

hi there ,

regarding the .243 and feo and the police they have no right of refusing you

if you have the permission /land to shoot on

they try to tell you alsorts of bullshit and it should not rub off on you

be confident and when you fill in your application for this the info you put down

is very very important

this can and will do put you in good stead for an open ticket

ive no experience on 243or .17 apart from the odd shot with a keeper

and got 2 mates to tell me the correct info to put on my ticket

i should sound like this

.243 uses for fox and deer and for zeroing of rifle on ranges and land over which i lawfully have authority to shoot (so this gives you the right to go on land which you have written permission )and you should state that you carry out activities in connection with the management of any estate(ie syndicate member on a shoot etc etc) this again is the ultimate wording for an open ticket

hope this helps

 

sorry to pop your bubble mate but just saying your applying for 243 for fox and deer and for zeroing of rifle on ranges and land over which i lawfully have authority to shoot wont just get you a open ticket.

 

not many people get open right away. inless you can prove someway of shooting them you need it for your job say ?

the police will check the land to see if its past. they wouldnt just hand out a open fac and then let the person go where ever they have permission.

 

it takes time to get open. inless your lucky. all guns are a danger as we no. but giving some one a 243 on open is scary stuff when they havent handled a rifle before

[JonathanL 4]

hi there ,

regarding the .243 and feo and the police they have no right of refusing you

if you have the permission /land to shoot on

they try to tell you alsorts of bullshit and it should not rub off on you

be confident and when you fill in your application for this the info you put down

is very very important

this can and will do put you in good stead for an open ticket

ive no experience on 243or .17 apart from the odd shot with a keeper

and got 2 mates to tell me the correct info to put on my ticket

i should sound like this

.243 uses for fox and deer and for zeroing of rifle on ranges and land over which i lawfully have authority to shoot (so this gives you the right to go on land which you have written permission )and you should state that you carry out activities in connection with the management of any estate(ie syndicate member on a shoot etc etc) this again is the ultimate wording for an open ticket

hope this helps

 

sorry to pop your bubble mate but just saying your applying for 243 for fox and deer and for zeroing of rifle on ranges and land over which i lawfully have authority to shoot wont just get you a open ticket.

 

not many people get open right away. inless you can prove someway of shooting them you need it for your job say ?

the police will check the land to see if its past. they wouldnt just hand out a open fac and then let the person go where ever they have permission.

 

it takes time to get open. inless your lucky. all guns are a danger as we no. but giving some one a 243 on open is scary stuff when they havent handled a rifle before

 

It all depends on the circumstances of the individual case as to what will be authorised. The other poster is basically right in what he says in that the bottom line is that the police cannot refuse you. If you meet the statutory criteria the police must issue the certificate - they have no choice. It's complicated a bit by the fact that there is no mechanism in law for appealing a condition applied to a certificate but if you provide sufficient "good reason" in law then you will get what you ar asking for and you probably could get a condition changed but not through the standard sec.44 appeal procedure. If you have good reason to have an open ticket then you should be given one, quite honestly.

 

Actually, I thought that whatever condition was applied regarding land you shoot over (whether it was restricted to one piece or was open) they almost always put on the bit which allows you to use it on ranges as well. I fail to see why there would be any problwm with it as the suitability of the land is hardly in question. Thinking about it, if you had a ticket allowing you to shoot on any land you had permission on then you wouldn't even need range use to be specified on the condition because the condition allows you to shoot it on any land to begin with.

 

J.

Edited February 15, 2010 by JonathanL

[Colster 1]

At the end of the day Bob, all you're going to get on here is opinion. Nothing wrong with that but none of us know whether your mate's FEO will grant these. Best advice I can give, is to ask for what he actually wants from the start and be prepared to justify it's need. A FAC isn't a right like an SGC so there maybe some horsetrading going on when the FEO does the home visit where he may try and downsize the calibres he'll grant but as long as your mate is prepared for this and ready to state his case clearly and succinctly he "should" be ok.

[jamie g 17]

hi there ,

regarding the .243 and feo and the police they have no right of refusing you

if you have the permission /land to shoot on

they try to tell you alsorts of bullshit and it should not rub off on you

be confident and when you fill in your application for this the info you put down

is very very important

this can and will do put you in good stead for an open ticket

ive no experience on 243or .17 apart from the odd shot with a keeper

and got 2 mates to tell me the correct info to put on my ticket

i should sound like this

.243 uses for fox and deer and for zeroing of rifle on ranges and land over which i lawfully have authority to shoot (so this gives you the right to go on land which you have written permission )and you should state that you carry out activities in connection with the management of any estate(ie syndicate member on a shoot etc etc) this again is the ultimate wording for an open ticket

hope this helps

 

sorry to pop your bubble mate but just saying your applying for 243 for fox and deer and for zeroing of rifle on ranges and land over which i lawfully have authority to shoot wont just get you a open ticket.

 

not many people get open right away. inless you can prove someway of shooting them you need it for your job say ?

the police will check the land to see if its past. they wouldnt just hand out a open fac and then let the person go where ever they have permission.

 

it takes time to get open. inless your lucky. all guns are a danger as we no. but giving some one a 243 on open is scary stuff when they havent handled a rifle before

 

It all depends on the circumstances of the individual case as to what will be authorised. The other poster is basically right in what he says in that the bottom line is that the police cannot refuse you. If you meet the statutory criteria the police must issue the certificate - they have no choice. It's complicated a bit by the fact that there is no mechanism in law for appealing a condition applied to a certificate but if you provide sufficient "good reason" in law then you will get what you ar asking for and you probably could get a condition changed but not through the standard sec.44 appeal procedure. If you have good reason to have an open ticket then you should be given one, quite honestly.

 

Actually, I thought that whatever condition was applied regarding land you shoot over (whether it was restricted to one piece or was open) they almost always put on the bit which allows you to use it on ranges as well. I fail to see why there would be any problwm with it as the suitability of the land is hardly in question. Thinking about it, if you had a ticket allowing you to shoot on any land you had permission on then you wouldn't even need range use to be specified on the condition because the condition allows you to shoot it on any land to begin with.

 

J.

 

yes i agree if you meet up to what they want then they cant refuse you. but to get them on open right away is very unlikely. there will prob be mentoring which after six months will more then likely be lifted. like i said rifles are very dangerous as we all no. if you havent shot them before you need to gain some shooting 1st hand. then it will put you in good postion in future

[RicW 67]

Worth bearing in mind that it is legal to shoot Muntjac and CWD with "220 centrefire" minimum 1000ft.lbs ME. Hornet does not meet the ME requirement but .223 and 22-250 are well up to spec, and your oppo would have a better chance of getting .223 on a first ticket than .243

 

For Roe you must have .243, but you also need to show that you know what you are doing, so he could go for .223 and apply for a variation later

 

Ric

Edited February 15, 2010 by RicW

[trainee 0]

Hi I just got my fac/sg through toda, when my feo came round he asked if i had any experience with rifles and shotguns which i do however if you defo need the full bore rifle and are experienced enough to control deer then why not but remember the 243 is a big round for killing muntjack i would go for a 222 as ive used and seen in action no mess what so ever

[skilly 0]

Home Office guidance

 

13.32 An applicant who wishes to shoot deer should name land which has the likelihood of the appropriate deer species being present, and an invitation, booking or authority to shoot.This is not necessary where a person already holds a deer legal rifle for an established reason. Many deer stalkers will rely on invitations to shoot on payment rather than be hired or paid to do so and may not be able to shoot regularly or frequently, though others may be permanently employed, for example, Forestry Commission staff. Hunting large animals with powerful rifles requires particular skill, and applicants should generally have some

experience of firearms.