Black eye whites

[longdog13 36]

Who gives a shit what colout their jacket is like, working ability and health is the only thing that should matter. Breed them for those reasons, not because you want something different or pretty...it is a mere step away from what the Americans are doing and it has not worked out well for them at all.

They've still not learnt though and continue to breed for dilutions and weird markings. Their ferts are considered 'old' at three years of age, many are deaf, etc.

 

Personally BEW father/daughter would be too close for me. If it was a poley mating you would likely be fine, but with BEWs you are already working with weakened genetic stock. Too much chance of something deleterious being bought up IMO. Dilution genes in ferrets are well known to go hand in hand with health problems. Even if they are not 'outwardly' deformed they still may have internal problems, such as a malabsorption of nutrients, or a shorter lifespan. The last BEW I had developed congenital eye tumours at six years of age, as did his litter mate. Put both out of their misery not long ago. The point is that some effects can not be seen until later in life and may become fixed in the line just as much as the colours you are looking for and by then it is too late.

 

For God's sake man, re-evaluate your breeding goals. You want BEWs because everyone else has 'normal' colours? To be perfectly honest that is a piss poor reason to breed. Not having a go, just being completely honest with you on this. I have a very similar opinion on lurchers as well. If people are worrying about colour then they are not worrying about the right things and have their priorities mixed up.

:clapper:

[droid 11]

Totally agree with coneytrappr and ferret tamer.

 

BEW x silver?

Someone needs to take the trouble to learn something before breeding. Age isn't an excuse. If you're too young to understand simple genetics you're too young to breed animals.

[tonyh 1]

theres line breeding then inbreeding linebreeding can produce faults as the lines the same so they hAVE THE SAME faults breeding to closely inbreeding creates the faults thats natures way of warning theres tons of ferrets up n down the country all difrent coulors and size get in what you want even just borrow a hob or buy a new jill just my opinion not an expert

 

Inbreeding does not 'create' faults as such, it simply brings the 'rubbish into view', so to speak. The traits exist, they are simply hidden. The reoccurance of certain genes [which is more likely in related animals, as they are more likely to have similar genetics] will make the traits manifest. Which is fine if you are willing to cull extremely hard to remove the deleterious traits, so that only the desired traits remain...but honestly, to do that just for colour is ridiculous.

Now if it was some trait that gave an animal a distinct working or health advantage...

Outcrossing on the other hand, because the animals likely have different genetics, will 'bury' bad traits so they won't manifest. They are still there and all, but are not 'active'.

 

But I agree with your post all in all. There's no need for this chap to be inbreeding for such trivial goals and he ought to choose a good sturdy outcross.

as a newcomer to ferreting it is great to have access to people like CONEYTRAPPER, who know their subject,ATB Edited January 9, 2010 by tonyh

[Jamie m 668]

good topic as said contact the feret rescues enuf of them im breeding this coming season as i havent had ferrets for some 17 years and the jill i have isnt how i want her an i wouldnt sell some poor kid around the block a biter shes fine for working and i as i have said love the original pole colour do need an albino for working cover but were back at genetics again if a pole comes from alitter of mixed it should produce mixed

[fresh earth 47]

simple genetics ? so you are telling me at 13 you understood the genetics of colours etc etc in ferrets :S the hob i have is over 5 i got him he was 3 and he has been here over two years he is a big ferret who works for fun hence i like him his kits will be just over 2 years old also are my best working ferrets out of 9 sorry i fancy breeding for colour and ability at the end of the day if i was breeding dark polecats trying to get them true to type it would be fine ... i cannot see how father to daughter will cause problems its how you start line breeding in dogs if it were hob back to his mother then yes it would be problems but i know that and would not do that now at the end of the day i cant get bews up here alot of people are at me wanting them so why shouldnt i breed them ? im sure dozens of folk breed saluki crosses to get the feathered ears and merle collies for the colour i was asking a simple question i know the kits should be fine i just wondered has anyone started line breeding them if so advise i know some breed for small size on here you telling me that to get them true to type they have never used two related ferrets ? come on for christ sake i ask for help and get stick because i prefer a sertain colour ? would you mary a black woman or a chinese woman if it were a white one you fancyd ? everything else is chosen in life because you like it so why should ferrets be any diff i have a albino hob works like buggery but has been blink since he was about two blind as a bat hell of a worker but i aint gonna breed him just cause he can work its handy when they can see whats picking them up they tend to know not to nip you then .

[droid 11]

simple genetics ? so you are telling me at 13 you understood the genetics of colours etc etc in ferrets

 

No I didn't.

 

And I didn't try breeding them either. The genetics of DEWs and Silvers is explained on several sites. Google 'em up.

[Coneytrappr 30]

simple genetics ? so you are telling me at 13 you understood the genetics of colours etc etc in ferrets

 

'Simple genetics' as in basic genetic theory. I had a passing knowledge from reading a few books on mouse genetics, but I did not kid myself into thinking that I knew enough to line breed colours that are known to go hand in hand with health problems.

 

 

:S the hob i have is over 5 i got him he was 3 and he has been here over two years he is a big ferret who works for fun hence i like him his kits will be just over 2 years old also are my best working ferrets out of 9

 

Everyone has their 'best' ferrets, but tthat doesn't mean they all ought to be bred. Is he also the best when stacked against all your mate's ferrets? Because if not, you have access to better stock. Most ferrets will work for fun.

 

 

sorry i fancy breeding for colour and ability at the end of the day if i was breeding dark polecats trying to get them true to type it would be fine

 

You are missing the point lad, valueing any colour over health and working ability is wrong. 'Fancying' things is not justification enough to do them. It is a weak reason.

 

 

... i cannot see how father to daughter will cause problems

 

If you can not see how a BEW/BEW cross of these relations may cause problems with the health of your animals, then you have no reason to attempt it.

 

 

its how you start line breeding in dogs if it were hob back to his mother then yes it would be problems

 

I can assure you that the development of a good line of anything has more thought put into it than what you are doing.

 

 

but i know that and would not do that now at the end of the day i cant get bews up here alot of people are at me wanting them so why shouldnt i breed them ?

 

Because they are genetically inferior and you breeding so close and with so little understanding will likely do more harm than good? Because a demand for 'colour' is not a good reason?

 

im sure dozens of folk breed saluki crosses to get the feathered ears and merle collies for the colour

 

I'm sure they do. Does that make it right? No. There are plenty of substandard lurchers being bred for 'looks', same with ferrets. It's not a good thing and you don't have to do it also.

 

 

i was asking a simple question i know the kits should be fine

 

i just wondered has anyone started line breeding them if so advise i know some breed for small size on here you telling me that to get them true to type they have never used two related ferrets ?

Plenty of people line breed, not everyone is successful. I have already explained why those colours crossed so close is a bad idea and you have simply chosen to ignore it.

 

 

come on for christ sake i ask for help and get stick because i prefer a sertain colour ?

 

No, you didn't get stick, you got honest advice. You are getting stick now because you have chosen to ignore that advice, not because you have any understanding of the topic but because you have an insufferable 'I WANT I WANT I WANT' attitude.

 

would you mary a black woman or a chinese woman if it were a white one you fancyd ?

 

I would hope that my taste in partners had more substance than their colour .

 

 

everything else is chosen in life because you like it so why should ferrets be any diff

 

'Like it' is not the reason all choices are made, kid. Many people make choices because it is the right thing to do, not because they 'like it'. If you are still at the stage of life where everything revolves around 'like' at the age of thirteen then you have some growing up to do. Lose the attitude and work on yourself before you work on breeding.

 

 

i have a albino hob works like buggery but has been blink since he was about two blind as a bat hell of a worker but i aint gonna breed him just cause he can work its handy when they can see whats picking them up they tend to know not to nip you then .

Relevance? If you are attempting to show 'maturity' and a readyness to breed by indicating that you are showing some degree of selection in your stock, try again. Blindness may be one reason why you won't be breeding your albino hob, but I'd bet you would reconsider if it was a BEW.

[The Ferret Tamer 1]

Coneytrappr you are to be applauded for your concise and clear reasoning i could not have put it better myself.

This kind of idiot the ferret world can do without.

 

 

:clapper: FT

[droid 11]

Coneytrappr you are to be applauded for your concise and clear reasoning i could not have put it better myself.

This kind of idiot the ferret world can do without.

 

 

:clapper: FT

 

Totally agree.

 

I wish I had coneytrappr's patience......

[max abell 196]

As long as my ferrets are good workers and hand tame who gives a s**t what colour they are ?

We have 11 ferts of various colours and they all work equally as good as each other this colour and eye colour thing is a nonsence

[fresh earth 47]

Ok coney trapper i have had a read and agree it is not worth the risk as for ability the ferret is a better working hob than all my mates and my brothers my brothers mate takes him out regularly when i am at school as he is good at locating rabbits sitting deep and tight up if he were blind or had any deformity then i would not under any circumstances breed him he would be kept as a pet the only reason i work the blind guy is its pitch black in the holes anyway so he wont be able to see. I dont usualy breed for colour i have always bred this hob with polecats and the odd sandy or albino and he has produced well i just thought after reading a bit about dog line breeding that it would be simular with the ferrets hence me asking on here first after reading that above i agree with you and that is what i wanted a good informative answer i was stressed out the other day sorry as my whippet had nocked his leg so i got a bit carried away with the convo .

 

Thanks grieg.

[Coneytrappr 30]

Fresh Earth I must say that I am very impressed with the maturity you have shown in that last post, far beyond what I've seen from a good number of grown men who won't listen to reason. Well done fella.

Aye keep working the blind albino, as you say there's little enough to be seen several foot underground.

You will have far better luck with the colour combinations you have mentioned having bred before, ferrets can certainly be line bred, but some colours are hard to work with and are best left alone. Same with dogs, breeding Merle to Merle will produce Double Merle pups which have hearing, sight and various other problems, whereas pups from a Merle to other colour mating will not. In many ways the BEW gene and the Merle gene are similar. All this stuff should be secondary to true ability, which is a much higher achievement.

Fair enough that you were stressed, dogs have the ability to do that, eh? All is forgiven and hope your whippet recovers without permanent damage.