FEEDING THE DOGS

[collie/grey 238]

Pups i feed on Jameswellbeloved puppy (dry food) up until 12-18 months old, then change to Jameswellbeloved adult. It's not cheap, but you get what you pay for. Never fed barf stuff, never will.

 

I agree you get out what you put in :whistle: Any particular reason you prefer dry food?

 

Yep, i feed jameswellbeloved because it is hypoallergenic, no artificial flavours, colours or preservatives and the dogs love it. Dry food is easy to store and easy to feed, i beleive and this is my opinion, that scientists have spent many years producing high quality complete feeds for dogs so there is no reason to try to do it yourself.

 

If i fed mine on the barf diet i would be to worried that i'd miss something important out of their diet. Most of my dogs wouldn't eat fruit or veg either.

 

Im not critisising anybody's ways of feeding their dogs, we all have different veiws and i'll always stick to my dry food, i'd eat it myself if i ran out of my own.

 

Preparing raw food for my lot is a daunting sounding task. :sick:

[Vermin Dropper 2]

Pork is not recommended for dogs.

 

 

Yep, i feed jameswellbeloved because it is hypoallergenic, no artificial flavours, colours or preservatives and the dogs love it. Dry food is easy to store and easy to feed, i beleive and this is my opinion, that scientists have spent many years producing high quality complete feeds for dogs so there is no reason to try to do it yourself.

 

If i fed mine on the barf diet i would be to worried that i'd miss something important out of their diet. Most of my dogs wouldn't eat fruit or veg either.

 

 

 

Come on Rainmaker......help us out,

[Rainmaker 7]

You called? Help you out indeed I will mate, your head must be springeing by now!

 

 

That better?

 

Seriously though, this thread (not the first certainly not the last) is typical of the reaction of people indoctrinated by pet food manufacturer's propaganda. I'm in the process of drafting a full scale article for the site on nutrition and feeding but pending that here's my tuppence (again) in relation to comments thus far:

 

1) You do NOT have to mess about trying to "balance" a raw diet. Whole carcase or varied bits thereof (as whole as possible), straight out the fridge/freezer or straight from the shop/butchers - chuck it to the dogs. It's as hard as that.

 

2) That boffin with a PhD might have a brain but he's still on the payroll mate. He might be an excellent chemist, but he's no biologist, zoologist or ecologist. Unfortunately you can spray on all the vitamins and rancid fats you like (funny they have to add all this vitamin stuff seeing as the ingredients are so "wholesome"?), it's still crap in a bag.

 

3) Processed manufactured food, as created by your boffin at £13 a sack (only £9 for the same stuff here but anyway...) will undeniably facilitate the development of periodontal disease in your animals (see all my previous posts for references, sources and proof, I'm sick of having to re-type them!).

 

4) Periodontal disease WILL erode the bone structure of the jaw, and WILL slowly poison your dogs' internal organs sight unseen leading to auto-immune disease (like those 'old' middle aged dogs nowadays all stiff with arthritis), organ failure and death to name a tiny fraction of the implications.

 

5) 85% or more of dogs over three years old fed processed foods (kibble, canned, sausages, mince morsels, "barf mince") have periodontal disease at a level warranting surgical intervention. This figure rises to 100% of dogs fed processed food as the age rises. In dogs fed raw meaty bones and carcases (not barf mince), this figure is zero, or very nearly zero.

 

6) Dogs fed whole carcases and/or raw meaty bones don't have this problem and live a long healthy life. So-called dog breath (actually a symptom of periodontal disease and not a natural state at all in a healthy dog), greasy/flaky skin, recurrent ear infections, scouring, copious sloppy brown turds (don't say "my dog gets X brand and his turds are fine - trust me compared to raw they're at least three times too big and smelly!)... none of these exist in the raw dog.

 

We have dogs now classified as 'old' at 7 or 8 upwards. Heck they're barely middle aged really. It's become the norm to believe that dogs SHOULD have "dog breath", that it's "normal" for them to need regular scaling and polishing at the vets (for the lucky ones who actually HAVE oral exams), and that great sloppy turds are the correct state of affairs.

 

Pet food manufacturers have long had propaganda down to a fine art, aided in no small part by the vets. By misinforming the public and planting these untruths and lies in front of the average Joe (who is more than willing to believe 'boffins'), they are raking it in all the way to the bank, while their friends the vets make an extra buck on treating your animal after commercial dog food made it sick in the first place.

 

Don't believe me? Ask your vet how long they spent at vet school being taught nutrition, and by whom they were taught. Invariably the answer is "one day max - pet food company rep". What does that tell you? They get free dog kibble from the sponsoring company for their uni, and only access to company reps as their source of knowledge. Hell even the BSAVA's manual on companion animal nutrition is written by the head of public relations for MARS Corporation/Pedigree!

 

Do you really think their advice is "Don't buy our stuff, feed raw meaty bones"? Or would it be "feed this crap, fill our pockets, and when our food hurts your dog (which it will - their own admission!) we can sell you some extra, more expensive stuff, to fix a deficiency we said didn't occur in the first place".

 

Ever wondered why "Complete & Balanced" foods need to be replaced with "Dental", "Low Sugar" "Low Salt" "Low Protein" etc once the damage is done? If the original foods were so appropriate for the dogs in the first place there would be no need to alter the diet at all. So much for 100% complete and balanced.

 

Pedigree's own vet, Dr Scott Miller, admits in Pedigree's own propaganda (albeit inadvertently no doubt) that Pedigree and other dry/canned foods lead to the development of periodontal disease and early death, and the way to prevent this happening is to feed RMBs and carcases.

 

Unfortunately, says Dr Miller, we don't feed RMBs and carcases we feed from a bowl - and therefore need to take even further action to remedy the periodontal disease and systemic poisoning facilitated by manufactured processes foods. If that's what their own vet front-man is saying, imagine which bits they DONT want you to hear!

 

Anyway I could go on, just wanted to address the myth that it's hard to "balance" a raw diet. No such balancing needed. Further, to smash the misconception planted by pet food manufacturers that their "boffins" create healthy meals for your dog. Their own advertising admits this isn't the case - check out the "85% of dogs over 3 and fed manufactured food have periodontal disease" label on their ridiculous DentaStix packets.

 

No need to go on. I'm certainly not going to flame you for feeding kibble - it's your choice. Just wanted to lay to rest the misconceptions and untruths about raw feeding.

 

Cheers,

 

Lee

[Guest JOEB]

Well........there you have it!

Cracking post Lee

JOEB

[Simoman 110]

You called? Help you out indeed I will mate, your head must be springeing by now!

 

 

That better?

 

Seriously though, this thread (not the first certainly not the last) is typical of the reaction of people indoctrinated by pet food manufacturer's propaganda. I'm in the process of drafting a full scale article for the site on nutrition and feeding but pending that here's my tuppence (again) in relation to comments thus far:

 

1) You do NOT have to mess about trying to "balance" a raw diet. Whole carcase or varied bits thereof (as whole as possible), straight out the fridge/freezer or straight from the shop/butchers - chuck it to the dogs. It's as hard as that.

 

2) That boffin with a PhD might have a brain but he's still on the payroll mate. He might be an excellent chemist, but he's no biologist, zoologist or ecologist. Unfortunately you can spray on all the vitamins and rancid fats you like (funny they have to add all this vitamin stuff seeing as the ingredients are so "wholesome"?), it's still crap in a bag.

 

3) Processed manufactured food, as created by your boffin at £13 a sack (only £9 for the same stuff here but anyway...) will undeniably facilitate the development of periodontal disease in your animals (see all my previous posts for references, sources and proof, I'm sick of having to re-type them!).

 

4) Periodontal disease WILL erode the bone structure of the jaw, and WILL slowly poison your dogs' internal organs sight unseen leading to auto-immune disease (like those 'old' middle aged dogs nowadays all stiff with arthritis), organ failure and death to name a tiny fraction of the implications.

 

5) 85% or more of dogs over three years old fed processed foods (kibble, canned, sausages, mince morsels, "barf mince") have periodontal disease at a level warranting surgical intervention. This figure rises to 100% of dogs fed processed food as the age rises. In dogs fed raw meaty bones and carcases (not barf mince), this figure is zero, or very nearly zero.

 

6) Dogs fed whole carcases and/or raw meaty bones don't have this problem and live a long healthy life. So-called dog breath (actually a symptom of periodontal disease and not a natural state at all in a healthy dog), greasy/flaky skin, recurrent ear infections, scouring, copious sloppy brown turds (don't say "my dog gets X brand and his turds are fine - trust me compared to raw they're at least three times too big and smelly!)... none of these exist in the raw dog.

 

We have dogs now classified as 'old' at 7 or 8 upwards. Heck they're barely middle aged really. It's become the norm to believe that dogs SHOULD have "dog breath", that it's "normal" for them to need regular scaling and polishing at the vets (for the lucky ones who actually HAVE oral exams), and that great sloppy turds are the correct state of affairs.

 

Pet food manufacturers have long had propaganda down to a fine art, aided in no small part by the vets. By misinforming the public and planting these untruths and lies in front of the average Joe (who is more than willing to believe 'boffins'), they are raking it in all the way to the bank, while their friends the vets make an extra buck on treating your animal after commercial dog food made it sick in the first place.

 

Don't believe me? Ask your vet how long they spent at vet school being taught nutrition, and by whom they were taught. Invariably the answer is "one day max - pet food company rep". What does that tell you? They get free dog kibble from the sponsoring company for their uni, and only access to company reps as their source of knowledge. Hell even the BSAVA's manual on companion animal nutrition is written by the head of public relations for MARS Corporation/Pedigree!

 

Do you really think their advice is "Don't buy our stuff, feed raw meaty bones"? Or would it be "feed this crap, fill our pockets, and when our food hurts your dog (which it will - their own admission!) we can sell you some extra, more expensive stuff, to fix a deficiency we said didn't occur in the first place".

 

Ever wondered why "Complete & Balanced" foods need to be replaced with "Dental", "Low Sugar" "Low Salt" "Low Protein" etc once the damage is done? If the original foods were so appropriate for the dogs in the first place there would be no need to alter the diet at all. So much for 100% complete and balanced.

 

Pedigree's own vet, Dr Scott Miller, admits in Pedigree's own propaganda (albeit inadvertently no doubt) that Pedigree and other dry/canned foods lead to the development of periodontal disease and early death, and the way to prevent this happening is to feed RMBs and carcases.

 

Unfortunately, says Dr Miller, we don't feed RMBs and carcases we feed from a bowl - and therefore need to take even further action to remedy the periodontal disease and systemic poisoning facilitated by manufactured processes foods. If that's what their own vet front-man is saying, imagine which bits they DONT want you to hear!

 

Anyway I could go on, just wanted to address the myth that it's hard to "balance" a raw diet. No such balancing needed. Further, to smash the misconception planted by pet food manufacturers that their "boffins" create healthy meals for your dog. Their own advertising admits this isn't the case - check out the "85% of dogs over 3 and fed manufactured food have periodontal disease" label on their ridiculous DentaStix packets.

 

No need to go on. I'm certainly not going to flame you for feeding kibble - it's your choice. Just wanted to lay to rest the misconceptions and untruths about raw feeding.

 

Cheers,

 

Lee

 

[bigdazz 0]

i think what i pay for a box of 40 1lb blocks of beef/tripe mix is cheap £12.50 i just add some veg 2 or 3 times a week and some raw meaty bones.i dont think its hard or two time consuming to do this not when you think what my dogs do for me

[jessdale 416]

Another great post LEE .I totaly agree with you about not having to feed veg with the RMB diet.My mate has 57 couple of hounds in kennels and he never feeds kiwi fruit or pak-choi :11: .Here is a picture of my 11 week old pat pup eating his RMB.jessdale

Edited September 25, 2006 by jessdale

[Rainmaker 7]

Hi Jessdale,

 

GREAT picture mate!

[socks 32,253]

start them on it young ..........

 

 

 

[ferreterno1 0]

meat it is then, thanks lads has anyone ever heard of that chicken and rice stuuf or not? he didnt say it was a biscuit so im not sure what it is.

[foxlamper 5]

dr john i like to use

[Nipper 0]

My mate is a vet and he advocates the romantic idea of the BARF or RMB diets. What does he feed his dogs? The freebie samples dropped off by the Science Plan Sales Rep...

 

It is true that vets do very little studying of nutrition, but also true that the boffins know what is going to enhance performance in running dogs as their business depends on it. Eg Red Mills.

 

The hard and fast of it is that it doesn't matter about longevity in running dogs as their natural speed wanes around the four year mark plus anyway.

 

Some people don't have kennels and it isn't appropriate to have lumps of flesh hanging about attracting flies. What about the costs, availability, fighting over bones, contamination of food and surfaces in feeding areas and storage space?

 

No offence and I understand your viewpoints, however I'm sticking to my Working Supadog!!!

[Rainmaker 7]

My mate is a vet and he advocates the romantic idea of the BARF or RMB diets. What does he feed his dogs? The freebie samples dropped off by the Science Plan Sales Rep...

 

It is true that vets do very little studying of nutrition, but also true that the boffins know what is going to enhance performance in running dogs as their business depends on it. Eg Red Mills.

 

The hard and fast of it is that it doesn't matter about longevity in running dogs as their natural speed wanes around the four year mark plus anyway.

 

Some people don't have kennels and it isn't appropriate to have lumps of flesh hanging about attracting flies. What about the costs, availability, fighting over bones, contamination of food and surfaces in feeding areas and storage space?

 

No offence and I understand your viewpoints, however I'm sticking to my Working Supadog!!!

 

My, my, my, my, my. Where to start with this one? LOL

 

Your mate is a confusing one - understanding the implication of commercial dog food in disease development, but not bothering to follow his own advice and feed a healthy (rather than disease inducing) diet!

 

Must admit (and maybe it's just me) I found the whole "it doesn't matter about longevity in running dogs" alarming and frankly a little disgusting. Hey, who cares if they are in constant pain, their teeth are rotting out and they are devloping renal failure, heart problems and other ills. Who gives one so long as they're running the race and bringing some money/noteriety in

 

Most people would think that longevity matters very much in our working and pet dogs. I don't see how or why racing people should use the excuse that they can't run the same after four years so sod it let's feed them crap and knock them on the head or leave them to rot once they stop winning. That really is using dogs as a money making tool instead of as a valued worker/pet.

 

As for costs, sourcing, provision, not having kennels, fights etc... First of all it's WAY cheaper to feed raw than kibble. Sourcing is as easy as speaking to the local butchers and abattoirs. I don't have kennels either but I never have a problem with flies etc - I simply freeze the bones/carcases and feed one at a time. I don't see why you need to have animal parts "lying around" to attract flies etc? The dogs seem to do a good (and fairly quick) enough job of shifting what IS lying around, before the flies even get a look in.

 

It also helps in this aspect to feed the RMBs still frozen.

 

Fighting I never had a problem with - they are used to eating as a pack, or individually. No issue because I'm the alpha in my pack and they do what I say or look out! No fighting allowed. Jostling for position, taking precedence according to rank (older dog eats first) etc, I have no problem with - that's not fighting that's dogs!

 

Contamination imho is no more an issue than with keeping dogs in general. So long as you feed them somewhere washable (either a kennel run or a shower room/crate/whatever) there's nothing to worry about.

 

The boffins do make their money on selling dog food, including greyhound food, but that doesn't make it good stuff. See above (previous post).

 

So much more could be said, and fair play you say no offence etc - same applies here. Just a discussion so I hope nothing comes across personally. Stick with SupaDog by all means, but just be aware that you're storing up trouble for later, unfortunately.

 

Cheers,

 

Lee

[pluckers son 0]

i feed my 9 week old bullx pup iams dry food and her poos are bad,there very dark brown and sloppy

 

if i swap to raw chicken and fruit and veg will its poo get better?

 

 

where do you guys get the chicken mince from...and how much is it

 

the iams i use is £10.00 for 3kg...very dear but i want the best for my dog.

 

ps this is my first running dog so point my in the right direction plz

[Guest JOEB]

Nipper, you have got your view and you are entitled to that mate, but I am sorry, your mates a DICK of the first order.

Hes knows its shite, but the tite c**t would rather an early death for the dog than part up with all the sheckles he robs from joe soaps like us

Wanker!

Not having a go at you Nipper, just your pal.

JOEB