Low standards...... too low

[Cleanspade 3,322]

one of the biggest problems in the working terrier world in my opinion is standards that are set are to high. no wonder there are divides in the fieldsports world.

WHAT BOLLOCK'S.Standard to high if standard's were kept high the working terrier(digging dog's) would'nt be in such a mess/ decline and full of 3/4 charlie's a year shit and the 30 plus show's a year shit(it quit but he look's good and can bolt a fox and can win alot of show's)or in the case of other's look at me i want to be famous and the dig's are 2 foot deep BUT THERE THE BUSINESS or the other's that breed off shit because a made name SAID IT'S THE BOLLOCK'S BUT WAS'NT.reading between the line's thought the original post started was a about 100%digging dog's and how stand's are low......too low(which in reading this thread they are).read a post on here posted from jonsey(summed it up to a tee)THERE'S those's that have a high high standard and those that are happy with anything that look's good, most these day's are happy to have a looker that can spend all summer in the ring but only 3/4 days in the field doing rat rabbit and a few fox'es .now off to barbados for three week'S,happy hunting and a happy new year to all

 

your entitled to your veiw but i am of the opinion that you can ask to much of a terrier. and a lot of folk do just this. resulting in the waste of good terriers.

one mans good terrier is another mans shite. and what you want from a dog will differ from what another terrierman would want. i have no problem with that so why should they. of course someone can have standards that are to low. but they can also have standards that are to high and ask to much of a terrier. or any other working dog.

asd for your comment on me keeping plummers. ive kept them for three years. and other terriers for thirty

[MOO 730]

one of the biggest problems in the working terrier world in my opinion is standards that are set are to high. no wonder there are divides in the fieldsports world.

WHAT BOLLOCK'S.Standard to high if standard's were kept high the working terrier(digging dog's) would'nt be in such a mess/ decline and full of 3/4 charlie's a year shit and the 30 plus show's a year shit(it quit but he look's good and can bolt a fox and can win alot of show's)or in the case of other's look at me i want to be famous and the dig's are 2 foot deep BUT THERE THE BUSINESS or the other's that breed off shit because a made name SAID IT'S THE BOLLOCK'S BUT WAS'NT.reading between the line's thought the original post started was a about 100%digging dog's and how stand's are low......too low(which in reading this thread they are).read a post on here posted from jonsey(summed it up to a tee)THERE'S those's that have a high high standard and those that are happy with anything that look's good, most these day's are happy to have a looker that can spend all summer in the ring but only 3/4 days in the field doing rat rabbit and a few fox'es .now off to barbados for three week'S,happy hunting and a happy new year to all

I have to agree everyone has differant standard but there will be very few men breeding of dogs and bitches that are really worth breeding from ....and there will be very few men give there dogs enough work to realy test them to see if they are justifiable to breed from AND THATS A FACT .

THE ££££££ HAS SPOILT BOTH THE LURCHER AND TERRIER WORLD

[MOO 730]

one of the biggest problems in the working terrier world in my opinion is standards that are set are to high. no wonder there are divides in the fieldsports world.

WHAT BOLLOCK'S.Standard to high if standard's were kept high the working terrier(digging dog's) would'nt be in such a mess/ decline and full of 3/4 charlie's a year shit and the 30 plus show's a year shit(it quit but he look's good and can bolt a fox and can win alot of show's)or in the case of other's look at me i want to be famous and the dig's are 2 foot deep BUT THERE THE BUSINESS or the other's that breed off shit because a made name SAID IT'S THE BOLLOCK'S BUT WAS'NT.reading between the line's thought the original post started was a about 100%digging dog's and how stand's are low......too low(which in reading this thread they are).read a post on here posted from jonsey(summed it up to a tee)THERE'S those's that have a high high standard and those that are happy with anything that look's good, most these day's are happy to have a looker that can spend all summer in the ring but only 3/4 days in the field doing rat rabbit and a few fox'es .now off to barbados for three week'S,happy hunting and a happy new year to all

I have to agree everyone has differant standard but there will be very few men breeding of dogs and bitches that are really worth breeding from ....and there will be very few men give there dogs enough work to realy test them to see if they are justifiable to breed from AND THATS A FACT .

THE ££££££ HAS SPOILT BOTH THE LURCHER AND TERRIER WORLD

Clean spade I have to disagree imo you have to realy test your dog especially when it comes to useing them for breedding whether its a terrier or lurcher ....but your right about over testing a dog there is a very fine line there but thats where being a good dog man comes into it and knowing how far you can take a dog ...but when you realy test a dog and it gives it its all and does its graft these are the dogs that should be bred from and how many lads on here hands on there heart can say there dogs are 100% worth breeding from ?

[MOO 730]

one of the biggest problems in the working terrier world in my opinion is standards that are set are to high. no wonder there are divides in the fieldsports world.

WHAT BOLLOCK'S.Standard to high if standard's were kept high the working terrier(digging dog's) would'nt be in such a mess/ decline and full of 3/4 charlie's a year shit and the 30 plus show's a year shit(it quit but he look's good and can bolt a fox and can win alot of show's)or in the case of other's look at me i want to be famous and the dig's are 2 foot deep BUT THERE THE BUSINESS or the other's that breed off shit because a made name SAID IT'S THE BOLLOCK'S BUT WAS'NT.reading between the line's thought the original post started was a about 100%digging dog's and how stand's are low......too low(which in reading this thread they are).read a post on here posted from jonsey(summed it up to a tee)THERE'S those's that have a high high standard and those that are happy with anything that look's good, most these day's are happy to have a looker that can spend all summer in the ring but only 3/4 days in the field doing rat rabbit and a few fox'es .now off to barbados for three week'S,happy hunting and a happy new year to all

I have to agree everyone has differant standard but there will be very few men breeding of dogs and bitches that are really worth breeding from ....and there will be very few men give there dogs enough work to realy test them to see if they are justifiable to breed from AND THATS A FACT .

THE ££££££ HAS SPOILT BOTH THE LURCHER AND TERRIER WORLD

Clean spade I have to disagree imo you have to realy test your dog especially when it comes to useing them for breedding whether its a terrier or lurcher ....but your right about over testing a dog there is a very fine line there but thats where being a good dog man comes into it and knowing how far you can take a dog ...but when you realy test a dog and it gives it its all and does its graft these are the dogs that should be bred from and how many lads on here hands on there heart can say there dogs are 100% worth breeding from ?

and you say that people ask too much of there dogs imo most people ask too little

[jackard 36]

simlpe £££ greed .. i learnt the pigeon racing game fom my grandad and my dad - i applied the same methods to terriers breed tight best to the best keep or cull . i went into show pigeons same again why sell stuff that could beat you .. my grandad once said dont kid yourself if its crap its crap ..i could of made a fortune selling pups when i was big into terrier shows during the 80s .i`ve seen terriers change hands for silly money because whatever it is show or work people seem to want instant success - supply and demand.. you`ll find good honest terrier men that keep half a dozen terriers that go about what they do without anynoe knowing it men that dont give a feck about being a name ..

 

your grandads a wise man. good topic enjoyed the read

 

atb jackard

[shovel 160]

HH,Ur away off the mark saying that the standard of working terrier is low.From my experience of Terrier men,the ones that talk the most,usually are the ones that keep and breed shit and are only in it for the easy money.The true honest TERRIERMEN work in close tight groups,keep their terriers and themselves to themselves.Alot of trust has to be built up before u would be invited out for a dig and rightly so! To be honest if a person is genuine and hardworking enough it is easy enough to come in contact with these true honest TERRIERMEN, and it would not be long before u would see genune honest terriers. IF u were invited out then and asked one of these men to work their dogs again,thats the last time u would be out U said in ur post that over 15yrs ur stock has weakened,does this mean that ye kept on breeding from stock that was not 100% digging dogs. As we ourselves breed a litter every year that would be 15 litters and nobody would have clicked on that something wasnt right.

[hungry hunter 0]

I cant see that setting standards high is a problem. If you dont set it high its only a matter of time that failure will trip you up. I havent named anyone and i wouldnt on a public place like this, but yes if i felt someone was talking up a reputation for a dog rather than earning that reputation well then yes i would and have told these people to their face. When i travel to see these dogs i'm having a private interview with the dog to see if he might be the next stud dog. Most of the time i find that their not. I'm not lying to anyone, just putting it into words as i see it.

Back to when i said that the majority of people that will read this will most likely have low standards and not even realise it, why get upset. if you get upset over this then you must think i'm talking about you. Dont read into it too much, i might be wrong.

The 10-15 year story, lets say ten as the last five were the slow down years. The dog that produced the xblood pups was not given the credit. another dog was falsely given the credit. The xblood pups were bred backwards and forwards with the wrong dog (the wrong dog could produce, but not to the standard we thought we were after). The xblood was starting to thin out but once and a while the xblood pup would be lined with a quarter xblood pup strengthening the blood again. We did not know at the time so the wrong dog still got the credit. And so the snowball grew. When the truth came out in the end, alliances were severed and alot of hard work thrown out the window.

Dont get me wrong, when i asked where have all the honest dog men gone, i'm not physically seeking them. it was more of a statement than a question.

[the_stig 6,614]

some good posts - i`ve been in the terrier game for 30 year i could do a show next year anywhere in the country even on my own door step and 3 or 4 people would know me - i dig within a small group of good honest lads - between us we could put together 20 good digging dogs that would win shows aswell - whr happy with our lot and dnt feel the need to tell the whole world about - gone are the days when you could take a smashed up dog to shows and sell a van load of pups off the back of it.. thrs good dogs and good lads out thr - the terrier game proberbley at the best its been for a long time - anyone new to the game these days get yourself signed up to the fmwtc or nwtf talk to people before you buy- so many new lads rush into buying a dog without doing thr homework ..

 

 

[Attack Fell Terrier 864]

TO BE HONEST I THINK YOUR LIVING IN CLOUD 9,IF YOU THINK THE STANDARD OF TERRIER WORK HAS DROPPED, AND LADS OUT THERE DONT HAVE A GOOD LINE, GUYS LIKE YOUR SELF TEND TO HANG AROUND IN COMPANY WITH GUYS THAT THINK THE SAME AND DO THE SAME. IF A GUY TAKES YOU TO THE COUNRTY TO DIG A GOOD WORKING TERRIER AND THE DOG IS DUG, AND THEN YOU ASK HIM TO DIG HIM AGAIN AND AGAIN, IT SHOWS YOU WOULD NOT KNOW A GOOD DOG IF IT BIT YOU IN THE ASS, READING YOUR POST IT LOOKS LIKE YOUR THE VICTIM OF BUYING USELESS DOGS / PUPS. YOU BE BETTER OFF SPENDING YOUR MONEY ON PETROL AND GETTING OUT DOING SOME DIGGING, THAT GIVING IT TO D. H., IT BEATS ME WHY OR HOW PEOPLE GET UP-SET ABOUT OTHER PEOPLES DOGS, OR OTHER PEOPLES STANDARDS.

 

 

Bang on!

 

Breeding for nothing other than a few quid and lying to people is one thing, and is wrong. But if someone has got a dog that suites them, but wouldn't suite some others and they use that dog to breed from for themselves, then that's their business IMO. So long as they're not telling lies to anyone just to sell pups I'm not interested in what they do with their dogs in all honesty, as its their business, not mine.

 

If I ever need a dog/pup then it can be sorted out between the people that I've got to know, with dogs that I have seen work and who I can trust.

[Attack Fell Terrier 864]

some good posts - i`ve been in the terrier game for 30 year i could do a show next year anywhere in the country even on my own door step and 3 or 4 people would know me - i dig within a small group of good honest lads - between us we could put together 20 good digging dogs that would win shows aswell - whr happy with our lot and dnt feel the need to tell the whole world about - gone are the days when you could take a smashed up dog to shows and sell a van load of pups off the back of it.. thrs good dogs and good lads out thr - the terrier game proberbley at the best its been for a long time - anyone new to the game these days get yourself signed up to the fmwtc or nwtf talk to people before you buy- so many new lads rush into buying a dog without doing thr homework ..

 

[Cleanspade 3,322]

TO BE HONEST I THINK YOUR LIVING IN CLOUD 9,IF YOU THINK THE STANDARD OF TERRIER WORK HAS DROPPED, AND LADS OUT THERE DONT HAVE A GOOD LINE, GUYS LIKE YOUR SELF TEND TO HANG AROUND IN COMPANY WITH GUYS THAT THINK THE SAME AND DO THE SAME. IF A GUY TAKES YOU TO THE COUNRTY TO DIG A GOOD WORKING TERRIER AND THE DOG IS DUG, AND THEN YOU ASK HIM TO DIG HIM AGAIN AND AGAIN, IT SHOWS YOU WOULD NOT KNOW A GOOD DOG IF IT BIT YOU IN THE ASS, READING YOUR POST IT LOOKS LIKE YOUR THE VICTIM OF BUYING USELESS DOGS / PUPS. YOU BE BETTER OFF SPENDING YOUR MONEY ON PETROL AND GETTING OUT DOING SOME DIGGING, THAT GIVING IT TO D. H., IT BEATS ME WHY OR HOW PEOPLE GET UP-SET ABOUT OTHER PEOPLES DOGS, OR OTHER PEOPLES STANDARDS.

 

 

Bang on!

 

Breeding for nothing other than a few quid and lying to people is one thing, and is wrong. But if someone has got a dog that suites them, but wouldn't suite some others and they use that dog to breed from for themselves, then that's their business IMO. So long as they're not telling lies to anyone just to sell pups I'm not interested in what they do with their dogs in all honesty, as its their business, not mine.

 

If I ever need a dog/pup then it can be sorted out between the people that I've got to know, with dogs that I have seen work and who I can trust.

 

[jarhead 8]

good post H H. I had a similair thing happen to me. I kept and worked old Nuttal lines for a number of yrs. When the line became to tight [bad mouths ect] I went back to Brian, and used one of his stud dogs [Miner] on 2 of my best bitchs, first gen was just ok, but after that it was all down hill all the way. The dogs lost gameness as well as size, and bitches came very small, no good for big earths. Now I would'nt touch Miner blood, but was it Brians falt, no probably mine as I should have done my homework better, and found the right dog.

[dmick 22]

Cloud nine? maybe. I'm sure there are some decent lines around p***y. The people i hang around with have had, over the last 15 years, some of the best single handed dogs you could wish to work over. But one fundemental fault that accured at the begining of this ten - fifteen year spate of serious dogs is that the wrong sire got the credit due to a dishonest man. So after the blood of great workers slowly got thinned down to the water we have at the minute, by using the dishonest mans blood (dont get me wrong, his dog was excellent too, but not the Xblood) we ended up with substandard stock. So breeding from what was left was a waste of time.

So after hearing about great dogs from guys boasting and breeding from, i decided to check them out. One dig p***y is no grounds that i myself would judge a dog on. If a dog is mad fresh he can work a treat but quickly go back to his true colours afterwards. That is why i like to see a couple of digs. One today and one to the same quality tomorrow is fine.

I'm not cutting at anyone that i have not met, only the men and dogs i have seen and creating a survey in my minds eye of the rest of the country.

about 25yrs ago there was a good dog given out on trial they dug him four days on the trot he was a hard dog he walked out on the fifth they gave him back as a heap of shite these were so called geninue terriermen of there time

[howard 0]

Keep your dogs well, keep you standards high but most of all enjoy it.

[MISTY 11]

good post H H. I had a similair thing happen to me. I kept and worked old Nuttal lines for a number of yrs. When the line became to tight [bad mouths ect] I went back to Brian, and used one of his stud dogs [Miner] on 2 of my best bitchs, first gen was just ok, but after that it was all down hill all the way. The dogs lost gameness as well as size, and bitches came very small, no good for big earths. Now I would'nt touch Miner blood, but was it Brians falt, no probably mine as I should have done my homework better, and found the right dog.

So after the first gen what dog did you use on your bitches ? and what were your bitches bred outa ?