The Working Border Terrier Club

[Cleanspade 3,324]

but the gene pool is not small so keep it true WORKING Border to WORKING Border if you did this lads will say if it was not for the pats or lakies blood lines in them thay would not work if you look around and be honest only a few good working blood lines of pats and lakies out there so keep it true

 

 

if dogs have to be at least five season vets. and off borders of a similar background. bitches off a working pedigree also. then the gene pool is small that isnt even debatable.

 

a border terrier dog that is worth breeding off is generally a hard animal and if worked regular for five seasons a large persentage wouldnt make it to the stud page.

 

if a club like this has the working border foremost. it will use outcross blood for the sake of the breed it would also give serious consideration to coming away from the KC. AND IT WOULD DEFINATELY CAP PRICES. this in itself would drive the finacial minded owners away. .. many would say that alone would improve the lot of working borders. i like the breed and have seen some work and they are a decent dog and would love to be able to be proved wronge but i feel if these steps arnt given serious thought. its just pie in the sky.

 

i await a sensible reply. from proper working border enthusiasts

[The Breeder 156]

but the gene pool is not small so keep it true WORKING Border to WORKING Border if you did this lads will say if it was not for the pats or lakies blood lines in them thay would not work if you look around and be honest only a few good working blood lines of pats and lakies out there so keep it true

 

 

if dogs have to be at least five season vets. and off borders of a similar background. bitches off a working pedigree also. then the gene pool is small that isnt even debatable.

 

a border terrier dog that is worth breeding off is generally a hard animal and if worked regular for five seasons a large persentage wouldnt make it to the stud page.

 

if a club like this has the working border foremost. it will use outcross blood for the sake of the breed it would also give serious consideration to coming away from the KC. AND IT WOULD DEFINATELY CAP PRICES. this in itself would drive the finacial minded owners away. .. many would say that alone would improve the lot of working borders. i like the breed and have seen some work and they are a decent dog and would love to be able to be proved wronge but i feel if these steps arnt given serious thought. its just pie in the sky.

 

i await a sensible reply. from proper working border enthusiasts

sorry i ment 5 years old what would you use for a outcross ?

[Cleanspade 3,324]

a good wellbred strain of working terrier. with strong border influance. as borders are afterall the base stock of many lines. thats if an outcross was deemed nessesary. again i'd like to wish the club every success. its a very interesting venture

 

there are also many unregistered working borders around that would swell the genepool

Edited August 21, 2009 by Cleanspade

[Guest ghostinthedarkness]

You'd have more success saving the javan rhino i'd expect than the working border.. but all the best with it though.

[shovel 160]

fairplay to u john. all the best with the club

[Buch 145]

Are many Borders kept abroad? Is there any workin strains in the States or in Europe? European strains always seem to be much less adversly affected by the showing scene and the differant prey species available would surly provide a good base to inject more blood if the gene pool is to small.

[waidmann 105]

i am all for any WORKING club( irrespective of breed) and find that the selective breeding of stock can be best done through working tests/trials.

we are talking of an all rounder,not just a digging dog. the idea of catologging the dogs int catagorys is not bad.you can get a dog for what YOU want.

 

how will dogs be tested? by whom?

alot of prep needed.

i have been a member of teckel and jagdterrier clubs in the past and find that both clubs work very well,without too much beurocracy.

i would support a club for the working dogs,for the working men! a decent fee for joining( will it be managed on ten pounds? posting of letters etc?)

is a good start.

not meaning to sound negative,i find the idea very good.

i know a few lads who work borders( i don't have one myself) both in germany and in the midlands( shropshire) who i have told about this club and who were positive to the idea.

i wish you all the best with the venture and hope it stays real and true to the founding seed.

top effort and all the best.

[The Breeder 156]

a good wellbred strain of working terrier. with strong border influance. as borders are afterall the base stock of many lines. thats if an outcross was deemed nessesary. again i'd like to wish the club every success. its a very interesting venture

 

there are also many unregistered working borders around that would swell the genepool

I do not understand I know of 4 good working border digging dogs all 5yrs or over dogs that will stay till dug to ONE stud dog can line 100s of bitchs lads will have to travel to line their bitchs keep the BORDER TRUE

[Guest dee mac]

its a good thing what you are doing mate but the price of the borders is that if you pay 4oo for your dogs and they do the digging well you still want ya money back for the pups.i dont ca\re who says what ive worked borders for years and they have all proved themselves and my pups were the same price as the parents what i paid which was 350 a pup and i wasnt stuck with a pup because theb people who bought them new they grafted.but you do get the peoplke who just want to earn a quick buck and mine were k.cd to.

absolute fcuking sh1t talk if all border onwers think like this muppet then you s are beat before yous start .the genuine lads will have proper digging dogs standing in there kennells proably given too them by like minded dog men and i ll bet not one of them is a border.to save the border things have to change ie forget money .quick question lurchers if you give 400 for a good bitch and you breed her and she has 5 pups why not just charge a 100 a pup your still a 100 quid up on price of original bitch thats your money back dont think so you muppet pound sign s rock your boat

here we go arse wipe you dont no me dickhead so do even go down that road.i sold border pups years agofor 40 quid a pup to get people started in the breed and when i bred a litter it was for my own use dickhead.the same arseholes i sold the pups to once the price of borders went up they even charged me what they were asking dont forget i got them into the breed.thats when i noticed there is no mate in the dog world when it comes to buying pups but like a mug i still either give them away or sell them for next to nowt.but like i said if i pay 400 a pup yes i want my money back ive probably dug to my borders than you have had hot dinners so do judge people that you dont no,[prick]

if you ve dug your borders more than i ve had hot dinners then your the man to start this club .they should base the future of the border on your dogs as they seem to be real grafters from what your saying . now you dont fcuking know me but what i do know is your a retard your talking there about giving pups away to people but then they charged you full price for a pup .if they stick there hand in the fire do you do the same .plus if your breeding borders this years why you having to buy pups of people you sold dogs too ?i no why because your a fcuking DUMMY.

[Cleanspade 3,324]

a good wellbred strain of working terrier. with strong border influance. as borders are afterall the base stock of many lines. thats if an outcross was deemed nessesary. again i'd like to wish the club every success. its a very interesting venture

 

there are also many unregistered working borders around that would swell the genepool

I do not understand I know of 4 good working border digging dogs all 5yrs or over dogs that will stay till dug to ONE stud dog can line 100s of bitchs lads will have to travel to line their bitchs keep the BORDER TRUE

 

heres the thing if there are a few like yourself. then the breed may not be as bad as it is thought to be. here's my thoughts how many of the five are producers. some borders are slow to start so say averasge two years to start three seasons to evaluate. all goes well and a dog is ready for stud. finds a decent bitch of say four years old with two good seasons. and then to get pups working to a degree say three years.

 

an average working border stud worth using to further the breed would be over eight going by the thoughts put forward up to now.

 

my own thoughts would be to breed to the lines known to produce the goods and to try to widen the working genepool. whilst making the effort to encourage young hunters to take on the breed and older hunters to go back to the breed.

how many of the five working stud dogs are closely related. and are they registered terriers?

 

like i say good luck with it . but to stay pure and registered and i think its a real big job and probably impossible

[Guest MADRA DUBH]

]I do not understand I know of 4 good working border digging dogs all 5yrs or over dogs that will stay till dug to ONE stud dog can line 100s of bitchs lads will have to travel to line their bitchs keep the BORDER TRUE

For the record im a big border fan and would like nothing better than to see this being a success, you say you know of 4 good border dogs ,you are right 1 border dog can cover hunderds of bitches , but surely its bitches that have worked to a high standard that are more important ,and also a good dog or bitch may or may not produce good pups ,id still say its a big ask but wish it all the best

[jarhead 8]

I do not understand I know of 4 good working border digging dogs all 5yrs or over dogs that will stay till dug to ONE stud dog can line 100s of bitchs lads will have to travel to line their bitchs keep the BORDER TRUE

 

tell me breeder, do you dig to your borders week in week out, and how many digs would you say your borders

would have before they were tested enough to be bred from.

[hue jeers 6]

Are many Borders kept abroad?

 

Yes mate there are and believe it or not, they are of the same standard, if not better than our own as they can use them for hunting Badger legally.

 

The people I know of are also meticulous in their record keeping and very stringent in their standards and test's.

 

Whether anyone like's Borders or not, it is an admirable thing that the original poster is attempting.

[burrowman 6]

I fully agree The Breeder, it is not an option to outcross to other terrier breeds we must preserve the characteristics of the border and remain true to type. If the gene pool is too small in G.B. then hopefully this club will bring together working border owners from all over the world, theres a few here in Ireland, i remember a feature on borders workin badger in Finland, Digaman has seen 40 borders at earthdog trials in Hungary so perhaps the border is not a lost cause yet.

To Cleanspade you have some very good points but if we outcross we just end up with another crossbred terrier and have to breed back to what we started with. If we breed proven working border to proven workin border there should be no need to outcross, no litter will result in 100% workers but its a start.

And please lads drop the money topic its gettin tiresome, its only is an issue with lads that work other breeds, what is your prob,this club will be for owners of workin borders and if we were prepared to pay the goin rate to get into the breed [without whingin] thats our choice not yours.

[Guest MADRA DUBH]

I fully agree The Breeder, it is not an option to outcross to other terrier breeds we must preserve the characteristics of the border and remain true to type. If the gene pool is too small in G.B. then hopefully this club will bring together working border owners from all over the world, theres a few here in Ireland, i remember a feature on borders workin badger in Finland, Digaman has seen 40 borders at earthdog trials in Hungary so perhaps the border is not a lost cause yet.

To Cleanspade you have some very good points but if we outcross we just end up with another crossbred terrier and have to breed back to what we started with. If we breed proven working border to proven workin border there should be no need to outcross, no litter will result in 100% workers but its a start.

And please lads drop the money topic its gettin tiresome, its only is an issue with lads that work other breeds, what is your prob,this club will be for owners of workin borders and if we were prepared to pay the goin rate to get into the breed [without whingin] thats our choice not yours.

Yes an i have seen more than 40 Jadgs at earthdog trials in Eastern Europe and in my opinion very few if any would make decent earth dogs in this part of the world ,definately wouldnt be the standard that i would want.